1960maaan Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 9 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Looking increasingly likely. https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/17783753.amp/?__twitter_impression=true Magennis and Otzuner handed in their notice, but not accepted by Administrators. How does that work? We all moan that footballers have it easy, but in situations like this, they appear to be stuck. Saw a bit about this yesterday, this can't be legal surely , restriction of trade ? I thought that if a player hadn't been payed for 2 months they had the right to look for another club. Just looked on this site and it says, the standard PL contract gives 14 days as just cause. The Bolton case is up to about 20 weeks ! It also states there is little in the way of concrete rules as to how long a player has to go unpaid to be 'just cause'. I think the Administrators must be trying to keep the players on to make the Club more viable as a going concern. https://www.lawinsport.com/blog/john-shea/item/unpaid-players-wages-the-legal-position Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 47 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Looking increasingly likely. https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/17783753.amp/?__twitter_impression=true Magennis and Otzuner handed in their notice, but not accepted by Administrators. How does that work? We all moan that footballers have it easy, but in situations like this, they appear to be stuck. 7 senior players, 2 of which are goalkeepers. Can't even field a full team if one of the goalkeepers plays outfield! Let's be fair, they're not going to sign anybody any time soon, as nobody in their right mind would surely want to go there and not get paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtonboy Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 9 minutes ago, Taz said: 7 senior players, 2 of which are goalkeepers. Can't even field a full team if one of the goalkeepers plays outfield! Let's be fair, they're not going to sign anybody any time soon, as nobody in their right mind would surely want to go there and not get paid. Out of contract, no offers from anywhere else, like hundreds of pro players this summer! The will get players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 20 minutes ago, Ashtonboy said: Out of contract, no offers from anywhere else, like hundreds of pro players this summer! The will get players. But will they? They can't pay the ones they have regularly, what chance have they got with more players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Surely if they can`t fulfil their fixtures it will be far to late to have anything other than a 23 team league? Presumably one extra promoted from the league(s) below at the end of the season then? There will inevitably be a FC Wanderers of Bolton formed too I should think - what tier would they enter the pyramid at I wonder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy1968 Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 (edited) 55 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: Surely if they can`t fulfil their fixtures it will be far to late to have anything other than a 23 team league? Presumably one extra promoted from the league(s) below at the end of the season then? There will inevitably be a FC Wanderers of Bolton formed too I should think - what tier would they enter the pyramid at I wonder? Here's a selection of clubs and where they restarted: Chester - 8th tier Newport - 9th tier The real Wimbledon :) - 9th tier Aldershot - 9th tier So they might end up in the North West Counties Football League I've always had a soft spot for Bolton since they were our opponents in my first City game (1977/78 4-1 city) and were the 1986 Freight Rover Trophy runners up (can't remember who won that one). Be sad to see them go, and what a slow painful death if it does happen. Edited July 20, 2019 by Sleepy1968 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephjnr Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 What's the upshot of players walking before the nail is hammered? Surely it would be cheaper for the players to pay pennies of the pound to the admins in a suit than just hang around and bet that money will fall in the team's lap? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Geoff Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Talking on TS late last week Jim White was saying how Boltons training ground had been locked until recently, there is no hot water in the dressing rooms and it looks as though the owner Anderson has just abandoned the club. In Briz during the 70's it was either drop back or rush goalies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slacker Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Sir Geoff said: Talking on TS late last week Jim White was saying how Boltons training ground had been locked until recently, there is no hot water in the dressing rooms and it looks as though the owner Anderson has just abandoned the club. In Briz during the 70's it was either drop back or rush goalies. It might be in rush backs in Bolton in 2919 too! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOTBLUE Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 21 minutes ago, Slacker said: It might be in rush backs in Bolton in 2919 too! No chance,it’ll be drop back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 31 minutes ago, Slacker said: It might be in rush backs in Bolton in 2919 too! They're struggling to last to the end of 2019 but by 2919 FIFA might allow rush back keepers with a whole new set of VAR rules to accommodate it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 20 hours ago, Ashtonboy said: Out of contract, no offers from anywhere else, like hundreds of pro players this summer! The will get players. How? They can’t pay them 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candygram for mongo Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 On 18/07/2019 at 14:20, Rudolf Hucker said: Bolton? Don’t change the subject, Rob! In St George it was drop backs - never heard of rush backs until I played 5-a-side with Essex boys many years later. Mind you, we never got out of St George much! Did you play on the top of St George’s Park using the trees as goal posts like we did (late 60’s, early 70’s) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 29 minutes ago, candygram for mongo said: Did you play on the top of St George’s Park using the trees as goal posts like we did (late 60’s, early 70’s) I did indeed. You would have recognised me - I was Jimmy Greaves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtonboy Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Monkeh said: How? They can’t pay them We were on our arses in 1982, yet youth and hope got us through, as has dozens of clubs since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22A Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 On 20/07/2019 at 15:54, Taz said: 7 senior players, 2 of which are goalkeepers. Can't even field a full team if one of the goalkeepers plays outfield! Let's be fair, they're not going to sign anybody any time soon, as nobody in their right mind would surely want to go there and not get paid. Seven players means they can start games; http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/lawsandrules/laws/football-11-11/law-3---the-players A match is played by two teams, each with a maximum of eleven players; one must be the goalkeeper. A match may not start or continue if either team has fewer than seven players. However; If a team has fewer than seven players because one or more players has deliberately left the field of play, the referee is not obliged to stop play and the advantage may be played, but the match must not resume after the ball has gone out of play if a team does not have the minimum number of seven players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 58 minutes ago, 22A said: Seven players means they can start games; http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/lawsandrules/laws/football-11-11/law-3---the-players A match is played by two teams, each with a maximum of eleven players; one must be the goalkeeper. A match may not start or continue if either team has fewer than seven players. However; If a team has fewer than seven players because one or more players has deliberately left the field of play, the referee is not obliged to stop play and the advantage may be played, but the match must not resume after the ball has gone out of play if a team does not have the minimum number of seven players. As proven when a Warnock side ends up with 6. There is a longer version on YouTube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chivs Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 On 18/07/2019 at 08:34, CyderInACan said: Whitchurch. Either Rush-Back (anyone could be the goalie) or Drop-Back (the goalie could play wherever they wanted but was the goalie nonetheless) Well. That's how I remember it anyway! Don't forget good old next goal wins too mind! I didn't grow up. "rush backs" is how I remember it. Anyone could be the goalie but the person nearest the jumpers was the goalie. That is, you couldn't randomly decide to use your hands just because... Never heard of "drop back" goalies. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City1984 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bristol Rob said: As proven when a Warnock side ends up with 6. There is a longer version on YouTube. Cracking strike from our del boy there. Was right in the thick of it. I liked del. Had many a good times with him during his time with us. Nice guy in my experience and glad he's doing well. Edited July 21, 2019 by City1984 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swede Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 On 14/07/2019 at 07:32, Miah Dennehy said: The more football becomes about money , the more this will happen. I wouldn't blame the fans, but I suspect there were a fair amount of them demanding that the chairman 'splashed the cash' in order to keep up with the Joneses, it happens at every club. I guarantee you that during the course of the upcoming season there will be a fair few demanding that Lansdown gets his hand in his pocket, they would do well to remember 1982. That's hardly ever likely with your owner. I hear he peels oranges in his pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Swede said: That's hardly ever likely with your owner. I hear he peels oranges in his pocket. He has them peeled for him at their London office. it gives the staff something to do to occupy their time. Edited July 21, 2019 by Red Right Hand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 51 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: He has them peeled for him at their London office. it gives the staff something to do to occupy their time. Has anyone been able to find out why that exists and what are they getting for the quarter of a million pounds a year they are supposedly spending on it? Nothing to do with Jaffas I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 minute ago, wendyredredrobin said: Has anyone been able to find out why that exists and what are they getting for the quarter of a million pounds a year they are supposedly spending on it? Nothing to do with Jaffas I think. Best I can come up with is it`s somewhere Wally can say he`s visiting when he goes to watch his first love at Stamford Bridge - probably means he can claim the petrol money there and back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 20 hours ago, Ashtonboy said: We were on our arses in 1982, yet youth and hope got us through, as has dozens of clubs since. Yea and 8 highly paid player tore up their contracts BOLTON CANT PAY THEIR WAGES professional players will not play for nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderingred Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 (edited) I think this is going to finally be the time when a major football club goes pop. It's been coming for years Edited July 22, 2019 by Wanderingred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 13 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said: Has anyone been able to find out why that exists and what are they getting for the quarter of a million pounds a year they are supposedly spending on it? Nothing to do with Jaffas I think. Car park spaces in Central London. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtonboy Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 5 hours ago, Monkeh said: Yea and 8 highly paid player tore up their contracts BOLTON CANT PAY THEIR WAGES professional players will not play for nothing Ok Monkeh, no need to shout! my point is that this is not a unique situation. Football is unique in that far more tolerance is given to "companies"in this situation. A retailer would now be closed and history. A way out will be found even if Bolton have to take the pain of several steps backwards. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ska Junkie Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 Do clubs still have to secure their ‘golden ticket’ from the EFL? The one that shows they can comply with all financial requirements for the following season. I assume Bolton cannot comply going forward so would be expelled? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 22, 2019 Share Posted July 22, 2019 7 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said: Do clubs still have to secure their ‘golden ticket’ from the EFL? The one that shows they can comply with all financial requirements for the following season. I assume Bolton cannot comply going forward so would be expelled? Yes, they have to show they will be able to fulfil their fixtures. Mind you, this is the EFL, a note from their Mum will probably do. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22A Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 I watched BBC North West news tonight. Bury had entered a Voluntary Agreement where football creditors would be paid in full and non football creditors a %age of what they were owed. The club has not proved to the EFL the funds to do so actually exist, so risk expulsion from the League. Matters are compounded by a winding up order from HMRC due to be heard on July 31st. This has already been deferred a few times, so this may well be the last week of Bury's existence. The EFL does not want them to start but be unable to complete their fixtures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, 22A said: I watched BBC North West news tonight. Bury had entered a Voluntary Agreement where football creditors would be paid in full and non football creditors a %age of what they were owed. The club has not proved to the EFL the funds to do so actually exist, so risk expulsion from the League. Matters are compounded by a winding up order from HMRC due to be heard on July 31st. This has already been deferred a few times, so this may well be the last week of Bury's existence. The EFL does not want them to start but be unable to complete their fixtures. Indeed, I read this earlier: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/jul/25/efl-warns-bury-league-one-fixtures-could-be-suspended A real chance they could be expelled. Which will of course lead to the EFL getting its act in order and ensuring that its clubs are run in a financially sustainable way. Or possibly not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted July 25, 2019 Admin Share Posted July 25, 2019 Blimey sounds serious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 32 minutes ago, chinapig said: Indeed, I read this earlier: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/jul/25/efl-warns-bury-league-one-fixtures-could-be-suspended A real chance they could be expelled. Which will of course lead to the EFL getting its act in order and ensuring that its clubs are run in a financially sustainable way. Or possibly not. The EFL seem to find it so much easier to deal with the financial issues of Bury then those of Sheffield Wednesday, , Villa or Derby. Wonder why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said: The EFL seem to find it so much easier to deal with the financial issues of Bury then those of Sheffield Wednesday, , Villa or Derby. Wonder why? If you are suggesting it is run for the benefit of a minority of big clubs then I'm shocked. Surely nobody could believe such a thing of an organization of which Shaun Harvey was the custodian? It is like suggesting that Boris Johnson is a proven liar for heaven's sake. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 43 minutes ago, chinapig said: Indeed, I read this earlier: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/jul/25/efl-warns-bury-league-one-fixtures-could-be-suspended A real chance they could be expelled. Which will of course lead to the EFL getting its act in order and ensuring that its clubs are run in a financially sustainable way. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 10 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said: The EFL seem to find it so much easier to deal with the financial issues of Bury then those of Sheffield Wednesday, , Villa or Derby. Wonder why? Probably because the likes of Bury can't afford the level of professional financial and legal advice that can clubs like Vila, Derby etc. so they won't embroil the EFL in tricky and embarrassing legal action that would probably show up the flaws in the EFL rules and administration. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elruliri Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 I've always been fond of Bolton due to the fact we always seemed to beat them in the 80's. And of course that day at at Wembley in 1986. Perhaps we could help them out with some of our fringe players, it would definitely harden them up with a backs against the wall sort of attitude. It made men of Newman and llewellyn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Feel sad for their fans, but I actually think we need to see a historical “big club” go. They have been mis-managed for a good few years now, mis-spent whilst in the Prem, and promotion in 17/18 in effect depriving another club a promotion. It’s harsh, but football and the EFL (and PFA) need to get a serious grip. There’s more than a football club at stake here, lots of creditors, who might also go to the wall because of Bolton too. Suspect they did business with Bolton in good faith. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 3 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Feel sad for their fans, but I actually think we need to see a historical “big club” go. They have been mis-managed for a good few years now, mis-spent whilst in the Prem, and promotion in 17/18 in effect depriving another club a promotion. It’s harsh, but football and the EFL (and PFA) need to get a serious grip. There’s more than a football club at stake here, lots of creditors, who might also go to the wall because of Bolton too. Suspect they did business with Bolton in good faith. I'm inclined to agree, except football, and especially the football media, has lost any sense of its history. After all, the game began in 1992. If Bury went there would be a few crocodile tears then it would be quickly back to talking what Paul Pogba has posted on Instagram. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Just now, chinapig said: I'm inclined to agree, except football, and especially the football media, has lost any sense of its history. After all, the game began in 1992. If Bury went there would be a few crocodile tears then it would be quickly back to talking what Paul Pogba has posted on Instagram. I know, it really needs a Prem club to go bust. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, Davefevs said: I know, it really needs a Prem club to go bust. Preferably Villa. Please. 8 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 39 minutes ago, Elruliri said: It made men of Newman and llewellyn It made a furniture removal man of Mark Little. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 THE cost of rescuing Bolton Wanderers as a going concern could hit the £1million mark, according to a report released by administrators at the club. It is currently estimated that the services of David Rubin and Partners, who were placed in charge of the club’s sale, and their associated consultants, will reach £976,113. Administrators claim to have written off £20,761 in costs incurred prior to their appointment on May 13 but up to July 5 had racked up a bill of £560,951, at an average charge of £357 per hour. It is claimed a total 1,570 man hours – or roughly 65-and-a-half days - have been expended by administrators in the report, with rates ranging between £150 per hour for cashiers and assistants to £550 for seniors or managing partners. Fees will only be paid to the administrators at the end of the process, although a number of professional consultants have been paid monthly. A monthly fee of £30,000 has been paid to Consulting Logistics, a company whose registered offices are in Billericay, Essex. Among their directors is Keith Cousins, the former Rushden and Diamonds owner who was brought aboard to help with transfers and contracts. His correspondence address at Companies House is in Geneva, Switzerland. According to the report, Consulting Logistics are due significant payments at the end of the sale process, which are currently estimated at £480,800. It goes on to say that total costs will be around £1.5 million 1 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 2 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said: THE cost of rescuing Bolton Wanderers as a going concern could hit the £1million mark, according to a report released by administrators at the club. It is currently estimated that the services of David Rubin and Partners, who were placed in charge of the club’s sale, and their associated consultants, will reach £976,113. Administrators claim to have written off £20,761 in costs incurred prior to their appointment on May 13 but up to July 5 had racked up a bill of £560,951, at an average charge of £357 per hour. It is claimed a total 1,570 man hours – or roughly 65-and-a-half days - have been expended by administrators in the report, with rates ranging between £150 per hour for cashiers and assistants to £550 for seniors or managing partners. Fees will only be paid to the administrators at the end of the process, although a number of professional consultants have been paid monthly. A monthly fee of £30,000 has been paid to Consulting Logistics, a company whose registered offices are in Billericay, Essex. Among their directors is Keith Cousins, the former Rushden and Diamonds owner who was brought aboard to help with transfers and contracts. His correspondence address at Companies House is in Geneva, Switzerland. According to the report, Consulting Logistics are due significant payments at the end of the sale process, which are currently estimated at £480,800. It goes on to say that total costs will be around £1.5 million Perverse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 All coming to a head for Bury it seems. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49133556 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchay Red Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 3 hours ago, Red Right Hand said: All coming to a head for Bury it seems. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49133556 Looking like they could soon be dead and Bury'd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Red Right Hand said: All coming to a head for Bury it seems. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49133556 Real shame, got to feel for the supporters who have decades invested in their club. Edited July 27, 2019 by Bristol Rob 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 (edited) looks like both clubs have until 17:00 to prove they can finance the season, Could we see 2 clubs expelled before the season kicks off? https://lionofviennasuite.sbnation.com/2019/7/28/8934142/bolton-wanderers-what-have-we-become Edited July 29, 2019 by Monkeh 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappers Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Thanks for posting, an excellent read. Really glad that we have a committed and prudent owner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 In light of the various issues raised in the ffp thread, this section is especially pertinent. And what a background Anderson had. In the 1980s Anderson worked as a used car salesman, getting himself a criminal conviction for selling second hand Nissan cars as new. In the 1990s he was running pubs and restaurants, closing them down after evading tax and not paying suppliers. He got 18 failed companies under his belt before finally getting a directors ban for being an unfit person. Anderson also worked for a few years with Vantis, a firm of accountants later shut down for money laundering and aiding and abetting VAT fraud. As if that wasn’t enough, Anderson had less than favourable comments about his dealings in the football world, primarily involving attempted takeovers at both Southampton and Liverpool. Would the leopard change his spots at Bolton? Shaun Harvey and the EFL thought so, bygones were bygones and so Bolton had new last minute owners, confirmed ironically enough at a club winders court appearance for unpaid HMRC taxes. What followed was a three year master class on how to exploit an environment of slack regulation and incompetence, applied in true brinkmanship style, with a couldn’t care less as to the consequences attitude of someone with little or no skin in the game. Forget for a minute the questions it raises about the criteria on which an owner is judged fit and proper ( or whatever term is now used). The fact that Bolton's financial demise has occurred over a period of time during which the EFL made the financial rules more stringent, must give cause for concern. In particular, and has many have commented on our own ffp thread, the highlighted section of the article is especially telling and damning. The very rules that are meant to safeguard clubs against profligate and reckless owners, appear to be only loosely applied when it suits the EFL's need to be flexible when dealing with the big and powerful but useless when really needed. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Chappers said: Thanks for posting, an excellent read. Really glad that we have a committed and prudent owner. Will those of our fans who demand that we spend money we don't have and accuse Steve of using FFP as an excuse take note I wonder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 8 minutes ago, chinapig said: Will those of our fans who demand that we spend money we don't have and accuse Steve of using FFP as an excuse take note I wonder? The club is owned by Steve who has shedloads of money unlike the people involved at either Bury or Bolton. Mel Morris has stuck two fingers up at FFP legally it appears.and whilst I don't see many demanding that Steve splashes the cash (i'm certainly not), the fact is whether you like it or not, he could if he really wanted to. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Is the John Pelling mentioned in the article the same John Pelling once of this parish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Loon plage said: The club is owned by Steve who has shedloads of money unlike the people involved at either Bury or Bolton. Mel Morris has stuck two fingers up at FFP legally it appears.and whilst I don't see many demanding that Steve splashes the cash (i'm certainly not), the fact is whether you like it or not, he could if he really wanted to. I'm afraid not, FFP is designed to prevent owners simply pouring their money directly into fees and wages. Steve has done that in the past and it ended in relegation. Phil Gartside did the same at Bolton and look at the state they are in. If you were a Bolton fan would you have been cheering him on? Morris isn't a good example as he gambled and failed. Not a role model for anybody I would think. Of course if you aren't bothered if we get into financial trouble again and have to sell assets to pay the bills that's a different matter. Personally I prefer a more responsible approach that doesn't put the club at risk. Edited July 29, 2019 by chinapig 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 35 minutes ago, Loon plage said: The club is owned by Steve who has shedloads of money unlike the people involved at either Bury or Bolton. Mel Morris has stuck two fingers up at FFP legally it appears.and whilst I don't see many demanding that Steve splashes the cash (i'm certainly not), the fact is whether you like it or not, he could if he really wanted to. You say that, but it was only last week people were saying we should spend 12 million on a striker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 29 minutes ago, chinapig said: I'm afraid not, FFP is designed to prevent owners simply pouring their money directly into fees and wages. Steve has done that in the past and it ended in relegation. Phil Gartside did the same at Bolton and look at the state they are in. If you were a Bolton fan would you have been cheering him on? Morris isn't a good example as he gambled and failed. Not a role model for anybody I would think. Of course if you aren't bothered if we get into financial trouble again and have to sell assets to pay the bills that's a different matter. Personally I prefer a more responsible approach that doesn't put the club at risk. Silly response you should read posts more carefully I said Steve could spend if he wanted to but I wasn't one of those asking for it. He most certainly did not spend big in the past just allowed a succession of crap managers to spend badly. I suspect Derby will finish above us next season incidentally and Morris is in for the long haul so missing promotion in May 19 isn't a disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 15 minutes ago, Monkeh said: You say that, but it was only last week people were saying we should spend 12 million on a striker £12m isn't mental for a champ striker nowadays i'm afraid for any team aspiring to reach the promised land. Not saying he should spend that, but if he wanted to he most certainly could. Comparing Bury and Bolton owners to ours was plain daft in my opinion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Loon plage said: £12m isn't mental for a champ striker nowadays i'm afraid for any team aspiring to reach the promised land. Not saying he should spend that, but if he wanted to he most certainly could. Comparing Bury and Bolton owners to ours was plain daft in my opinion. Mostly agree with this Loon- but it will be interesting to see if the cooling of the market this summer in the Championship (to date) is a bit of a one off or a sign of things to come. Championship strikers and prolific ones to PL or top 4-5 European League clubs yeah- Championship proven or equivalent standard from another League to Championship- that might take a bit of a dip for a while, if this summer anything to go by. Highest fees paid for Zohore and Kalas, around £8-8.5m range- so far of course. Loans, or loans with options/obligations to buy or clever free transfers seem to be kicking in a bit more. Edited July 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 13 minutes ago, Loon plage said: Silly response you should read posts more carefully I said Steve could spend if he wanted to but I wasn't one of those asking for it. He most certainly did not spend big in the past just allowed a succession of crap managers to spend badly. I suspect Derby will finish above us next season incidentally and Morris is in for the long haul so missing promotion in May 19 isn't a disaster. My mistake, apologies. Derby are a bit of an unknown, depending on what players they bring in, having lost their loanees. Morris has been gambling on promotion for more than the one season mind you. It is the cumulative effect of that that led to the ground sale to get them out of a hole of his making. If he gambles again and fails he doesn't have that fall back any more. It will be interesting to see how it pans out this year. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Loon plage said: £12m isn't mental for a champ striker nowadays i'm afraid for any team aspiring to reach the promised land. Not saying he should spend that, but if he wanted to he most certainly could. Comparing Bury and Bolton owners to ours was plain daft in my opinion. My comparison was with Phil Gartside, very much Bolton's Steve Lansdown at the time, who poured a fortune into the club but with an unsustainable model. He was both their benefactor and their downfall. Edited July 29, 2019 by chinapig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 2 minutes ago, chinapig said: My mistake, apologies. Derby are a bit of an unknown, depending on what players they bring in, having lost their loanees. Morris has been gambling on promotion for more than the one season mind you. It is the cumulative effect of that that led to the ground sale to get them out of a hole of his making. If he gambles again and fails he doesn't have that fall back any more. It will be interesting to see how it pans out this year. You could well be right about Morris but I would be pleased to finish above them next season personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 1 minute ago, chinapig said: My comparison was with Phil Gartside, very Fair do's mate Not one of my favourite football people, and I recall with fondness when Martin Samuel ripped him a new one when he started promoting the idea of ringfencing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 21 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Mostly agree with this Loon- but it will be interesting to see if the cooling of the market this summer in the Championship (to date) is a bit of a one off or a sign of things to come. Championship strikers and prolific ones to PL or top 4-5 European League clubs yeah- Championship proven or equivalent standard from another League to Championship- that might take a bit of a dip for a while, if this summer anything to go by. Highest fees paid for Zohore and Kalas, around £8-8.5m range- so far of course. Loans, or loans with options/obligations to buy or clever free transfers seem to be kicking in a bit more. Apart from the odd blunder we are getting better in the market I feel, so hope that LJ maybe has a gem or two still to amaze us with ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Just now, Loon plage said: Fair do's mate Not one of my favourite football people, and I recall with fondness when Martin Samuel ripped him a new one when he started promoting the idea of ringfencing. Yes, a desperate move on his part precisely because he knew the financial danger he had created. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natchfever Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 2 minutes ago, chinapig said: Yes, a desperate move on his part precisely because he knew the financial danger he had created. Indeed. We got an honorable mention in that article which is why it sticks with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanburyRed Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 So, Bolton game is on @ Wycombe, but Bury vs MK Dons is suspended.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Bolton have just got to sign a team now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 6 minutes ago, BanburyRed said: So, Bolton game is on @ Wycombe, but Bury vs MK Dons is suspended.... Looks like it. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49156362 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanburyRed Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 4 minutes ago, Northern Red said: Bolton have just got to sign a team now. Vernon and Peter Kay up front.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 6 minutes ago, BanburyRed said: Vernon and Peter Kay up front.... "'ave it!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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