Up The City! Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 To top it off they have also been thrown out of this season's Fa Cup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 30 minutes ago, CodeRed said: Steve Dale (who passed the fit and proper owner test) commenting on their expulsion on BBC: "I never went to Bury. It’s not a place I frequented,’ Dale told 5 Live. ‘So for me to walk away from Bury and never go back is a very easy thing to do. ‘I don’t do anything up there. I didn’t even know there was a football team called Bury to be honest with you. ‘I’m not a football fan.’ .... and here it is - it makes me so angry ... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old_eastender Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 On 26/08/2019 at 19:17, MarcusX said: Do we just say this every time a club goes under, until the next time? Nothing’s changing within football and if anything the spending/gambling on promotion is getting more reckless My point was since 1992, 27 years ago, there have been many instances of EFL clubs going to the brink, but then a late rescue deal comes in and they survive. So perhaps, now it has actually happened, it may help to bring about a stark reminder that not every time can the rod be pulled from the fire, which might help silly financial risks being taken in future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 An international consortium has £7m in the bank and is ready to complete a takeover of Bury, if the EFL agrees to reinstate the club, Sky Sports News understands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) The only surefire way to solve it- and I mean surefire- is to ensure clubs cannot make a loss of any kind, save for infrastructure investments that can't be clawed back by a chairman whose interest wanes. Break Even save for infrastructure etc or NO license. Problem is, who would vote for that? @Super That's really spookily similar to Accrington 1962 if accurate, having done a bit of reading into that- Football League didn't do the right thing in 1962 with that potential offer... Back to now, this might be the story I linked earlier developing I think. Hope somehow it will work for Bury! Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Up The City! said: For me Bristol City is more than just a football club. My father passed away when I was very young so I never really had a relationship with him. He was a huge Bristol City fan. So when I was old enough to start attending games I suddenly felt as if I had rediscovered some sort of relationship with him. I grew up on a council estate, times were hard, I suffered unimaginable bullying, going to Ashton Gate every other week was my escape, the bullies happened to be Rovers fans! I've lost friends, family members etc and been through various roblems in life. I'm living a rather settled and content life these days, I don't know how much Bristol City has played a part in that but I'm sure it's played it's part. I sadly lost my mother this March. We went on a mini run after her death which really helped. I remember the first home game since her death at home to Wigan. I remember being there and feeling as if everything had changed but at the same time nothing had changed, that was quite a reassuring feeling to have. When we scored our two goals that day I cried. My mother is now burried at South Bristol Cemetery so going to Ashton Gate now has a far deeper meaning, as you can see Ashton Gate from her grave I now feel as if she is watching down on me and us. My connection to Bristol City suddenly feels much stronger. I sound a bit silly don't I but the one constant in my life has and hopefully always will be, is Bristol City FC. It is more than just a football club. I share my story because it's not a unique story to me, every single football fan will have their own stories. I saw on the news earlier people talking about their parents ashes being scattered on the Gigg Lane pitch and that really hit me because they got out of going to Bury games what I get out of going to Bristol City games, and I know how I would feel if I ever lost that so I can really feel their pain. I love your passion for Bristol City that comes through very clearly from your words and the obvious importance of our club to your life ... so, given that, I still just can’t understand your support for football clubs merging with others that you’ve set out a couple of times earlier in this thread. It seems a contradictory stance after the great stuff you’ve written above ... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sturman 1 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, Super said: An international consortium has £7m in the bank and is ready to complete a takeover of Bury, if the EFL agrees to reinstate the club, Sky Sports News understands. I hope this comes to light but I can imagine the EFL declining stating a deadline was set and we are sticking by our decision... here's to hoping the EFL use some common sense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Sturman 1 said: I hope this comes to light but I can imagine the EFL declining stating a deadline was set and we are sticking by our decision... here's to hoping the EFL use some common sense! Didn't in 1962 with Accrington- more enlightened times now? IF bona fide, worth one more crack I think. Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 5 minutes ago, Sturman 1 said: I hope this comes to light but I can imagine the EFL declining stating a deadline was set and we are sticking by our decision... here's to hoping the EFL use some common sense! I’m not sure. The company’s common sense would’ve been to turn up this time yesterday... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 17 minutes ago, Robin1988 said: I’m not sure. The company’s common sense would’ve been to turn up this time yesterday... It was a last ditch bid it appears. Plus of course, the chance to try to get the best possible price, debt reduction, desperation etc etc- bit of brinkmanship thrown in there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: It was a last ditch bid it appears. Plus of course, the chance to try to get the best possible price, debt reduction, desperation etc etc- bit of brinkmanship thrown in there? If you turn up the day after a club's been thrown out of the Football League claiming to be a white knight, you haven't done a great job of saving the day. I'd be very sceptical. Romantically it'd be brilliant but being a dispassionate bastard for a moment, it's pretty poor. Edited August 28, 2019 by Robin1988 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Robin1988 said: If you turn up the day after a club's been thrown out of the Football League claiming to be a white knight, you haven't done a great job of saving the day. I'd be very sceptical. Romantically it'd be brilliant but being a dispassionate bastard for a moment, it's pretty poor. I could be getting the late offers mixed up. There is a story from this morning that a company called SJ Global had deposited money. It CAN happen though doubtful- in 1962, Accrington Stanley put in their notice to withdraw from League. Withdrawal accepted- not long after, maybe a few days someone came in and deposited £10,000 (in cash back then, not now) which was around 1/4 of their total debt, to be paid back whenever suits the club but importantly their more pressing debt was £4,000. Still the proof was there in the actual money- over to the Football League if they would but reverse the decision. They did not. Accrington Stanley limped on for 4 more years before going bust. Reformed 1968 and eventually, brilliantly returned in their new guise in 2006 replacing Oxford- the very side who replaced them. My point is though it seems unlikely, there could be something in it. SJ Global International, provided it is the same company. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2019/08/28/head-efl-rules-reprieve-expelled-bury/ Quote Debbie Jevans, the EFL's executive chair, said there is no appeal process to force the governing body in to a U-turn, despite SJ Global International's claims that it had transferred funds to buy the club by 9am on Wednesday. SJ Global are said to be planning to launch an appeal on the basis of claims the league misunderstood preparations to transfer funds. Jill Neville, the club secretary, reportedly took a call from the EFL late on Tuesday night telling her the £7million funds from SJ Global had been rescinded. No idea what's happened with fonts, text size etc. Bit more on it- 1am, EFL supposedly aware of it at 23.05 Tuesday night. The Accrington Stanley of this era? Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 It does sound great @Mr Popodopolous but even if they were aware at 11.05pm, the deadline was 5pm. If they turned up after that then they don't really have a leg to stand-on. If it is a mix-up then fair enough, but otherwise as much as we could say "It's only a few hours," that also works for any potential buyer that didn't turn up a few hours earlier.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) I do get that yeah, but given the August Bank Holiday with the impact on business that can have, I'd have been inclined to extend one more day- it's hard to work out with so many claims and counterclaims though. 11th hour bid- like I say claims and counterclaims but perhaps it was seen as highly likely that the other bid would go through- perhaps (unlikely) one of the Directors is a Bury fan we really have no idea. Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) Looked it up and just dug this out. https://www.buryfc.co.uk/news/2018/december/free-ifollow-video-new-chairman-steve-dale--director-matt-mccarthy/ Started watching about a minute in- it really has not aged well! Dale's opening press conference. Totally yet unsurprisingly flies in the face of what he said the other day. Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastardly and Muttley Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 Bolton takeover completed. https://www.bwfc.co.uk/news/2019/august/statement-on-behalf-of-david-rubin--partners-administrators-for-bolton-wanderers3/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 That is excellent news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, Dastardly and Muttley said: Bolton takeover completed. https://www.bwfc.co.uk/news/2019/august/statement-on-behalf-of-david-rubin--partners-administrators-for-bolton-wanderers3/ Cor, Ken Anderson's PR is through the roof isn't it? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dastardly and Muttley Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 4 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: That is excellent news. So pleased for Bolton. Is the town my grandmother lives in, so have a soft spot. Remember going into town with her when they had their promotion parade to celebrate promotion to the top tier many moons ago. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) Another blast from the past. https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football-maidstone-resign-from-league-as-debts-rise-henry-winter-on-the-demise-of-another-football-1541125.html Is the problem now less bad, or worse than in 1992 do we think? Also note the name in bold is a familiar one...how has he justified sticking in that position for so long! Quote Coming two days after the launch of the Premier League's rich new ball game, Maidstone's demise highlights the schism between the elite and the needy. 'Last week we had the Premier League turning down millions in sponsorship money, the sort of money that would keep the whole lower division in business,' Gordon Taylor, the chief executive of the Professional Footballers' Association, said. Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 12 minutes ago, Robin1988 said: Cor, Ken Anderson's PR is through the roof isn't it? So, it sounds like he then asked for more money. Disgrace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 7 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Debbie Jeavens trying to explain why the EFL had not checked the funding capability of Steve Dale starts mumbling ‘I’ve said , we do need to learn lessons’ Who do we hear that from , all the time , ....oh yes the head of Bristol City Council , and numerous NHS Authorities Incompetent CEOs abound Nobody ever says ‘Yes , Sorry it’s I'm not good enough and it won’t happen again because I am resigning my position to ensure it won't and to avoid the same thing happening again in the future, as it surely will if I remain in post, because we never learn the lessons, even though we always say we will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said: I could be getting the late offers mixed up. There is a story from this morning that a company called SJ Global had deposited money. It CAN happen though doubtful- in 1962, Accrington Stanley put in their notice to withdraw from League. Withdrawal accepted- not long after, maybe a few days someone came in and deposited £10,000 (in cash back then, not now) which was around 1/4 of their total debt, to be paid back whenever suits the club but importantly their more pressing debt was £4,000. Still the proof was there in the actual money- over to the Football League if they would but reverse the decision. They did not. Accrington Stanley limped on for 4 more years before going bust. Reformed 1968 and eventually, brilliantly returned in their new guise in 2006 replacing Oxford- the very side who replaced them. My point is though it seems unlikely, there could be something in it. SJ Global International, provided it is the same company. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2019/08/28/head-efl-rules-reprieve-expelled-bury/ No idea what's happened with fonts, text size etc. Bit more on it- 1am, EFL supposedly aware of it at 23.05 Tuesday night. The Accrington Stanley of this era? Remind me of the timely fashion in which Wednesday submitted their accounts last season Mr P ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, downendcity said: Remind me of the timely fashion in which Wednesday submitted their accounts last season Mr P ? Indeed downend. To say nothing of their ultra compliant, no doubt at all about it accounting period matching transaction- both perfectly in line and no doubt timely by Sheffield Wednesday... Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Indeed downend. To say nothing of their ultra compliant, no doubt at all about it accounting period matching transaction- both perfectly timely by Sheffield Wednesday... Unfortunately for Bury, the EFL were looking at them with the good eye, not the blind one! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Up The City! said: We are on Sky Sports on Saturday, considering what we went through in 82 surely us as fans should be doing something on the day to show our support for both Bury and Bolton? Seen a great and symbolic Tweet on this theme. IF the EFL don't do the right thing and give this bid a full opportunity, I hope this might happen. Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 30 minute listen. MacAnthony not everyone’s cup of tea, but some interesting ideas, but also insight into some if the rules and regs that cause problems in solving the likes of Bury and Bolton’s financial issues. I don’t agree with all of them, but worth half an hour imho. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) Nice touch from Bury https://www.twitter.com/buryfcofficial/status/1166772525210226688 Edited August 28, 2019 by Northern Red 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 16 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Seen a great and symbolic Tweet on this theme. IF the EFL don't do the right thing and give this bid a full opportunity, I hope this might happen. A simple Banner. ‘SHAME ON YOU EFL’ in Standing Section would be good Saturday 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 Ryan Lowe is on the Debate on Sky tonight, should be worth a watch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
054123 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 Starts with with wage caps from the top down. Sick to the back ******* teeth of football and it starts with the c**** at the very top of the premier league and scummy clubs like Liverpool etc. who believe that foitball owes them a Devine right because Paul in Exeter or Dev in Hounslow buys a Liverpool shirt instead of just being proud of where there from and supporting there club. I cannot tell you how annoyed I am when my kids are asked who they support and when they reply City, they are then asked, and which premiership team. C****. Ive almost had enough, very close now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) Here's a thing about Bury. League Two version of SCMP actually has wage caps- to a point, so does League One. Think it's 60% in League One and 55% in League Two- sensible right? When is a wage cap not a wage cap? When the owner can put in an unlimited amount to count towards turnover... NOT A BLOODY WAGE CAP THEN IS IT!! Turnover £1m, therefore you can spend £550k or £600k on wages- eminently sustainable. Owner lumps in £4m, you can just multiply that! Easily exceeding 100% of turnover on wages. A pure, hard and fast breakeven requirement surely the only way to hard and fast prevent except for good investment eg properly finances stadia, training grounds, academy etc- that aside, all standard costs eg wages, fees etc must not exceed turnover. Edited August 28, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
054123 Posted August 28, 2019 Share Posted August 28, 2019 (edited) Hate the EFL all you want but never forget the Premier League, FA and 5 arrogant clubs, would see us all go to the wall, if it meant they became a little bit richer. Edited August 28, 2019 by 054123 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelRobartes Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 Seems Bolton have been saved Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 7 minutes ago, BigTone said: Seems Bolton have been saved Nick Mason from the Floyd one of the investors - What more could you want ! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 45 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Nick Mason from the Floyd one of the investors - What more could you want ! He'll be going in with High Hopes & Money then. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) Good piece, these issues have been in the offing for a while and Shaun Harvey, the EFL. https://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/sport/football/blackpool-fc/gazette-opinion-bury-s-expulsion-a-tragic-inevitability-after-efl-ignored-blackpool-s-warning-signs-1-9960170 The Bury thing could be taking a very interesting twist now. Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Nick Mason from the Floyd one of the investors - What more could you want ! Bolton fans will be feeling comfortably numb this morning. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 22 minutes ago, downendcity said: Bolton fans will be feeling comfortably numb this morning. And all for a momentary lapse of reason 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) Hmmmmm... EFL meeting at midday. Here's MY hope of what will be announced- obviously a reversal and saving but also, a bit of a wishlist: Bury saving. A FULL investigation into both Bolton and Bury, with legal action against the likes of Anderson, Dale, and yes Harvey etc if failings applicable and punishable by law are found. New Independent body for EFL financial regulation- TRULY independent. Changes to certain FFP loopholes, which should never have been lifted in the first place. Perhaps dare I dream, an investigation into certain clubs who exploited said loopholes- a full and independent one at that, with FFP submissions retrospectively adjusted and points docked if necessary- with the punishment for Aston Villa either to be applied by PL or kept in reserve for if/when they return. Obviously the first one is the main one but any of the other 4 would be excellent and a very nice bonus. Long overdue in the case of 3 and 4 as well! Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveybadger Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 Hi all, posting this on behalf of my brother in law who is a Bury fan. Thanks. https://www.change.org/p/debbie-jevans-efl-efl-bring-back-bury-fc?recruiter=373797732&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=psf_combo_share_initial&utm_term=psf_combo_share_initial&recruited_by_id=c1a8ba80-522b-11e5-ba36-f16215828606&share_bandit_exp=initial-17545985-en-GB&share_bandit_var=v1&utm_content=fht-17545985-en-gb%3Av5 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 2 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Nick Mason from the Floyd one of the investors - What more could you want ! Defensively they should improve, especially with the improvised line of players putting up a barrier in front of a free kick specialist. What? We conceded? Nick, any ideas? All in all you need a-nother..... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow&Blue&Red Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 Isn't the EFL just the clubs self-regulating?? Because if it's just the clubs self-regulating, it's hardly surprising that the rules are lax. Business owners won't vote for tougher regulations with penalties, controls over how they spend their money or constraints on who they can sell their businesses to when they've got bored or run out of money? Maybe some tweaks but nothing of the kind that's needed. Businesses go bust all the time - it's the way capitalism works. If we don't want clubs to go bust on a regular basis, or for them to be subject to asset stripping or other predatory practices that are part of the rough and tumble of any other sector... if instead we want them to be treated like community assets, then we need legislation. We need an independent regulator, empowered in law to manage participation in the football league so that there's genuine FFP, rules that work to provide ownership oversight and to provide protection for communities of fans who - unlike in other business sectors, don't shop around. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 8 minutes ago, Yellow&Blue&Red said: Isn't the EFL just the clubs self-regulating?? Because if it's just the clubs self-regulating, it's hardly surprising that the rules are lax. Business owners won't vote for tougher regulations with penalties, controls over how they spend their money or constraints on who they can sell their businesses to when they've got bored or run out of money? Maybe some tweaks but nothing of the kind that's needed. Businesses go bust all the time - it's the way capitalism works. If we don't want clubs to go bust on a regular basis, or for them to be subject to asset stripping or other predatory practices that are part of the rough and tumble of any other sector... if instead we want them to be treated like community assets, then we need legislation. We need an independent regulator, empowered in law to manage participation in the football league so that there's genuine FFP, rules that work to provide ownership oversight and to provide protection for communities of fans who - unlike in other business sectors, don't shop around. As I understand it, the clubs agree on the rules/regulations and they appoint the EFL to administer those rules/regulations. Obviously, there are regulations that come from outside the EFL but its still down to the clubs to interpret them and instruct the EFL to administer them - stand to be corrected but thats how I see it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityal Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Hmmmmm... EFL meeting at midday. Here's MY hope of what will be announced- obviously a reversal and saving but also, a bit of a wishlist: Bury saving. A FULL investigation into both Bolton and Bury, with legal action against the likes of Anderson, Dale, and yes Harvey etc if failings applicable and punishable by law are found. New Independent body for EFL financial regulation- TRULY independent. Changes to certain FFP loopholes, which should never have been lifted in the first place. Perhaps dare I dream, an investigation into certain clubs who exploited said loopholes- a full and independent one at that, with FFP submissions retrospectively adjusted and points docked if necessary- with the punishment for Aston Villa either to be applied by PL or kept in reserve for if/when they return. Obviously the first one is the main one but any of the other 4 would be excellent and a very nice bonus. Long overdue in the case of 3 and 4 as well! That would be nice I have a feeling its more likely to be along the lines of - "Lunch was great! poached quail eggs salad, roast venison with sauteed red cabbage and parmentier potatoes all washed down with a nice Chataeu Latour at £600 per bottle." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, cityal said: That would be nice I have a feeling its more likely to be along the lines of - "Lunch was great! poached quail eggs salad, roast venison with sauteed red cabbage and parmentier potatoes all washed down with a nice Chataeu Latour at £600 per bottle." Sadly, will closer to that than my wishlist I fear... Still, the first one on my list WILL be addressed, I'm sure of it. The rest are for another day. Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 My one question would be how much longer can you give Bury? They will already be playing 2 games per week through much of the season to catch up as it currently stands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted August 29, 2019 Admin Share Posted August 29, 2019 Football supporters everywhere were shocked and saddened when on the 27th August Bury FC were expelled from the EFL. A 134 year old institution gone. Generations of fans left without the cornerstone of their community that so many of us take for granted. We fans often revel in the tribalism of our game but the deep love we have for our own club serves to strengthen solidarity when a crisis emerges. In the past couple of days there has been an outpouring of compassion, empathy and sorrow from hundreds of thousands of fans across the country and throughout the leagues. This weekend be grateful that your club has a game to play, that you can continue your matchday rituals with friends and family, like every other Saturday. Soak up the experience and appreciate it... and on the 27th minute, the FSA is calling for supporters everywhere to applaud for one minute in a nationwide display of solidarity for Bury. Why a minute of applause on the 27th minute? Because on 27th August a football club was expelled from the league for the first time in 27 years. Let's show that we care and we are angry that this situation has been allowed to happen. The FSA is lobbying hard to protect our clubs from unscrupulous or incompetent owners - conflicts of interest have to be removed as owners have shown they cannot regulate themselves and our clubs deserve special protections more in line with those afforded to listed buildings. Football clubs are not just another business. We'll need your support for that campaign in the weeks and months ahead, but for this weekend, let's start by showing supporter solidarity with Bury fans on the 27th minute. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Hmmmmm... EFL meeting at midday. Here's MY hope of what will be announced- obviously a reversal and saving but also, a bit of a wishlist: Bury saving. A FULL investigation into both Bolton and Bury, with legal action against the likes of Anderson, Dale, and yes Harvey etc if failings applicable and punishable by law are found. New Independent body for EFL financial regulation- TRULY independent. Changes to certain FFP loopholes, which should never have been lifted in the first place. Perhaps dare I dream, an investigation into certain clubs who exploited said loopholes- a full and independent one at that, with FFP submissions retrospectively adjusted and points docked if necessary- with the punishment for Aston Villa either to be applied by PL or kept in reserve for if/when they return. Obviously the first one is the main one but any of the other 4 would be excellent and a very nice bonus. Long overdue in the case of 3 and 4 as well! There is a lot of regulation that SHOULD be now enforced on all EFL clubs as a lesson learned from this. There are genuine fears that Bury could be the tip of the iceberg. However can you see a situation where clubs vote for that? For example if you introduced far more stringent (and sensible) rules on allowable expenditure and loss making relative to GENUINE turnover where would that leave us? Is that any chance of us reaching the Premiership in the next ten years gone? Do we create a closed shop Premiership in all but name and a Championship where the relegated Premiership sides have even more clout than they do now? Even the bloody Gas are managing to spunk £65K a week they don’t have!! Perhaps things would right themselves in time if the EFL bit the bullet and the game would be longer term better for it? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 A minute of chanting "**** the EFL" would be better than applause. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow&Blue&Red Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 31 minutes ago, bcfc01 said: As I understand it, the clubs agree on the rules/regulations and they appoint the EFL to administer those rules/regulations. I've just had a look at the EFL's Mem and Arts registered at Companies House. Each club in the football league holds a share in The Football League Ltd. for as long as they remain in the league. Six of nine board members are appointed are club represenatives: 3 from the Championship, 2 from L1 and 1 from L2. In order to change any of the rules, a majority of clubs need to vote for it... ...which is why we are where we are and why things won't change without external - governmental - intervention. I love the way the FSA in @phantom's post, above, are suggesting parallels between listed buildings and clubs. Owners of listed buildings can't just do what they want with them, and the same should apply to club owners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 6 minutes ago, Yellow&Blue&Red said: I've just had a look at the EFL's Mem and Arts registered at Companies House. Each club in the football league holds a share in The Football League Ltd. for as long as they remain in the league. Six of nine board members are appointed are club represenatives: 3 from the Championship, 2 from L1 and 1 from L2. In order to change any of the rules, a majority of clubs need to vote for it... ...which is why we are where we are and why things won't change without external - governmental - intervention. I love the way the FSA in @phantom's post, above, are suggesting parallels between listed buildings and clubs. Owners of listed buildings can't just do what they want with them, and the same should apply to club owners. Can't see the turkeys voting for Christmas.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Numero Uno said: There is a lot of regulation that SHOULD be now enforced on all EFL clubs as a lesson learned from this. There are genuine fears that Bury could be the tip of the iceberg. However can you see a situation where clubs vote for that? For example if you introduced far more stringent (and sensible) rules on allowable expenditure and loss making relative to GENUINE turnover where would that leave us? Is that any chance of us reaching the Premiership in the next ten years gone? Do we create a closed shop Premiership in all but name and a Championship where the relegated Premiership sides have even more clout than they do now? Even the bloody Gas are managing to spunk £65K a week they don’t have!! Perhaps things would right themselves in time if the EFL bit the bullet and the game would be longer term better for it? Agreed- a lot of regulation, both existing that isn't properly enforced, upgraded and fresh all needed now. Agree about the tip of the iceberg risk too, a report a few years ago which I'll try to find, said something about 3/4 of EFL clubs being in trouble or maybe over the next 10 years.- may well have been referring to mainly the bottom 2 divisions. Rules in Championship may well be okay, it's the enforcement or lack of that's the issue I think. Likewise 55% of turnover in League Two and 60% in League One seems okay...but chairman can then put in loads and it classes as turnover so that one needs a change for one! Could keep existing rules albeit amended and tightened, and additionally implement monthly monitoring of finances by the EFL of the 72 and the first sign a club hits financial distress, there is an automatic embargo- as a holding position, they cannot make the situation worse. That is one way- you are right though a balance needs to be struck which is why I am wary of wage caps or % of turnover split, at this level for example- it goes just eg £100m PL, £41m for year one parachute payments and say £7-8m for a typical Championship club. The £41m also gets some of the revenues a Championship club might get- these payments need reform as well, or some conditionality added and I've thought this for a long time. Could also take some from parachute payments and have it filter down to the bottom 2 divisions, whose need is pretty desperate it seems- a redistribution of that bit of redistribution. Think no doubt reform is necessary and overdue but they need to be very careful for the reasons that you state. The other possible law of unintended consequence, is make them too tight and too strait jacketed, and good investors may be more reluctant, may give up- and Unfit and improper ones maybe some of the only ones who want to do it- Asset strippers, Fraudsters, Idiots to name 3... Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loderingo Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 8 minutes ago, Yellow&Blue&Red said: I've just had a look at the EFL's Mem and Arts registered at Companies House. Each club in the football league holds a share in The Football League Ltd. for as long as they remain in the league. Six of nine board members are appointed are club represenatives: 3 from the Championship, 2 from L1 and 1 from L2. In order to change any of the rules, a majority of clubs need to vote for it... ...which is why we are where we are and why things won't change without external - governmental - intervention. I love the way the FSA in @phantom's post, above, are suggesting parallels between listed buildings and clubs. Owners of listed buildings can't just do what they want with them, and the same should apply to club owners. You will never get government intervention. FIFA hates it when governments try to interfere with football affairs. If anyone is going to intervene it would have to be the FA... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow&Blue&Red Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 minute ago, Loderingo said: You will never get government intervention. No - I agree it looks like a long shot! Certainly need more than just poor Bury going under for government to do anything about it. Looks like there have been periodic calls from government for better football governance for over 50 years! But I think hoping that the EFL will come up with meaningful reforms is even more unlikely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted August 29, 2019 Admin Share Posted August 29, 2019 Interesting that there is an emergency EFL meeting taking place right now. . . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyderInACan Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, cityal said: I have a feeling its more likely to be along the lines of - "Lunch was great! poached quail eggs salad, roast venison with sauteed red cabbage and parmentier potatoes all washed down with a nice Chataeu Latour at £600 per bottle." By the time that bottle had been bought and sold to each other several times it would be worth millions! All counting towards turnover for FFP purposes, of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfc01 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 10 minutes ago, phantom said: Interesting that there is an emergency EFL meeting taking place right now. . . . . Should be finishing in 10 minutes as lunch will be over by then. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityal Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) 34 minutes ago, CyderInACan said: By the time that bottle had been bought and sold to each other several times it would be worth millions! All counting towards turnover for FFP purposes, of course More on that: The first time it was resold for £2000 The next time they resold the bottle on the basis that it was the actual Chateau Latour and it sold for £150M An independent Auditor came in and said that seemed "fair" Derby and Villa got away with it Meeting outcome: 6 game bans for Famara Dhiedhou and Bailey Wright Edited August 29, 2019 by cityal 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) Quote 5.3 Subject to the provisions of the Articles of Association and these Regulations, The League may from time to time and upon such terms and conditions as it may think fit admit any Association Football club as a member or expel or accept the retirement of any member from The League provided always that no member may be expelled without the sanction of a special resolution passed at an Annual or Extraordinary General Meeting of The League. Any casual vacancy occurring in the membership of The League may be filled by the Board. Hmm... Does this mean an AGM or in this instance, an EGM required for expulsion I wonder? Presumably by "the League" it means the 72 clubs as opposed to merely the board- or would the board suffice for such a decision, if an insolvency event happens? Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted August 29, 2019 Admin Share Posted August 29, 2019 5 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Hmm... Does this mean an AGM or in this instance, an EGM required for expulsion I wonder? Could be what this afternoons sudden meeting is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 minute ago, phantom said: Could be what this afternoons sudden meeting is? Yeah, wondered that myself- was simply hoping that it was for a reprieve of some sort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) Looks all over now- subject to legal action etc. Further Nixon update/Tweet. Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 22 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Looks all over now- subject to legal action etc. Further Nixon update/Tweet. I have never wanted Alan Nixon to be wrong so much as I do now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) Said it the other day but worth reiterating- smacks a LOT of Accrington Stanley 1962, this final phase. Quote An international consortium has £7m in the bank and is ready to complete a takeover of Bury, if the EFL agrees to reinstate the club, Sky Sports News understands. Gustavo Ferreira, a partner in a gold mining company, is the man behind the proposed takeover and is trying to get the EFL to rescind its decision to expel the club from the English Football League. It is understood the EFL would be unlikely to change its decision at this point, however it is possible that an injunction may be served on the football league if Ferreira's request for it to explore the possibility of overturning the decision goes unanswered. The consortium says it has shown the EFL proof of funds and was in negotiations to buy the club on Tuesday night, before Bury were removed from the Football League. The EFL made the decision to expel Bury after a proposed takeover by C&N Sporting Risk fell through on Tuesday afternoon, just hours before the 5pm deadline. That was as of yesterday. Accrington Stanley 1962. Quote It was on March 6, 1962, that Accrington's four remaining directors sent a letter of resignation to the League, and in doing so consigned this historic football region to 40 years in the wilderness. Stanley became the first club in Football League history who were unable to fulfil their fixtures. At a creditors' meeting on the previous evening, it was established that of the £43,566 owed by the club, just £4,000 was needed in the short term to stay alive. Two days after the fateful letter was received at the League's headquarters, a man walked into the club's office and put a bag on the table with £10,000 cash inside. "You can borrow that interest free," he said, "and pay it back whenever you can manage it. I don't want to see this club go under." Given the opportunity to grant a reprieve to Accrington Stanley, the League's management committee chose to accept the original letter of resignation. EFL though technically a different organisation as Football League all one thing then, and not exactly identical circumstances, have YET AGAIN done the wrong thing by a club with potential for being saved at the last!! Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 23 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: Said it the other day but worth reiterating- smacks a LOT of Accrington Stanley 1962, this final phase. That was as of yesterday. Accrington Stanley 1962. EFL though technically a different organisation as Football League all one thing then, and not exactly identical circumstances, have YET AGAIN done the wrong thing by a club with potential for being saved at the last!! So Accrington Stanley went bust for less than £1m in today’s money. How many EFL clubs are “only” £1m in the red as of today?!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Numero Uno said: So Accrington Stanley went bust for less than £1m in today’s money. How many EFL clubs are “only” £1m in the red as of today?!!! Once adjusted for inflation etc. Yep. Such a relatively low number, according to an inflation calculator- well fill your boots. That's the total debt, but the Football League basically was a case of computer said no despite the fact it'd have saved them and brought time. https://www.officialdata.org/uk/inflation/1962?amount=43566 Edited August 29, 2019 by Mr Popodopolous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loderingo Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 Why would a South American gold miner want to buy Bury? Unfortunately, it is too late now and the only way back is via a phoenix club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerseybean Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 EFL sticking by their decision: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/49509774 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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