Life span of a first team coach

[Major Isewater]

Is there an optimum time to change a coach ?

These men devote so much of their lives to their jobs , nearly 24/7  how do they keep themselves fresh and on top of the task in hand ?

They can't ease up because the pressure is so high .

Do certain managers stay too long ?

Mick McCarthy and Wenger spring  to mind .

Clubs plan for the future for playing staff ? Do they also plan for coaches ? 

 

[Midlands Robin]

I guess it all depends on the success being achieved by that coach / manager.

Who at City for example, would have questioned Alan Dicks being moved on after 10 years? A couple of years after that however??

Football always has been results driven.

[ashton_fan]

There are plenty of examples of success where managers have been kept for a long time, eg Alex Ferguson at Man U, Dyche at Burnley and Eddie Howe at Bournemouth. We tried chopping and changing and it just messed up the squad and got us relegated so managerial change should be a last resort.

[swanker]

Steve Coppell didn’t stay long enough!

[BRISTOL86]

The time to change is when the ambition of the club exceeds the capabilities or perceived capabilities of the man in the hot seat. 

Of course that assumes that the ambition is realistic given the various inputs (ie no good sacking the Swansea manager for failing to get into the Champions League. A good example is Stoke learning the hard way that life under Pulis was about as good as it was likely to get but they insisted they could and should do better and will pay the price) 

[Bs4Red]

7 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

The time to change is when the ambition of the club exceeds the capabilities or perceived capabilities of the man in the hot seat. 

Of course that assumes that the ambition is realistic given the various inputs (ie no good sacking the Swansea manager for failing to get into the Champions League. A good example is Stoke learning the hard way that life under Pulis was about as good as it was likely to get but they insisted they could and should do better and will pay the price) 

Couldn’t agree more.

So many cases of clubs thinking the grass is greener. 

Southampton another big example of chopping in changing in recent seasons which has hindered all the hard work they’ve done to establish themselves. 

Arsenal is a big one that clearly the owners etc are happy with their position of being a European club but never challenging and generating good profit. 

With City I believe our fans expectations this season I higher than our owners. I think he’d be delighted with mid table as would many fans

[downendcity]

59 minutes ago, Bs4Red said:

Couldn’t agree more.

So many cases of clubs thinking the grass is greener. 

Southampton another big example of chopping in changing in recent seasons which has hindered all the hard work they’ve done to establish themselves. 

Arsenal is a big one that clearly the owners etc are happy with their position of being a European club but never challenging and generating good profit. 

With City I believe our fans expectations this season I higher than our owners. I think he’d be delighted with mid table as would many fans

I think this is one of the big issues this season.

After last season's losing run and then "escape" at the end of the season, I think most fans would have been delighted to see improvement this season and a mid table/slightly above mid table finish. Had our wins and losses been spread evenly though the season and we were challenging for a play off place ( as we are, although I use challenging very loosely!)  then I think most fans would have been absolutely delighted.

The fact the the first half of the season was so unexpectedly outstanding - and it was - expectations were raised to fever pitched levels, and in today's atmosphere of media hyperbole so many felt that we were nailed on for promotion, or that "all" the club had to do was go out and spend a few million on players to secure the ultimate prize. Oh that is was that easy.

As has been the case so often recently, we cannot manage consistency, so instead we lurch from sublime to ridiculous. As a result, some/many fans see a sublime period as indicative of us going on to great things, and the ridiculous as meaning catastrophe, implosion and relegation. 

From where we were before Christmas, the last 3 months have been very disappointing, and although I doubted that we could sustain performance and results to secure promotion, thought we would at least stay well in the play off places until the end of the season. Im just hoping that we pull ourselves together from now until the end of the season so that, even if we miss out on the play off places we go into the summer and next season with some momentum and can build again.

I'm a pessimistic optimist - or is it an optimistic pessimist? 

 

 

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Bs4Red said:

Couldn’t agree more.

So many cases of clubs thinking the grass is greener. 

Southampton another big example of chopping in changing in recent seasons which has hindered all the hard work they’ve done to establish themselves. 

Arsenal is a big one that clearly the owners etc are happy with their position of being a European club but never challenging and generating good profit. 

With City I believe our fans expectations this season I higher than our owners. I think he’d be delighted with mid table as would many fans

I think your spot on about SL, he was very happy about the cup run, and won't be overly disappointed about our current league position, and having sold a decent number of STs I just hope he loosens the purse strings a little more, we can still buy young players, just hopefully with a bit more pedigree and quality.

He can start by buying Tammy Abraham.

[Londoner]

Next season will be crunch of lj. No playoffs no future for him.

[marcofisher]

6 minutes ago, Londoner said:

Next season will be crunch of lj. No playoffs no future for him.

According to whom may I ask? Are you SL?

If all our best players are sold and we buy in some good young players in the mould of Brownhill and O'Dowda I wouldn't be expecting playoffs straight away. 

[Red 90]

You either die a hero, or live long enough to become the villain

[Maesknoll Red]

It hasn’t done Chelsea much harm, having a Manager revolving door.

[Buckeyed]

9 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

It hasn’t done Chelsea much harm, having a Manager revolving door.

I think it's how you measure success. 5th place and 28 points behind the leaders isn't looking too great for them.

[Maesknoll Red]

1 minute ago, Buckeyed said:

I think it's how you measure success. 5th place and 28 points behind the leaders isn't looking too great for them.

This season has been an exception by any standards, Man City running away with it.  I can't think of any of our fans who wouldn't like a record like Chelsea's over the last 18 years, 11 Managers and 15 trophies - it obviously works for them.

[IdliketoRogerMoore]

Ask peter carol!

[Rich]

I once read that on average, a manager is most successful in the first two years of his tenure. Obviously that's with a recognised fully qualified experienced manager. Not someone who's been in the professional football world all their working lives and then, learning their trade for the past four years as a rooky.

[Abraham Romanovich]

What I keep hearing is we are a work in progress /all about long term planning.

LJ himself has said judge me after 3 transfer windows - well he's had them now and in the long term we are all dead.

I think this season we have been really unlucky with injuries but this excuse has to be mitigated with his summer recruitment 

So in my opinion the question is  - Next season what is acceptable 

I would say anything less than a play off challenge would constitute failure- if this is not the case do we stick or twist

[wendyredredrobin]

With what has been going on since Christmas it is clear that Lee needs a little help in the coaching department and with his decision making. However, with 6 games left, I guess it is too late now.

[General Zod]

3 minutes ago, Abraham Romanovich said:

What I keep hearing is we are a work in progress /all about long term planning.

LJ himself has said judge me after 3 transfer windows - well he's had them now and in the long term we are all dead.

I think this season we have been really unlucky with injuries but this excuse has to be mitigated with his summer recruitment 

So in my opinion the question is  - Next season what is acceptable 

I would say anything less than a play off challenge would constitute failure- if this is not the case do we stick or twist

I’d be surprised if we make the playoffs next year as this year is/was our chance.  Too many things are out of our control to judge our success next season solely on a playoff place.  Personally an acceptable season for me will be LJ fathoming out a way of playing away from home, we have a plan B that is more than simply relying on hoofing the ball to a big target man and a long throw into the box, we play winning entertaining football at home more often than not, we see only an average bad run of form not the usual season/confidence destroyer and a few of the many signings for the future actually come good so that I see the ‘plan’ has merit.  Finally if we start next season the way we look like ending this one, I hope the board show some and properly consider if LJ is right for us.

[cidered abroad]

5 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

Is there an optimum time to change a coach ?

These men devote so much of their lives to their jobs , nearly 24/7  how do they keep themselves fresh and on top of the task in hand ?

They can't ease up because the pressure is so high .

Do certain managers stay too long ?

Mick McCarthy and Wenger spring  to mind .

Clubs plan for the future for playing staff ? Do they also plan for coaches ? 

 

Usually around 200,000 miles or when the engine needs replacing. 

Seriously, you can replace a head coach at any time if it's not performing up to standard. Ours is running on empty at the moment and should be replaced by the summer. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

6 hours ago, Major Isewater said:

Is there an optimum time to change a coach ?

These men devote so much of their lives to their jobs , nearly 24/7  how do they keep themselves fresh and on top of the task in hand ?

They can't ease up because the pressure is so high .

Do certain managers stay too long ?

Mick McCarthy and Wenger spring  to mind .

Clubs plan for the future for playing staff ? Do they also plan for coaches ? 

 

Major 

I can’t have you worrying about such things any longer

The Coach Used by Peter Carol for First Team Travel is a ‘Mercedes Tourismo K’

With average annual mileage the lifespan of this particular model is 6 working years

Pleae return to your glass of red with mind settled 

[Major Isewater]

9 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Major 

I can’t have you worrying about such things any longer

The Coach Used by Peter Carol for First Team Travel is a ‘Mercedes Tourismo K’

With average annual mileage the lifespan of this particular model is 6 working years

Pleae return to your glass of red with mind settled 

One of my mottos is ' resist the usual ' but you weren't to know that.

[Rich]

1 hour ago, cidered abroad said:

Usually around 200,000 miles or when the engine needs replacing. 

Seriously, you can replace a head coach at any time if it's not performing up to standard. Ours is running on empty at the moment and should be replaced by the summer. 

It will be refueled by the owner, as it has been throughout ownership.

[robin_unreliant]

5 hours ago, Maesknoll Red said:

It hasn’t done Chelsea much harm, having a Manager revolving door.

Or Watford. You need to be good at picking them though which SL hasn't been.

[JoeAman08]

5 hours ago, Londoner said:

Next season will be crunch of lj. No playoffs no future for him.

I am with you on this actually. Not so much no playoffs no future but if we don’t have a successful consistent season I will be a bit disappointed. Guess it depends on our summer recruitment and who goes. Though the sentiment is still the same. We can’t go on another poor run of form like this. 3 or 4 or 5 game run with some bad results happen but there can’t be another 12-15 game stretch of poor results like LJ’s last few years. 

I am almost more livid this season than last. Last season we were even more inexperienced and young. We were probably justifiably bad. This season we had a very competent squad and to go since Christmas with bottom 6 form is unacceptable. The lack of motivation and action from LJ is maddening in times of need. He has earned another season because it is an improvement but for me we need to be consistently good. Being erratic will never see us promoted. 

[cidered abroad]

I've agreed with most of what you said Joe, and but to give him another season to mess up at least 33% of the time, is definitely not warranted. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

16 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

I've agreed with most of what you said Joe, and but to give him another season to mess up at least 33% of the time, is definitely not warranted. 

Blimey - Would you replace him before next season  Cidered ?

 

[Guest robinbridge]

I saw the title and thought this was a thread about the Man City bus!

[cidered abroad]

5 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Blimey - Would you replace him before next season  Cidered ?

 

Yes. I don't want another three month run of abject failure. Two seasons are enough. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

3 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

Yes. I don't want another three month run of abject failure. Two seasons are enough. 

Understand that but I personally would want to understand what’s going wrong and be giving him another season to see how we go , with the caveat that if we started as poor as we are right now (I would hope and think we won’t) and certainly if we slid into another poor trough I’d be considering my options 

[Lrrr]

7 hours ago, Londoner said:

Next season will be crunch of lj. No playoffs no future for him.

So if we finish 7th next season he has no future? Get real, he'd need to drop us down to being below 15th for a season or two for his job to be in danger. We could finish out of the play offs and be in the top 10 and he'd be doing a good job all things considered if we don't increase our wage bill comparably to other teams. Stability at the higher end of the most competitive division in Europe would be good for the club. Not fans getting irritated about finishing in the top 10. 

[Lrrr]

6 hours ago, Maesknoll Red said:

It hasn’t done Chelsea much harm, having a Manager revolving door.

Helps when each manager gets around £150m to spend, Conte complaining this season about lack of backing having spent around £150m this season, bad choice of investment on his part more like it. 

[windmillhillred]

45 minutes ago, cidered abroad said:

Yes. I don't want another three month run of abject failure. Two seasons are enough. 

If another small budget championship team was 7th, following an incredible cup run, I reckon most people on here wpuld be incredulous that some fans were suggesting the manager should be sacked. Who would you replace him with?

[Mr Popodopolous]

13 minutes ago, windmillhillred said:

If another small budget championship team was 7th, following an incredible cup run, I reckon most people on here wpuld be incredulous that some fans were suggesting the manager should be sacked. Who would you replace him with?

I'd say a midtable type budget more like, but the point still stands in various ways.

[windmillhillred]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

I'd say a midtable budget more like, but the point still stands in various ways.

Yes good point.

[Davefevs]

47 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I'd say a midtable type budget more like, but the point still stands in various ways.

17th/18th highest budget in the Champ I believe.  Or 6th/7th lowest if you like

How much money we made this season from the cup run and improved gates, other revenue I don’t know, but it might move us towards mid table.

Off the top of my head, I thinks pretty safe to think that the following clubs have higher budgets;

Wolves

Cardiff

Villa

Fulham

Derby

Boro

Sheffield Wednesday 

Norwich

Leeds

Hull

Nottm Forest

QPR

Birmingham

Sunderland

Questionable: Reading, 

Thats 14/15 we’re behind.

[pillred]

12 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

17th/18th highest budget in the Champ I believe.  Or 6th/7th lowest if you like

How much money we made this season from the cup run and improved gates, other revenue I don’t know, but it might move us towards mid table.

Off the top of my head, I thinks pretty safe to think that the following clubs have higher budgets;

Wolves

Cardiff

Villa

Fulham

Derby

Boro

Sheffield Wednesday 

Norwich

Leeds

Hull

Nottm Forest

QPR

Birmingham

Sunderland

Questionable: Reading, 

Thats 14/15 we’re behind.

I can understand why a lot on your list have higher budgets than us but am struggling to think why Birmingham qpr reading or Cardiff would have are they sticking to ffp I doubt it.

[Mr Popodopolous]

18 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

17th/18th highest budget in the Champ I believe.  Or 6th/7th lowest if you like

How much money we made this season from the cup run and improved gates, other revenue I don’t know, but it might move us towards mid table.

Off the top of my head, I thinks pretty safe to think that the following clubs have higher budgets;

Wolves

Cardiff

Villa

Fulham

Derby

Boro

Sheffield Wednesday 

Norwich

Leeds

Hull

Nottm Forest

QPR

Birmingham

Sunderland

Questionable: Reading, 

Thats 14/15 we’re behind.

Thanks.

I always had, maybe last season, had our table down as a midtable type budget. Maybe I'm mixing budget and Wage bill- wage bill I always thought was, or might be, somewhere in the middle.

Qpr, Birmingham and Forest higher than us? We get bigger gates than QPR and Birmingham, and Forest had some FFP restrictions not that long ago if I recall so I'm not certain.

[Lrrr]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

Thanks.

I always had, maybe last season, had our table down as a midtable type budget. Maybe I'm mixing budget and Wage bill- wage bill I always thought was, or might be, somewhere in the middle.

Qpr, Birmingham and Forest higher than us? We get bigger gates than QPR and Birmingham, and Forest had some FFP restrictions not that long ago if I recall so I'm not certain.

 

7 minutes ago, pillred said:

I can understand why a lot on your list have higher budgets than us but am struggling to think why Birmingham qpr reading or Cardiff would have are they sticking to ffp I doubt it.

Just quoting both of you as you both put Brum, you did pay attention to their summer deals and how many players Harry brought in right? Was at least 14 in the summer and they're rumoured to be paying Jota £40,000 a week for context to our budget 

[Bryans Left Peg]

9 hours ago, Londoner said:

Next season will be crunch of lj. No playoffs no future for him.

I just don't have the words to express how much I like this post!

 

Haha, I typed in a load of z's to express how boring your post is and it defaulted to that. Well played OTIB. 

[pillred]

33 minutes ago, hodge said:

 

Just quoting both of you as you both put Brum, you did pay attention to their summer deals and how many players Harry brought in right? Was at least 14 in the summer and they're rumoured to be paying Jota £40,000 a week for context to our budget 

yes but how are they spending so ,we don't I assumed to stay within ffp, what I can't understand is if they can get away with it, why not us.

[Davefevs]

7 hours ago, pillred said:

I can understand why a lot on your list have higher budgets than us but am struggling to think why Birmingham qpr reading or Cardiff would have are they sticking to ffp I doubt it.

I think that’s the crux. They must be pushing FFP to its limits or gone over. All ex-Prem (not all recent enough to have parachute money) and with its raised expectations and wage bills and not necessarily backed up by income. 

I think Brighton lost £39m last year. I’ll check it out later   

[bcfcshorey]

I don't know why I thought this was a thread about the Man City team bus/coach getting mobbed on the way into Anfield....

[cidered abroad]

Jack Charlton always said four seasons max. 

First to identify the problems, second to sort, recruit and build, third for success and fourth as the one to realise one should get out before the slide. 

[Rich]

Budgets aren't everything but, they help sometimes, depends how they're used. You could have a large squad full of mediocre players, as we have on many occasions, or you can have a smaller squad of better players (as under Cotts} and topped up with a couple of all rounders. You could have a squad of quality players but, still can't play more than eleven at any one time. So a small good squad could compete with a large good squad. Keeping a large squad happy is problematic in itself as well. Obviously other factors come into it as well, such as injuries

I hate to say this but, we had quite a large budget and a large squad in 1989/90 compared to many competitors. A team with a much smaller budget beat us (by hook and by crook) to become champions. Rag bag Rovers they were known as, spit, cough, retch and spit again. 

It would appear to me that, the more players we have available, the more rotation and lack of continuity we have in the team.

[Davefevs]

15 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I think that’s the crux. They must be pushing FFP to its limits or gone over. All ex-Prem (not all recent enough to have parachute money) and with its raised expectations and wage bills and not necessarily backed up by income. 

I think Brighton lost £39m last year. I’ll check it out later   

Re Birmingham - Staff Budgets last Financial year £22.1m 

Re Reading - £27m

Re City - £17.8m

Birmingham’s 24.1% higher ‘budget’ than us last season.  Reading 52%.  Staggering isn’t it.

Who knows what this season will bring, but Brum brought in 14 players in the summer!  It would suggest to me that they have a significantly bigger budget than us.

Reading had £20m in tv and media.....we had £241k.  That £20m was the major difference in reversing a £15m loss the season before and a £4m profit last season.

So, I think just looking at two clubs who we might think have the same or even smaller budgets than us and playing with 25%-50% bigger budgets than us.

Gives you all some context as to where we are....little fish in a big pond!

a couple of others:

Derby - £31m for 15/16 season....not published 16/17 yet.

Sheffield Utd - £10m, Millwall £9.3m but both in League One.

Preston - £13m

 

 

[Davefevs]

Aston Villa last season.  Turnover £71m.....5 times ours, although that included £48m in Broadcasting (part of that will be parachute money).  Their wage budget is only £8.4m, which suggests that they are not accounting for it in the same way as other clubs mentioned above.

Norwich City (plc)who got relegated with Villa.  Turnover £75m....staff costs £55m.  Must mean Villa are accounting differently!!

Cardiff "amazing what Warnock has achieved on a tiny budget" City.  The myth destroyed.  Staff budget £29m....63% higher than ours.  £20m of their £27m revenue from tv / broadcasting (parachute - Guessing that’s paid out at the end of the season).  They made a £5m profit on players, but still racked up an £18m loss.

What do posters think when they start to see these numbers compared to ours?

[Davefevs]

8 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Re Birmingham - Staff Budgets last Financial year £22.1m 

Re Reading - £27m

Re City - £17.8m

Birmingham’s 24.1% higher ‘budget’ than us last season.  Reading 52%.  Staggering isn’t it.

Who knows what this season will bring, but Brum brought in 14 players in the summer!  It would suggest to me that they have a significantly bigger budget than us.

Reading had £20m in tv and media.....we had £241k.  That £20m was the major difference in reversing a £15m loss the season before and a £4m profit last season.

So, I think just looking at two clubs who we might think have the same or even smaller budgets than us and playing with 25%-50% bigger budgets than us.

Gives you all some context as to where we are....little fish in a big pond!

a couple of others:

Derby - £31m for 15/16 season....not published 16/17 yet.

Sheffield Utd - £10m, Millwall £9.3m but both in League One.

Preston - £13m

 

 

Correction, about £6.5m for us.  Makes more sense

[Mr Popodopolous]

7 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Aston Villa last season.  Turnover £71m.....5 times ours, although that included £48m in Broadcasting (part of that will be parachute money).  Their wage budget is only £8.4m, which suggests that they are not accounting for it in the same way as other clubs mentioned above.

Norwich City (plc)who got relegated with Villa.  Turnover £75m....staff costs £55m.  Must mean Villa are accounting differently!!

Cardiff "amazing what Warnock has achieved on a tiny budget" City.  The myth destroyed.  Staff budget £29m....63% higher than ours.  £20m of their £27m revenue from tv / broadcasting (parachute - Guessing that’s paid out at the end of the season).  They made a £5m profit on players, but still racked up an £18m loss.

What do posters think when they start to see these numbers compared to ours?

I think if Villa stay down, there's FFP issues on the horizon for them! Which can only help us...

However, your wider point- yeah in that context we are doing rather well with what we have! Though so too are Sheff Utd, Millwall, Preston!

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I think if Villa stay down, there's FFP issues on the horizon for them! Which can only help us...

You are right.  Shit or bust next season otherwise.  That’s why Norwich started to cut their cloth at Xmas, selling Prichard.  Maddison will go in the summer.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

You are right.  Shit or bust next season otherwise.  That’s why Norwich started to cut their cloth at Xmas, selling Prichard.  Maddison will go in the summer.

Interesting.

Could it even be a case of if they don't go up this season trouble for Villa? Maybe not fully trouble but some problems at least.

I read they couldn't even afford to commit to renewal of contracts next year, dunno if it's true though.

[BobBobSuperBob]

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

You are right.  Shit or bust next season otherwise.  That’s why Norwich started to cut their cloth at Xmas, selling Prichard.  Maddison will go in the summer.

Help them out by taking Hogan off their hands

Think he’d be a good fit for us

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Interesting.

Could it even be a case of if they don't go up this season trouble for Villa? Maybe not fully trouble but some problems at least.

I read they couldn't even afford to commit to renewal of contracts next year, dunno if it's true though.

Next season they get their final parachute payment....but you can fully expect them to have already used part / all of that in their budgeting of contracts since getting relegated.  

[Jack Dawe]

17 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Aston Villa last season.  Turnover £71m.....5 times ours, although that included £48m in Broadcasting (part of that will be parachute money).  Their wage budget is only £8.4m, which suggests that they are not accounting for it in the same way as other clubs mentioned above.

Norwich City (plc)who got relegated with Villa.  Turnover £75m....staff costs £55m.  Must mean Villa are accounting differently!!

Cardiff "amazing what Warnock has achieved on a tiny budget" City.  The myth destroyed.  Staff budget £29m....63% higher than ours.  £20m of their £27m revenue from tv / broadcasting (parachute - Guessing that’s paid out at the end of the season).  They made a £5m profit on players, but still racked up an £18m loss.

What do posters think when they start to see these numbers compared to ours?

I think the opportunity to play one of those in a one-off final for promotion is worth going for, because the pressure on Villa, or Cardiff, would be immense. And we know what pressure can do to people, funny things can  happen. And for us, it would be a free-ish hit. Nothing - well, nothing like - as much to lose. Go out and enjoy it, lads. It's got to be worth a shot?

Despite Villa's enormous turnover compared to ours, they are only a couple of wins and draws better than us this season and if we'd had less cup football then what would the gap be?

In a one-off final, Villa or Cardiff can only field eleven players at any one time, same as us. Worth getting involved in, I'd say. 

[Davefevs]

I agree....someone tell the players! 

[cidered abroad]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Aston Villa last season.  Turnover £71m.....5 times ours, although that included £48m in Broadcasting (part of that will be parachute money).  Their wage budget is only £8.4m, which suggests that they are not accounting for it in the same way as other clubs mentioned above.

Norwich City (plc)who got relegated with Villa.  Turnover £75m....staff costs £55m.  Must mean Villa are accounting differently!!

Cardiff "amazing what Warnock has achieved on a tiny budget" City.  The myth destroyed.  Staff budget £29m....63% higher than ours.  £20m of their £27m revenue from tv / broadcasting (parachute - Guessing that’s paid out at the end of the season).  They made a £5m profit on players, but still racked up an £18m loss.

What do posters think when they start to see these numbers compared to ours?

The financial figures do clearly highlight the difference between us and many of our competitors in this league. Thus, from a financial point of view, we are competing very well with them. Clubs like Burnley, Bournemouth, Huddersfield and even the WBA's, Wigan, Palace, Hull, Bolton have managed to get promotion from this league and stay in the Prem for differing lengths of time.

The frustrating thing from our point of view, is that apart from 1976 to 1980, we have never even made it up there even if we did a "Derby County" and came back down relegated before Christmas. Why does this seem to be a step too far for BCFC?

And the even more hurtful thing this season, is that we have proved that we can compete with the top clubs in the Championship until Christmas even witha smaller wage bill than many, to put four Premier clubs to the sword in the EFL and give Man City a very decent contest in a two legged semi final.

Only to now be suffering another annual dose of "Johnson Blight" with only fifteen points out of the last forty eight. 15 out of 48!

We can get influenza, shingles and pneumonia vaccines so why isn't there an antidote against this repetitive winter disease?

[BS4 on Tour...]

Well the Man City one took a right battering driving to Anfield so not that long I’d guess!

[BS4 on Tour...]

On 05/04/2018 at 00:37, hodge said:

 

Just quoting both of you as you both put Brum, you did pay attention to their summer deals and how many players Harry brought in right? Was at least 14 in the summer and they're rumoured to be paying Jota £40,000 a week for context to our budget 

Harry only signed 8 players permanently last summer - of those, 3 were free transfers and only 2 cost over £3m...

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Harry only signed 8 players permanently last summer - of those, 3 were free transfers and only 2 cost over £3m...

You’ll see I’ve done a fair bit of analysis of several Champ clubs annual reports and Brum were significantly higher budget than us last year.  Coupled with these signings, plus the loans, totting up wages, fees, loan fees, agent fees, I’m not sure what argument / statement you are trying to make.  Signings cover both loan and permanent imho.

1 hour ago, JamesBCFC said:

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/birmingham-city/transfers/verein/337/plus/0?saison_id=2017&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=s

9 permanent signings, a spend of over £15m plus whatever Vassell cost- rumoured price when we were linked was around £1.5m

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/bristol-city/transfers/verein/698/plus/0?saison_id=2017&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=s

Same transfer window, our spend was over £4m less before taking Vassell into account.

Yes, the Vassell one has a "?" Against it but rumoured to be around the value you mention.

[BS4 on Tour...]

2 hours ago, JamesBCFC said:

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/birmingham-city/transfers/verein/337/plus/0?saison_id=2017&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=s

9 permanent signings, a spend of over £15m plus whatever Vassell cost- rumoured price when we were linked was around £1.5m

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/bristol-city/transfers/verein/698/plus/0?saison_id=2017&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=s

Same transfer window, our spend was over £4m less before taking Vassell into account.

I wasn’t comparing Brum’s signings to ours, I was replying to a post that said Harry signed at least 14 players for Brum last summer....I replied I thought he’d only signed 8 - apparently I was one out...still nowhere near 14 .....

But thanks for your totally irrelevant reply....

[BS4 on Tour...]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

You’ll see I’ve done a fair bit of analysis of several Champ clubs annual reports and Brum were significantly higher budget than us last year.  Coupled with these signings, plus the loans, totting up wages, fees, loan fees, agent fees, I’m not sure what argument / statement you are trying to make.  Signings cover both loan and permanent imho.

I was simply replying to a post that said Harry signed at least 14 players for Brum last summer....I said I thought it was only 8 signings...looks like I was one out....but still nowhere near 14....that was all!

[Lrrr]

6 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

Harry only signed 8 players permanently last summer - of those, 3 were free transfers and only 2 cost over £3m...

Brought in loans too, can't imagine people like Jenkinson come cheap on loan. 

[BS4 on Tour...]

15 minutes ago, hodge said:

Brought in loans too, can't imagine people like Jenkinson come cheap on loan. 

One of his loan signings was a young lad from Everton called Liam Walsh...wonder what happened to him?! 

[Lrrr]

1 hour ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

One of his loan signings was a young lad from Everton called Liam Walsh...wonder what happened to him?! 

They probably paid his wages for half a season for barely playing him, if anything a good example of harry wasting their money.