chinapig

Perhaps a "the dog ate our accounts" defence will be the next suggested grounds for appeal??

On the Derby forum there are still people arguing for an appeal on force majeure grounds.?

But a high risk you will never get your money back given the existing level of debt?

I see Wayne Rooney's Derby County's Wayne Rooney is not happy with Honest Mel Morris, former hero of Derby fans throughout the land ? https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/sep/23/derbys-wayne-rooney-hits-out-at-disrespectful-former-owner-mel-morris

Good section with Kieran Maguire in todays' Football Weekly Extra podcast: https://www.theguardian.com/football/audio/2021/sep/23/derby-county-carabao-cup-football-weekly-extra-podcast

So their responsibility is to the creditors yet they intend to pass up the opportunity to raise money through sales, in fact spend on new signings thus adding to the wage bill, and to borrow to pay those wages? In any event who is going to lend substantial sums to a club whose only asset is players, the value of which they refuse to realise? I don't see how the creditors benefit from this, though I am no expert of course.

I'm becoming a little confused (my default setting admittedly!). I saw a statement from the EFL that Derby had submitted their revised accounts before the deadline but the BBC reported that they had yet to be submitted. Though they may have meant submitted to Companies House perhaps. As to the agreed points deduction I have not seen any unequivocal statement that Derby had in fact agreed it and saw a report elsewhere that it now has to be negotiated with the administrators, who are unlikely to agree to it. We now have a bland statement from the EFL following administration but the facts of the case are still not clear - at least to me.

Essentially true imo. The problem was clubs being enable to comply with P&S by "selling" their stadium thanks to a loophole. I suspect they were positively encouraged to do so by a former head of the EFL. The gamble paid off in Villa's case but in Derby's case could yet be a factor in their being liquidated.

We'll have to agree to disagree perhaps. The modern history of the game is littered with successful businessmen who abandon their business principles once they own a football club. So they cannot always be trusted as custodians. Steve himself has been guilty of that at times. Most recently he talked about sustainability then allowed Ashton to increase the wage bill to unsustainable levels. Nigel is now having to fix that. I would argue that the first thing fans should care about is the long term survival of their club. That includes not encouraging owners to overspend to please the fans in pursuit of that dreadful phrase "chasing the dream". Which is what happened with Derby. Still, come January we will no doubt see some fans on here demanding Steve spend money and in some cases claiming that he uses P&S as an excuse for not doing so. Happily they seem to be in a minority though.

Fans have a share of responsibility if they keep demanding their club spends money it doesn't have. Some of our own fall into that category. More so Derby fans who cheered Morris on as he drove their club over a cliff.

Kieran Maguire has said that once Derby come out of administration MSD Holdings will have to be paid in full. Cocu and Keogh are football creditors so have to be paid in full as I understand it.

From Kieran Maguire in the Derby Telegraph "HMRC are now what is now referred to as a 'preferential creditor' which means they would have to be paid in full outstanding taxes which are owed."

As I understand it HMRC is a preferential creditor so has to be paid in full. Quite right too.

Looking at the Reading forum it seems that the majority accept that a points deduction is deserved and is down to mismanagement by their owner. No crowing that their owner was too clever for the EFL, unlike many Derby fans - until administration revealed that Morris was not the hero they thought he was.

A poster any Gashead would be prowd to hang on their wall then.?

Taking your figure at face value, it may have a bearing on the club going into Administration but I don't see how it is relevant to pre-Covid breaches of P&S.

Now now, I'm sure there was a rigorous process and he happened to be the standout candidate. And a good human.

Never mind Richard, even Nigel doesn't like to take credit. He will applaud the fans briefly from a distance but prefers to let the players take the credit for a win. But he will take responsibility for a loss.

Still doesn't seem to cross his mind. Still blaming the EFL for expecting him to play by the rules I see. How sad.

So you think a Chief Executive should be awarding himself a lap of honour? Is that normal do you think? And did he do the same after the thrashing by Bolton? Most people would expect a CEO to stick to doing CEO stuff surely? Unless I missed Ed Woodward doing a lap of honour after the West Ham game earlier. ? Still, I hope the kool aid tastes nice.?

From the Derby Telegraph: The initial deadline for the club to complete this progress was Wednesday, August 18, although the EFL has now said in a statement that "constructive discussions" have led to that deadline being extended to Tuesday, August 24.

Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive comes to mind. To think Morris and those Derby fans who cheered him on thought it was terribly clever. The Administrators are going to have a hell of a job untangling that web. Is there a real possibility that there will be no club to sell and that they could end up like Bury?

They'll hope the courts do it for them. I hear Wael has submitted a victim impact statement. ?

Does the embargo get dropped if the club comes out of administration? And, taking Reading's recruitment as an example, is an embargo entirely meaningful anyway?

According to the BBC Derby's wage bill went from £16m in 2014 to £47m in 2018. Now look at our accounts over the Ashton period to see how our wage bill ballooned. Steve was asleep at the wheel and we are now paying the price. Steve doesn't cheat like Morris but it's possible to sleep walk into FFP problems if you don't keep a tight control over costs.