GrahamC Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 14 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said: Quid a kid today for the fewers. What was the attendance. Got to be 9k at least 8300. Can't even give tickets away, can they? Blue "half" of Bristol.., like ****. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiderEyed Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, GrahamC said: 8300. Can't even give tickets away, can they? Blue "half" of Bristol.., like ****. Honestly wonder how long it'll be til it's the Blue quarter, then the Blue fifth. Sit back and watch as a club implodes from within. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WessexPest Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 5 minutes ago, tts_city said: Probably suffering with the same cold/flu I and loads of other people have, I have never been so unwell, coughing blood every morning atm, horrendous. He’s been in bed all week with German Shepherd, sorry, German Measles. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, GrahamC said: 8300. Can't even give tickets away, can they? Blue "half" of Bristol.., like ****. That's 8300 with a Quid a Kid deal. That promotion seems to have worked well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 14 minutes ago, tts_city said: Probably suffering with the same cold/flu I and loads of other people have, I have never been so unwell, coughing blood every morning atm, horrendous. Yes, lots of bad bugs going around this month. I had one that saw me take my first sick days in years and if DC had anything like that, or proper 'flu which is much worse, then he wouldn't have been up to leaving the house let alone watching a whole match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 8 minutes ago, Rudolf Hucker said: That's 8300 with a Quid a Kid deal. That promotion seems to have worked well. Oh yes. With that Jordanian bullshitter in charge they are effectively slowly dying in front of us. How many "loyal and true" will keep going against the likes of Bury and Northampton for relegation six pointers in freezing January or February? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Heard lots of moans about their pitch Hiw can they not maintain a pitch with no rugby and only one side playing on it - Hardly been a harsh winter !! #Championshipready Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 24 minutes ago, tts_city said: Probably suffering with the same cold/flu I and loads of other people have, I have never been so unwell, coughing blood every morning atm, horrendous. Ugh. Ban him from the forum before we all catch it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Heard lots of moans about their pitch Hiw can they not maintain a pitch with no rugby and only one side playing on it - Hardly been a harsh winter !! #Championshipready By the sound of it, only the away side. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 1 minute ago, wendyredredrobin said: By the sound of it, only the away side. There own fans moaning about it today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Heard lots of moans about their pitch Hiw can they not maintain a pitch with no rugby and only one side playing on it - Hardly been a harsh winter !! #Championshipready Wasn’t that long ago that they were laughing and taking the piss about how the Rugby was definitely going to churn up our pitch and cock up our chances of any kind of decent football at the Gate. Obviously their pitch would resemble a bowling green. Wrong again Sagheads 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 It does sound like they are in a mess financially with insolvency only a matter of weeks away and their recent record on the pitch is looking pretty dire too. Not even a cup run to brighten things up. A couple of bad results over the next week will certaily give them a blue,blue Christmas and a bleak looking new year. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said: Wasn’t that long ago that they were laughing and taking the piss about how the Rugby was definitely going to churn up our pitch and cock up our chances of any kind of decent football at the Gate. Obviously their pitch would resemble a bowling green. I don't think it's even green. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City fan 1982 Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 I know rovers have always been skint , what sort of financial trouble are they in ? Who do they owe money too ? Ive seen it mentioned many times , but really without any substance . Would be interesting to find out ...... v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Apparently they had to take out a wonga to pay the players the other week. I assume that the carpets, curtains and the fence have all been paid for now. It's not just a case of who they owe money to, it's a case of their only line of credit drying up as their debts are about to exceed the value of the ground that they are using as security and they are losing money every week because they need a crowd of 20,000 or something to break even. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Swiss gas always seems to have a handle on the financial,side and as a Sag his posts don't make good reading Heres one of his latest Some perspective is also needed about the Al Qadi family situation and their capabilities. Jordan only just makes it into the list of top 100 countries ranked by GDP and is one place below the Democratic Republic of Congo. The AJIB is about the 8th largest bank in Jordan in terms of market capitalisation and it's current stock market valuation is £270 million making the Al Qadi family stake worth about £80 million. Their total family dividend income from AJIB is about £6 million per year with Wael's portion about £700 000 pa. If the Al Qadi family are not in a position to finance a £25 million redevelopment of the Mem themselves they will have to look for outside investors. If those investors are looking for a 5% return over 25 years the redeveloped Mem will have to be producing net revenues of £1.8 million per year just to pay the outside investors. So to "sell" those investors on the deal someone will have to convince them that the Bristol Rovers business will be able to perform an amazing turnaround from £2 million losses to at least £1.8pa million profits. And then cash has to be found to finance the football team ! 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 At this time of the year, I think it's imperative we remember those less fortunate than ourselves. Those who through entirely their own fault find themselves friendless, often win less, and living rough in a decrepit rugby stadium with an old tart called Irene. Dig deep to help those who will always be less fortunate than us - and in our shadow. Just £5 buys a visit to Santa's Grotty Grotto at the Mem. Just £25 buys a new plastic chair for those occasions where visitors might swell the attendance. Just £40 can buy a fake Omega timepiece for an impoverished Arab Just £55 buys a trolley full of groceries for an enraged Gashead to leave in Sainsbury's. "In protest". And for just £1,500 you can buy some desperately needed fencing so the Gas can train in privacy, without people laughing. Unfortunately, no amount of cash can buy them a home win it seems. Get me Geldof and Ure on the phone..... 17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) Dont forget that they let in kids for a quid too, Robbo. Without that, they may only get 4 or 5 k through the gates. What was their break even attendance again? Edited December 23, 2017 by wendyredredrobin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawey Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 come on people be fair they did buy new curtains and an offcut of carpet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) 22 minutes ago, kivsy said: I know rovers have always been skint , what sort of financial trouble are they in ? Who do they owe money too ? Ive seen it mentioned many times , but really without any substance . Would be interesting to find out ...... v I would say it's all in the thread but I guess you don't have three hours to spare to read it. Quick answer: they are not in financial trouble nor do they have s string of unpaid creditors. For now. Much longer answer: Rovers are owned by Dwane Sports which is owned by the Al Qadi family who have a large but minority shareholding in Jordan's ?sixth largest bank. Rich but not even close to our own owner. Their annual dividend income from this holding is c. £6m per year. Nice but compare that against football clubs' losses. Dwane Sports has taken out a £10m charge on their ground (valued at £11m) and Rovers is drawing money under this charge on which they are paying an estimated 6% interest. DS has also directly purchased land for a training ground for £2m; Rovers don't own this or owe for it. Thus far the owners have put none of their money, bar the purchase price, at risk but when Rovers' debts to Dwane Sport and the rolled up interest on this hits £10m then they will have to do this as there is nothing left against which to secure loans. My estimate for this point is March 2018 though the owners are unlikely to sit upon their hands until this happens. When the £10m is hit they have several options. If they are not prepared to put any of their money at risk then they may: seek external unsecured (expensive) funding to finish the season then sell, or sell the ground and put the club into administration, seek another investor to put money in though this would have to be a lot as losses and interest are c. £2m a year. If they are prepared to put some money at risk: pump in £0.5m to finish the season and then sell. If they are as devoted to Rovers as Steve Lansdown is to City: keep covering the losses for ten years, give DC a big transfer budget, entirely rebuild the ground, and aim for the premiership. I include the last paragraph for comic effect. Edited December 23, 2017 by Eddie Hitler 7 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 8 minutes ago, stawey said: come on people be fair they did buy new curtains and an offcut of carpet Sadly for them, they think 'Remnants' is a Brazilian midfielder, and not something from Brian Steel's bargain bucket. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 If they can get any money for Billy Bodin, that might keep them solvent until the end of the season............But then what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22A Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Their "ever loyal" fans are speaking up and some are facing reality. http://gaschat.co.uk/thread/11315/rovers-donny-official-thread-sponsored?page=3 Sad days for BRFC.We are in decline both on and off the field.See you at Walsall.We won't be any worse than we were there last year.Can't see us making enough changes in Jan to arrest the mediocrity on the pitch.Can't see any announcement either regarding a new stadium.Think I'll emigrate or it will be visiting Conference grounds again at this rate. http://gaschat.co.uk/thread/11315/rovers-donny-official-thread-sponsored?page=4 Awful - can’t keep dragging myself up for it atm - feel so flat and disillusioned- think I need a break from it even tho I have a ST - Good luck gas you need it! http://gaschat.co.uk/thread/11315/rovers-donny-official-thread-sponsored?page=5 Difficult to know where we go from here, it's not that a few changes to the team from the current squad will make much difference, the players have just lost their way and their confidence to play football has gone. The team needs fresh blood but no one is going to release anyone in January at prices our owners are likely to pay. The squad when playing to their potential is good enough to stay up but it only seems to click for a game or two then it back to square one. The let-downs of the pitch have played their part and whilst DC puts a brave face on it, he knows he's battling against the odds and so do the players. It's likely that BB will be off in January at a knock down price so we won't have money to replace him let alone improve the squad. Loans are hit and miss, you might strike lucky but loans not best option for a relegation battle. Just to think I was fool enough to believe 'em when they said new stadium, top class training facilities and a top 6 budget...all has proved to be lies. It's hard to dig deep in such circumstances but I'll keep supporting them but do now hope the Al Qadis sell up as there is clearly no future with them or Hamer as Chair. If it's a low budget future then at least we need owners with a vision and plan for the way forward who can work with a manager who knows the position. Trouble is who would pay the £12 milion loan back to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 59 minutes ago, GrahamC said: Oh yes. With that Jordanian bullshitter in charge they are effectively slowly quickly dying in front of us. How many "loyal and true" will keep going against the likes of Bury and Northampton for relegation six pointers in freezing January or February? Corrected that, Graham. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 44 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said: I don't think it's even green. Their fans are. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 There is a thread on their forum about 'reputational damage' and if Wally and family would want to be shamed by seeing Rovers fold. Given any credibility they might have had at home was probably jettisoned when they took over, I doubt if They'll be shunned down the country club if some lower league outfit no one has ever heard of collapses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22A Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 http://gaschat.co.uk/thread/11301/doncaster-score-predictions Our last meeting against Doncaster was a 1 nil loss at the Mem in March 2008 when Paul Trollope was our manager in the 07/08 season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephenkibby. Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 45 minutes ago, wendyredredrobin said: I don't think it's even green. Speaking of greens, I see Argyle had over 10,000 at Home Park today and that's from a position in the bottom 4. Last week had the plans accepted to finally finish their stadium. Do you think it's Plymouth that should now take on the mantra of MIND THE GAP? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Even Dopey couldnt be bothered to turn up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wendyredredrobin Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 1 minute ago, Super said: Even Dopey couldnt be bothered to turn up. I understand that he was actually at another game watching the team he is going to be managing next week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, Super said: Even Dopey couldnt be bothered to turn up. He'll be in the dog house. What? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 1 hour ago, tts_city said: Probably suffering with the same cold/flu I and loads of other people have, I have never been so unwell, coughing blood every morning atm, horrendous. I’d see a doctor. Urgently. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said: At this time of the year, I think it's imperative we remember those less fortunate than ourselves. Those who through entirely their own fault find themselves friendless, often win less, and living rough in a decrepit rugby stadium with an old tart called Irene. Dig deep to help those who will always be less fortunate than us - and in our shadow. Just £5 buys a visit to Santa's Grotty Grotto at the Mem. Just £25 buys a new plastic chair for those occasions where visitors might swell the attendance. Just £40 can buy a fake Omega timepiece for an impoverished Arab Just £55 buys a trolley full of groceries for an enraged Gashead to leave in Sainsbury's. "In protest". And for just £1,500 you can buy some desperately needed fencing so the Gas can train in privacy, without people laughing. Unfortunately, no amount of cash can buy them a home win it seems. Get me Geldof and Ure on the phone..... Just £5.50 an hour can pay for a member of staff to sell the pies. Oops, no it can’t. £200 can pay the centre half’s wages for the week. Edited December 23, 2017 by Harry 1 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TinMan's left peg Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, tts_city said: Probably suffering with the same cold/flu I and loads of other people have, I have never been so unwell, coughing blood every morning atm, horrendous. Mate some advice (I’m a doctor) - please don’t assume that’s the flu, go see your GP. Edited December 23, 2017 by TinMan's left peg Typo 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tts_city Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 22 minutes ago, Harry said: I’d see a doctor. Urgently. went yesterday, the violent coughing up of green has ruptured something in my lungs its called hemoptysis,. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bizyer Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 1 hour ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Swiss gas always seems to have a handle on the financial,side and as a Sag his posts don't make good reading Heres one of his latest Some perspective is also needed about the Al Qadi family situation and their capabilities. Jordan only just makes it into the list of top 100 countries ranked by GDP and is one place below the Democratic Republic of Congo. The AJIB is about the 8th largest bank in Jordan in terms of market capitalisation and it's current stock market valuation is £270 million making the Al Qadi family stake worth about £80 million. Their total family dividend income from AJIB is about £6 million per year with Wael's portion about £700 000 pa. If the Al Qadi family are not in a position to finance a £25 million redevelopment of the Mem themselves they will have to look for outside investors. If those investors are looking for a 5% return over 25 years the redeveloped Mem will have to be producing net revenues of £1.8 million per year just to pay the outside investors. So to "sell" those investors on the deal someone will have to convince them that the Bristol Rovers business will be able to perform an amazing turnaround from £2 million losses to at least £1.8pa million profits. And then cash has to be found to finance the football team ! **** me. That sounds like a bubble about to burst/sh1t hit the fan etc. etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DANWRENBCFC4LIFE Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Someone better go and check dopeys house and see if the post is pilled up 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City fan 1982 Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 their forum is great reading, blaming the sheeds, pansdown for uwe not going ahead, mythical chinese investors buying rovers out, now theyve gone to barnsley ! their forum is an absolute pantomime !! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cotham Brow Red Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, kivsy said: their forum is great reading, blaming the sheeds, pansdown for uwe not going ahead, mythical chinese investors buying rovers out, now theyve gone to barnsley ! their forum is an absolute pantomime !! Honestly that lot are so far deluded they would blame there own mother for the weather being bad (well if she was a Ted anyway). A gas work colleague got shortchanged in a pub in town once...yep guess what must have been a gurt dirty Ted. Honestly the BMI need to recognise Gaslogicitis as a clinical disease / disorder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityal Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 46 minutes ago, kivsy said: their forum is great reading, blaming the sheeds, pansdown for uwe not going ahead, mythical chinese investors buying rovers out, now theyve gone to barnsley ! their forum is an absolute pantomime !! Oh no its not! 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 34 minutes ago, Bizyer said: **** me. That sounds like a bubble about to burst/sh1t hit the fan etc. etc. I'm no financial analyst but if you read some of this chaps other posts (He appears quite switched on about it) they are in the s***t and heading for major trouble unless something changes......... ____________________ The Dwane Sports loan has increased by £4.8 million in 17 months. I suspect £1.13 of the loan facility was used to pay for the training ground which is registered in the name of Dwane Colony Ltd and probably booked as an inter-company loan. The loans of £930K owing to Nick Higgs and Barry Bradshaw may also have been paid off That would leave trading losses of £ 2.74 million over 17 months which equates to just under £2 million per year. ____________________ As far as I can see, in rounded terms, the £12 million has been spent to pay off the former directors loans (£4.5 million) pay off the MSP Capital loan (£2.7 million) pay part of the 2016 losses ( £1 million) pay for the subsequent 17 months trading losses (£2.8 million) and make a loan to Dwane Colony to buy the training ground land (£1 million) It looks as though we are losing £2 million per year so the loan owing to Dwane Sports will increase by that amount every year until Hani decides the marathon is over. The best solution IMO is for Dwane Sports to seriously seek outside investment and be willing to capitalise their loan and sacrifice their majority stake. If they are not prepared to do that then I think they should forget about the Colony and mothball it, lease or share a suitable medium term training ground and concentrate all available resources on getting to the Championship where the EFL funding increases from £1.3 million pa to £6.4 million pa. Geoff alluded to this solution right at the end of the interview. One thing which fans could do, and which would help put our minds at rest, is to ask Dwane Sports to give a sign of their good faith by committing that they will not sell the Mem before first having secured another, commercially acceptable, home for Rovers. ___________________ So why did Wael, in an interview with Venture magazine on 31st August 2016, say he "beat around 10 other bidders to secure ownership of the club" ? I think we both know the reason, which is that Wael likes to embellish the truth, and your assessment is probably correct that there was only one bid which would get Nick and his colleagues out with most of their money intact. But there is really no need for Rovers fans to fall out over this and surely we don't want to get back to the days when anyone (like me) who criticised the owners was called a "board basher" and told to "put up or shut up". It must be clear by now that criticism of Nick's way of running the club was entirely justified and I think the same applies today. Prior to the take over Rovers were about £7 million in debt to the directors/shareholders and MSP Capital, losing about £1 million per year and with no plan of how to go forward. Steve Hamer confirmed yesterday that Rovers are now £12 million in debt to Dwane Sports Ltd, losing about £2 million per year and with no plan of how to go forward. I should say the financial situation now is considerably worse than it was in January 2016 but the question for Rovers fans is what should we do ? Although Steve and Wael have said they are in it for the long term I think the biggest worry for Gasheads is that Hani will decide to protect his family interests by selling the Mem to recoup the loan before it exceeds the value of the security. Would it be wrong for Rovers fans to ask Hani for a sign of his good faith by requesting he state that: "We will not sell The Mem without first securing a viable new home for Rovers" _________________ This is my take on it socrates I did see your post but put my thoughts in a reply to knowall. "Prior to the take over Rovers were about £7 million in debt to the directors/shareholders and MSP Capital, losing about £1 million per year and with no plan of how to go forward. Steve Hamer confirmed yesterday that Rovers are now £12 million in debt to Dwane Sports Ltd, losing about £2 million per year and with no plan of how to go forward. I should say the financial situation now is considerably worse than it was in January 2016 but the question for Rovers fans is what should we do ?" Even taking into account the deteriorated financial situation we could be much more optimistic about the bigger picture if only Dwane Sports, from the start, had come up with a properly written down plan and vision to give us some hope. They didn't do that, the stadium consultants soon disappeared, and it drifted on until the UWE cancellation was revealed in August. Since then they have had three months to come up with something new and I think most of us thought Steve Hamer was going to tell us about that yesterday but what we heard from him was terribly disappointing. I understand some fans think it's rude and disrespectful to question the owners but, believe me, if a business owner is confident about what he is doing and has a clearly defined plan he'll be pleased to answer constructive questions and be proud to set out his vision. _______________ At 30th June 2010 Rovers owed the bank and brewery a total of £1.5 million, the directors a total of £2.5 million and we were losing £1 million per year. Today we owe Dwane Sports £12 million and we are losing around £2 million per year. So we are in a far worse state now than we were when the last Mem redevelopment plans fell through. And no one knows what the "project" is because all we have been given are vague ramblings about a training ground like Fleetwood's which is having to be scaled down because reality has kicked in and a redevelopment of the Mem which the Chairman is recommending be done stand by stand but he is not sure whether Dwane Sports agree with him about that. ------------ But it's not just us lunatics MM because Darrel Clarke is talking about finance as well. He has said his net spend on transfers is only £135 000 and I'm sure when Steve Hamer mentioned us having something like Fleetwood's £9 million training ground Darrell was wondering where the money was coming from just like we were. Wael and his family refuse to talk about finances and try to give the impression everything is under control but clearly it's not. The debt when they took over was about £7.2 million (£4.5 million former shareholders + £2.7 million MSP Capital) and now we have been told they have invested £12 million so a further £4.8 million must have been spent since then. It looks like £3.7 was to cover trading losses and £1.1 million was on the land at Almondsbury which is registered in the name of Dwane Colony Ltd.. ----------------- The write off of £2.3 million legal and professional costs was included in the 2016 accounts and that's what the MSP Capital loan was primarily used for. The debt situation has deteriorated by £4.8 million since the take over. The issue about whether or not Dwane Sports are comfortable with this level of debt, and it increasing week by week, is one which Wael could have put to bed in his interview but chose not to. There is an issue because Steve Hamer and Darrell Clarke are clearly concerned about finances and I think the time to confront it would be before Darrell Clarke leaves rather than let him go and then start the blame game. ______________ What is galling for me warehamgas is that when a few of us criticised the old regime for the way they were running Rovers we were told we were "board haters" with a "hidden agenda". In fact, most of us with experience in business were simply trying to point out that there was a better way to go and we wanted Nick Higgs to adopt a more professional approach in the best interests of Rovers. So when something like this minimum wage issue comes up and fans are very quick to hurl abuse at the old board it makes me wonder why, at the time, so many refused to admit what was staring them in the face when all the signs were there if you opened your eyes. And I'm afraid the situation today is similar. I understand it is difficult for many fans to reconcile the difference between debt and equity but basically when money is put into a football club as debt it remains the property of the owners not the football club and the owners are entitled to charge interest if they wish. Whereas with equity the money becomes the property of the football club and the owners only get a return if the club is profitable and they can take a dividend or if the club is successful and the shares have a value when the club is sold. Steve Hamer's interview was very enlightening because he confirmed that Dwane Sports were charging interest on their loan and he said they did not put money into Rovers as equity because if they did it would be "irrecoverable". In other words they do expect to recover the interest which is racking up in Rovers accounts at the rate of about £14 000 per week. Steve said the interest was "notional" which is not strictly true because if it was notional it would not show in the audited accounts and it would not be recoverable. This interest is an overhead for Rovers when calculating a break even figure and the money supplied via loan does not count towards turnover for FFP / SCMP purposes so, compared to many other lower league clubs where the owners subscribe for equity or make donations, we are at a disadvantage. You mention Scunthorpe United and their 2016 accounts show the owner invested £3.78 million into the club as share capital which gave them a big advantage in playing budget terms. And with Rochdale I have a personal anecdote from many years ago when I was talking to their Chairman about financing and he told me that a very well known TV comedy duo had offered to put money into their club but, he said after a pause, "they wanted to take a charge over our ground" followed by him spluttering with laughter. Most people in the game, including Steve Hamer I expect, are fully aware that owning a club is an indulgence you have to be prepared to pay for and to think you can charge yourself interest and use the assets to secure your debts is "just not football". ___________________________ If you are a Sag , doesn't make great reading does it 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolmoose Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 12 minutes ago, cityal said: Oh no its not! They’re behind us!! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityal Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, bristolmoose said: They’re behind us!! True! 17 years and counting! Edited December 23, 2017 by cityal 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Red Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 They deserve everything that comes there way.. to believe wael and his familys bull shit is there own idiotic fault. The bloke clearly hasn't got a pot to piss ( in the £ world of football anyway) and has led the sags royally up the garden path.. lmagine the tables were turnt and we were them and they were us hahah fo0k me our life's wouldn't be worth living.. i hope they get whats coming to them the ***** 6 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Fred Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 6 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Swiss gas always seems to have a handle on the financial,side and as a Sag his posts don't make good reading Heres one of his latest Some perspective is also needed about the Al Qadi family situation and their capabilities. Jordan only just makes it into the list of top 100 countries ranked by GDP and is one place below the Democratic Republic of Congo. The AJIB is about the 8th largest bank in Jordan in terms of market capitalisation and it's current stock market valuation is £270 million making the Al Qadi family stake worth about £80 million. Their total family dividend income from AJIB is about £6 million per year with Wael's portion about £700 000 pa. If the Al Qadi family are not in a position to finance a £25 million redevelopment of the Mem themselves they will have to look for outside investors. If those investors are looking for a 5% return over 25 years the redeveloped Mem will have to be producing net revenues of £1.8 million per year just to pay the outside investors. So to "sell" those investors on the deal someone will have to convince them that the Bristol Rovers business will be able to perform an amazing turnaround from £2 million losses to at least £1.8pa million profits. And then cash has to be found to finance the football team ! And for that reason,I'm out..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Hunt-Hertz Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 5 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said: I understand that he was actually at another game watching the team he is going to be managing next week. No, he was at the dogs.....salivating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Joker Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 7 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said: If you are a Sag , doesn't make great reading does it No but i,m a gurt ted and i recon its a cracking read, along with Dopey s dog grooming for beginners. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 8 hours ago, bris red said: They deserve everything that comes there way.. to believe wael and his familys bull shit is there own idiotic fault. The bloke clearly hasn't got a pot to piss ( in the £ world of football anyway) and has led the sags royally up the garden path.. lmagine the tables were turnt and we were them and they were us hahah fo0k me our life's wouldn't be worth living.. i hope they get whats coming to them the ***** This. If it was another club that was being shafted you would feel some sympathy with them as in most cases it`s come out of the blue but with them we`ve been telling them what will happen from day one and they`ve just chosen to ignore all the evidence. We`ve been saying it`s the emperor`s new clothes ever since Wally bought them but they (with a few exceptions) have blindly followed him. They deserve all they get. They should have been questioning the owner from the day he took over - all the evidence we managed to find was out there in the public domain - but they prefer to believe in their ultimate fantasy - getting within touching distance of us even if it risked destroying their club in the process. It`s not about being the best you can be to them. It`s only about being better than us. They would be happy to be back in the Conference if it meant we were one place below them. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 listened to 20man on the way home last night and they are definitely worried, but they are still deluded. They keep talking about January and how signings will save them, but don't seem to have sussed that they will have to be shopping in Poundland, let alone LIDL. In their current predicament, it's difficult to see why players even from lower leagues would want to join them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS2 Red Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Any other club I would feel sorry for. But the 15ers have spent 35 years laughing about a club that was in financial ruin. They found it all so hilarious! **** ‘em. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 11 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: This. If it was another club that was being shafted you would feel some sympathy with them as in most cases it`s come out of the blue but with them we`ve been telling them what will happen from day one and they`ve just chosen to ignore all the evidence. We`ve been saying it`s the emperor`s new clothes ever since Wally bought them but they (with a few exceptions) have blindly followed him. They deserve all they get. They should have been questioning the owner from the day he took over - all the evidence we managed to find was out there in the public domain - but they prefer to believe in their ultimate fantasy - getting within touching distance of us even if it risked destroying their club in the process. It`s not about being the best you can be to them. It`s only about being better than us. They would be happy to be back in the Conference if it meant we were one place below them. You are right, but the local media are equally culpable, too. Even this year the Post talked about his family wealth being £500m and the BBC sent a local journalist (Andy Howard) to Jordan to do a (totally unnecessary) fawning piece on Wael. It was pretty clear from the start that someone who was seriously considering buying Gillingham before them was hardly another Sir Stephen Lansdown, but their pathetic desire to find nice things to say about the horse punchers got in the way of the (incredibly amusing) truth. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Simpson Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Yes ****'em. Happy Christmas everybody, except them. ****'em. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myol'man Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 How does a club with reasonable attendances, at that level anyway, paying below the going rate to it's players end up in such a financial mess? Well they did it in the 50's and 80's I suppose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Hunt-Hertz Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 33 minutes ago, Port Said Red said: listened to 20man on the way home last night and they are definitely worried, but they are still deluded. They keep talking about January and how signings will save them, but don't seem to have sussed that they will have to be shopping in Poundland, let alone LIDL. In their current predicament, it's difficult to see why players even from lower leagues would want to join them. More like a stall at Sandbach market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchay Red Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 They seem to really be in a financial mess, and it's obviously getting worse. It may come down to passing round the collection bucket to save them. My problem would be deciding how much to take out. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 35 minutes ago, Port Said Red said: listened to 20man on the way home last night and they are definitely worried, but they are still deluded. They keep talking about January and how signings will save them, but don't seem to have sussed that they will have to be shopping in Poundland, let alone LIDL. In their current predicament, it's difficult to see why players even from lower leagues would want to join them. Poundland is likely to be too expensive. Dumpster diving is more the level I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 4 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miah Dennehy Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 On 21/12/2017 at 22:59, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said: This deserves more than just one 'like'. Certainly on that thread there were some very respectful comments at the beginning. Obviously a few dicks came along with their uneducated and bitter views later on as the situation got too much for them to take. The usual suspect were guilty, one 'Pompey' fan in particular. Thing is, they were coming out with the same stuff when we were approaching the Championship Play Off Final in 2008. Obviously the mask dropped as soon as the final whistle blew that day. One of the best things about last night was that it occurred to me as I walked out that all of my Gas inlaws and colleagues had sat in front of a telly for 93 minutes waiting to see City get heavily beaten and instead had to put up with the agony of a last minute City winner, brilliantly set up by Taylor of all players....and they all watched it. Happy Christmas. The thing is you can't knock what City are doing at the moment but that doesn't stop me from wanting it to stop! Currently we are light years apart and that doesn't look like changing any time soon, but things do change and in football it can happen quite quickly. A year ago Lansdown and Johnson in particular were getting some horrific stick and the prospect of us facing each other again in league competition looked odds on, a year on and it looks as far away as ever. I'm 53 next week, and at the moment, I'd take just beating you once more in my lifetime. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myol'man Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 8 minutes ago, Miah Dennehy said: The thing is you can't knock what City are doing at the moment but that doesn't stop me from wanting it to stop! Currently we are light years apart and that doesn't look like changing any time soon, but things do change and in football it can happen quite quickly. A year ago Lansdown and Johnson in particular were getting some horrific stick and the prospect of us facing each other again in league competition looked odds on, a year on and it looks as far away as ever. I'm 53 next week, and at the moment, I'd take just PLAYING you once more in my lifetime. edit for you Miah 2 17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coombsy Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 24 minutes ago, Miah Dennehy said: The thing is you can't knock what City are doing at the moment but that doesn't stop me from wanting it to stop! Currently we are light years apart and that doesn't look like changing any time soon, but things do change and in football it can happen quite quickly. A year ago Lansdown and Johnson in particular were getting some horrific stick and the prospect of us facing each other again in league competition looked odds on, a year on and it looks as far away as ever. I'm 53 next week, and at the moment, I'd take just beating you once more in my lifetime. Hi miah you are one of the best posters for the blue few At 53 next week you deserve some happynest. my gif and advise to you come and join the Reds happy Christmas and happy birthday 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 31 minutes ago, Miah Dennehy said: The thing is you can't knock what City are doing at the moment but that doesn't stop me from wanting it to stop! Currently we are light years apart and that doesn't look like changing any time soon, but things do change and in football it can happen quite quickly. A year ago Lansdown and Johnson in particular were getting some horrific stick and the prospect of us facing each other again in league competition looked odds on, a year on and it looks as far away as ever. I'm 53 next week, and at the moment, I'd take just beating you once more in my lifetime. I can understand that Miah, that’s perfectly natural. In fairness to you, you don’t make any secret that you’d like to see us lose, you also have said in the past that if the tables were turned and we’d have got relegated to the Conference you’d be taking every opportunity to take the piss. I respect that because you’re being honest and not trying to claim you’re any better than us. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonR Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 6 hours ago, The Joker said: No but i,m a gurt ted and i recon its a cracking read, along with Dopey s dog grooming for beginners. Your use of the word Grooming there made me spray coffee out of my nose. Kudos man! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1960maaan Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 1 hour ago, Miah Dennehy said: The thing is you can't knock what City are doing at the moment but that doesn't stop me from wanting it to stop! Currently we are light years apart and that doesn't look like changing any time soon, but things do change and in football it can happen quite quickly. A year ago Lansdown and Johnson in particular were getting some horrific stick and the prospect of us facing each other again in league competition looked odds on, a year on and it looks as far away as ever. I'm 53 next week, and at the moment, I'd take just beating you once more in my lifetime. Is this your wish to live into your (several) hundreds???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Merry Christmas, @Miah Dennehy but I can't imagine that you 15ers will enjoy the happiest new year. Everything seems presently stacked against your club (which we're all enjoying heartily btw) and its hard to see how it can end well for you. I enjoy the fact that OTIB is a forum which gives our rivals a voice. The brickbats thrown at us by you, other gasheads, posters from Cardiff and even Barnsley cause all of us to challenge our thinking about how our club is run. It enables us to develop a more balanced view. Occasionally, some posters such as @st andrews gas turn up simply intent upon taking the piss but there are enough on here to put them in their place and send them off to lick their wounds. Were your own forum to be similarly moderated (rather than adopting the present North Korean approach) then the seemingly delusional beliefs spouted by so many of your fans would be challenged and changed perhaps galvanizing your fan base to challenge and change the management of your club (note I said club, not team). Unless changes are quickly made, you're on a slippery slope to oblivion. Your wish to see your team beat us once more will never happen because your club will no longer exist. With that cheery possibility in mind, I wish all of my fellow OTIB'ers the Merriest Christmas and a very Happy New Year. 10 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 How to spend £150k on your pitch and turn it into a sandpit !!! Fair play to the second poster - made me laugh http://gaschat.co.uk/thread/11318/terrible-pitch 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southstandoriginal Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 4 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: How to spend £150k on your pitch and turn it into a sandpit !!! Fair play to the second poster - made me laugh http://gaschat.co.uk/thread/11318/terrible-pitch One of the other posters is doubtful that they've actually paid for it though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 (edited) This is just the best, lifted from that thread, the aim is to give Dopey one of the best playing surfaces in league 1, oh they are just the gift that never ends and long may it continue. https://www.bristolrovers.co.uk/news/2017/may/upgrading-the-mem/ Surely the sand is to soak up the camel shit that the owner spreads. Edited December 24, 2017 by Esmond Million's Bung 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Already drop kerbs have been installed outside the Supporters Club matchday shop and the Stadium Shop to assist wheelchair users. The car parks have also come under scrutiny and all spaces will be clearly marked and numbered in both the main and inner car parks. Painting and decorating in all areas, new curtains and blinds for the Dribuild Suite, carpet cleaning throughout and the deep cleaning of all kitchen areas also feature on the agenda, as does the provision of a newly refurbished media suite to be used for post-match interviews. Looks like they put as much effort in for their disabled supporters in their shops as they do in the stands.... More carpet cleaning too, cannot believe they actually feel the need to tell supporters this rubbish. Total embarrassment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoxton casual Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 2 hours ago, Miah Dennehy said: The thing is you can't knock what City are doing at the moment but that doesn't stop me from wanting it to stop! Currently we are light years apart and that doesn't look like changing any time soon, but things do change and in football it can happen quite quickly. A year ago Lansdown and Johnson in particular were getting some horrific stick and the prospect of us facing each other again in league competition looked odds on, a year on and it looks as far away as ever. I'm 53 next week, and at the moment, I'd take just beating you once more in my lifetime. Happy birthday Miah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoxton casual Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 And after Wednesday, any young kid is not going to want to be dragged to see the rovers for his or her first game. The future is ours, and our main competition is now local lads in Man Utd and Barcelona tops... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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