cityloyal473 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 6 hours ago, spudski said: But like you point out...facts don't lie...we are where we are, even though we've dominated games. Dominating games makes no difference if you play so open and keep conceding. This^^ Domination means nothing without an end result. If we keep on "dominating" games between now and the end of the season, we will start next season in league 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 12 hours ago, Lov3y1991 said: But Derby are a top championship side Charlton aren't??????? Didn't think that one through did you? I would expect to beat a poor championship side at home. Wouldn't expect a win away from home against a team challenging for promotion. Middlesbrough ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 12 hours ago, 'keepuplino' said: Look on the bright side chaps, at least we'll be a big team in a small pond again next season :s Will we really If everyone gave up halfway through a race no-one would finish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 6 hours ago, spudski said: I agree...it is attractive to watch. But anyone can play attractive football and lose. It's finding a balance. Unfortunately all this attractive football leaves us open to conceding goals too easily. I honestly believe SC could turn our season around, with the players we have and a few additions, if we change the way we play. Buying in new players and still playing this system is not going to be the answer imho. We are conceding nearly 2 goals a game...that means we have to score 3 to win as it is. Which in my mind is complete madness...however attractive it looks. 4 wins from 23 games is not attractive...however way you look at it. You could look at more recent form of 4 losses from 10 games and many of the draws could easily be wins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 13 hours ago, Lov3y1991 said: It was ONE of my points and you seemed to take it as my only point as your football knowledge is obviously very small. Take a look at the top teams in this division and you count up how many play with a back 3. Then count up how many have two solid centre halves and see how they are doing in the division The league table does not lie. How many teams in the bottom half play with a back four as well.............. Formations don't win or lose games in our division, quality of players do though. The teams at the top have better quality than we do, simply because they are ( mostly) bigger clubs, with bigger support and probably a lot more money than we have. That's how football works in 2015, get used to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 14 hours ago, Lov3y1991 said: I like your point. But if you don't concede you can't lose. If your score 1 and don't concede you can't draw or lose. So can you really blame finishing as the only reason? But it was about the finishing. What should have been a lucky consolation goal for a team losing 3 or 4 nil ended up as the equaliser. I think our defence performed admirably and we kept searching for a second goal which was the right thing to do. Attempting to "shut up shop" and hold on to a one goal lead is a recipe for disaster, as the MK Dons game and numerous matches under Gary Johnson should tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhistleHappy Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 15 hours ago, Lov3y1991 said: Let me know exactly what you find crap then? I find it crap that we can't beat the worst side in the league at home when we had numerous good chances to kill the game off. Cotterill has no plan B so see a game off. If you don't take your chances you can have no complaints about not winning the game. It really is as simple as that. '...no plan B' There you go again talking 'rap' ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 6 hours ago, glos old boy said: You could look at more recent form of 4 losses from 10 games and many of the draws could easily be wins 'Could of'...? Could of means nothing Old Boy...with respect, I love your optimism...but you are ignoring the facts. We do seem to be 'dominating games'...but because of our set up, teams find it easy to score against us. Draws in the past, made so much difference, as they gave you 50%. Nowadays its 33%. 2 losses and 1 win....gives the same as 3 draws....it's about winning now. 2 wins in the last 10 games.... 16 goals conceded, 7 scored. Dominating games for 80 mins and not scoring and allowing the opposition to score in 10 mins....that's what it feels like. I'm all for playing expansive entertaining football...but there comes a time when you have to find a balance. Our system doesn't work...it's obvious to see by even the newest of football coaches...it's flawed. From what you have observed....do you honestly think this system will work over a season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchay Red Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 I know this is a big "bee in your bonnet" Spud, but yesterday was about poor finishing and no substitutions, not about our system, which was tearing them apart for a lot of the match. As I mentioned on another thread we are surrounded by teams not playing our system! So it doesn't work for them, why should it be any different for us should we try to change? No, we will succeed or fail sticking to what we know. Just now I'm thinking fail, but some new faces might just turn it round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 13 minutes ago, spudski said: 'Could of'...? Could of means nothing Old Boy...with respect, I love your optimism...but you are ignoring the facts. We do seem to be 'dominating games'...but because of our set up, teams find it easy to score against us. Draws in the past, made so much difference, as they gave you 50%. Nowadays its 33%. 2 losses and 1 win....gives the same as 3 draws....it's about winning now. 2 wins in the last 10 games.... 16 goals conceded, 7 scored. Dominating games for 80 mins and not scoring and allowing the opposition to score in 10 mins....that's what it feels like. I'm all for playing expansive entertaining football...but there comes a time when you have to find a balance. Our system doesn't work...it's obvious to see by even the newest of football coaches...it's flawed. From what you have observed....do you honestly think this system will work over a season? We will have to see, I will be very surprised if we don't bring in some new faces, hopefully permanently. We only had to take a couple more of our chances yesterday and todays posts would have been far different. Yes you could say its been the same for the season so far but we are really not far away from putting a decent run together, and you must agree with this? we are not "cut adrift" in fact 12points behind Cardiff in 8th. Do you really want to go back to the Dreary days of no hope, we are close, believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonphil Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 23 minutes ago, spudski said: 'Could of'...? Could of means nothing Old Boy...with respect, I love your optimism...but you are ignoring the facts. We do seem to be 'dominating games'...but because of our set up, teams find it easy to score against us. Draws in the past, made so much difference, as they gave you 50%. Nowadays its 33%. 2 losses and 1 win....gives the same as 3 draws....it's about winning now. 2 wins in the last 10 games.... 16 goals conceded, 7 scored. Dominating games for 80 mins and not scoring and allowing the opposition to score in 10 mins....that's what it feels like. I'm all for playing expansive entertaining football...but there comes a time when you have to find a balance. Our system doesn't work...it's obvious to see by even the newest of football coaches...it's flawed. From what you have observed....do you honestly think this system will work over a season? Believe it or not Charlton had more of the ball than we did yesterday..... I couldn't either but I understand perfectly the point you're making Only one team should have won the game but unfortunately we didn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonphil Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 18 hours ago, Robbored said: This is such a boring and dull topic ffs! We all know the fiasco over the summer and how it's affected our season. Cotterill simply mentions it frequently. Quite right to. Ok RR I'll bite - this is a 82 post thread and transfers have been mentioned twice (When talking about Cunningham) If you can't contribute anything articulate then don't contribute at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22A Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 Which is the real Bristol City this season; the one that beat Wolves, Forest & M'boro', or the one that lost at Rotherham and drew against Charlton? Is it a case of certain players pulling out all the stops against the big guys in the hope of securing a big money transfer away? If so, then no matter the quality of the Manager, the players are only playing for themselves. In September SC stated if Korey Smith had been playing the draws v MK and at Ipswich would have been victories. As he wasn't though proves the side needs strengthening now regardless of cost. The draws at Cardiff and home to Charlton though are no,t in my opinion, the Manager's fault. It wasn't SC who missed the open goal in Cardiff or hit the bar with a penalty kick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 55 minutes ago, ashtonphil said: Ok RR I'll bite - this is a 82 post thread and transfers have been mentioned twice (When talking about Cunningham) If you can't contribute anything articulate then don't contribute at all. You've missed the point ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 1 hour ago, Frenchay Red said: I know this is a big "bee in your bonnet" Spud, but yesterday was about poor finishing and no substitutions, not about our system, which was tearing them apart for a lot of the match. As I mentioned on another thread we are surrounded by teams not playing our system! So it doesn't work for them, why should it be any different for us should we try to change? No, we will succeed or fail sticking to what we know. Just now I'm thinking fail, but some new faces might just turn it round. Like I've said many times FR...and we've all seen it with our own eyes...we can dominate games. But we are too easy to open up...our GD proves that. I believe we have the quality here to be a mid table team...if we changed it slightly. I personally don't believe bringing in new faces will make much difference if we play the same way. The reason our finishing is poor...is because our players are snatching at chances, rather than being composed. That comes about because of the pressure they are now under to win. The more pressure, the less composed you become. I agree yesterday if the pen had gone in it would be different....but again...Pack was under more pressure to make it happen. Misses and chances go begging when you are under pressure to win and in a relegation battle. The no subs is down to SC...as is his instructions on how to play. He orchestrates the game plan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 1 hour ago, glos old boy said: We will have to see, I will be very surprised if we don't bring in some new faces, hopefully permanently. We only had to take a couple more of our chances yesterday and todays posts would have been far different. Yes you could say its been the same for the season so far but we are really not far away from putting a decent run together, and you must agree with this? we are not "cut adrift" in fact 12points behind Cardiff in 8th. Do you really want to go back to the Dreary days of no hope, we are close, believe. I can't agree with you mate...because I've seen nothing to think we will win games consistently. Like I said in numerous posts...we create chances but snatch at them. Because of the pressure the players are now under. If we continue in the same vein, the pressure increases and composure becomes less. There is hope...I think we have go a great bunch of players and some talent...a few new heads will obviously help share the workload. But I don't think we will fair any better unless we change our set up....or manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodEmperor Palpatine Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 7 minutes ago, spudski said: I can't agree with you mate...because I've seen nothing to think we will win games consistently. Like I said in numerous posts...we create chances but snatch at them. Because of the pressure the players are now under. If we continue in the same vein, the pressure increases and composure becomes less. There is hope...I think we have go a great bunch of players and some talent...a few new heads will obviously help share the workload. But I don't think we will fair any better unless we change our set up....or manager. 100% agree. Too many hard luck stories but no consistency.. some fans are veiling behind we have a poor squad yet we dont, its just threadbare. Derby aside, we have matched the top sides but its the allowing the opposition to come on to us when it looks like we are in the ascendency. Thats the players playing under SC's tactics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 2 hours ago, glos old boy said: We will have to see, I will be very surprised if we don't bring in some new faces, hopefully permanently. We only had to take a couple more of our chances yesterday and todays posts would have been far different. Yes you could say its been the same for the season so far but we are really not far away from putting a decent run together, and you must agree with this? we are not "cut adrift" in fact 12points behind Cardiff in 8th. Do you really want to go back to the Dreary days of no hope, we are close, believe. To be honest, I spent much of the first half of the season we went down feeling games could have gone differently and we weren't far from putting a run together. I remembered the early season wins over Cardiff and Palace, some decent performances against better sides and games where we were unlucky not to come away with a win or a draw. I saw we had decent players and I argued against sacking McInnes because I believed that, over time, improvements would surely arrive. It wasn't until the hammering by Leicester I realised I was completely wrong and by then we were deep in the mire. Maybe we are two or three games away from a decent run of form but it's felt like that all season and now it's halfway through the season, we're in the bottom three. We're on course to score less goals and win less games than we did that season under McInnes and O'Driscoll. There's only so long we can claim we're an unlucky team on the verge of looking good when the facts suggest we're a bottom three team on relegation form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonphil Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 1 hour ago, Robbored said: You've missed the point ......... Then please don't be cryptic.. I invite you to explain your point as I'm struggling to see any relevance at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciderbeans Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 Even the bloody egg chasers can keep a clean sheet at Ashton gate. Maybe we should play some of them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Red Planet Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 23 hours ago, slartibartfast said: Agree, he SHOULD OF kept quiet. Spot on Starbarti. I really can't be bothered to read anything written by someone who does not realise they are using the past tense which should be "would have" or "could have" or "should have" - or whatever. Having said that, I did have some issues with the game management on Saturday. It was a fully committed effort from all the City players who were very unlucky not to score. It was a very strange game - frenetic pace throughout. Loads of missed chances, more time wasting (by Charlton) than I have ever seen at a game and both goals scored by defenders ! Of course we should have won the game - we were dominant throughout - but why choose Pack to take our first penalty of the season (I believe) ? Surely Wilbrahim or Kodjia should have taken that ? And why leave Wilbrahim on the pitch to the end when he was obviously tiring ? Having said all that, I am still behind Cotterill - at least until January ! Let's see what happens at Burnley and Reading. Not optimistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 2 hours ago, ashtonphil said: Then please don't be cryptic.. I invite you to explain your point as I'm struggling to see any relevance at all I've forgotten the point I was making now......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slartibartfast Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 1 hour ago, The Red Planet said: Spot on Starbarti. I really can't be bothered to read anything written by someone who does not realise they are using the past tense which should be "would have" or "could have" or "should have" - or whatever. Having said that, I did have some issues with the game management on Saturday. It was a fully committed effort from all the City players who were very unlucky not to score. It was a very strange game - frenetic pace throughout. Loads of missed chances, more time wasting (by Charlton) than I have ever seen at a game and both goals scored by defenders ! Of course we should have won the game - we were dominant throughout - but why choose Pack to take our first penalty of the season (I believe) ? Surely Wilbrahim or Kodjia should have taken that ? And why leave Wilbrahim on the pitch to the end when he was obviously tiring ? Having said all that, I am still behind Cotterill - at least until January ! Let's see what happens at Burnley and Reading. Not optimistic. I'm pretty sure Wilbs and JK will be "rested " for the next game, so perhaps he thought leave well alone. We were doing more than ok up till the last 5 plus injury time. I thought it was one of our most dominant performances (albeit against totally rank opposition) and had we held out, most on here would be singing our praises . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 On 26/12/2015 at 18:13, Lov3y1991 said: I am sooooo fed up with hearing the same thing every weekend: "we should of won by 4 or 5". Well actually there is many reasons why we are NOT winning by 4 or 5! The referee is in no way to blame today at all. The truth is we didn't spend well in the summer. You cannot play with 3 at the back in the championship unless you have the 3 best defenders in the division. You need to know how to see games out I.e pressing on to score a second or shutting up shop. Cotterill does not understand how tactics can affect a game. He should of changed to 4 at the back from 80th minute onwards. We have too many players who aren't good enough for this level. What made me more angry than anything was cotterill shaking hands with every player by the tunnel at the end of the game. The players were as much to blame as he was and in my opinion need a massive dressing down for not seeing out the win. Change needed now before it's too late. We tried 8 at the back v Derby it failed, the best form of defence is attack; and we were very unlucky not to win by a hat full, another day.....soon it will be so. Sometimes you can try too hard and we did. I think Cotts may just know a bit more than most on here by the way. Didn't spend well in the summer hmmmm maybe you should ask the no doubt line of clubs who missed out on Kod about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireSection Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 On 26 December 2015 at 18:58, cityexile said: Gutted to hot win today, gutted it might actually be another relegation year.The point us today, unlike MK, we did push for the second. Nothing to do with how many at the back, just a succession or missed chances. Which is what we've got when we've got Wilbs, simply too old to play more than 45 mins at this level. Agard- league one at best. Burns, quick direct gets into great positions when he does play but can't get on the bench half the time. Cox, prem and champ quality goal scorer who will never get match fit sat on the bench for 85 minutes, so why waste money on wages. im too tired to dissect the mid field and defence and too be honest I'm starting to give up with SC, he's had his time, bring in Pearson or we will be using two stands met season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 10 hours ago, glos old boy said: We tried 8 at the back v Derby it failed, the best form of defence is attack; and we were very unlucky not to win by a hat full, another day.....soon it will be so. Sometimes you can try too hard and we did. I think Cotts may just know a bit more than most on here by the way. Didn't spend well in the summer hmmmm maybe you should ask the no doubt line of clubs who missed out on Kod about that? I don't think any club " missed out " on Kodjia . He was not signed by them , even after trials , presumably because they saw the faults in his game and did n't think he represented a good deal for them . We took a considerable gamble in signing him because Ligue 2 is nowhere near close to the quality of the Championship . It seems that ,for once , we've been lucky . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 6 minutes ago, Major Isewater said: I don't think any club " missed out " on Kodjia . He was not signed by them , even after trials , presumably because they saw the faults in his game and did n't think he represented a good deal for them . We took a considerable gamble in signing him because Ligue 2 is nowhere near close to the quality of the Championship . It seems that ,for once , we've been lucky . We could be in a lot worse situation than we are at the moment, we need to cut the players and manager some slack and ease the persistent sniping at them. They feel the pressure of our current situation too so we should back off and believe in them and they will also then believe in themselves. The Pack penalty shows what a fine line it is between success and failure........about 2inches... is how far away we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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