Bristol R*vers dustbin thread

[ScottishRed]

This is utterly irrelevant. There is no way that they will progress.

[ForeverRed]

It will all end in tears!!

 

Edited June 20, 2020 by ForeverRed

[Taz]

Or he's paid off all his family debt before calling in the administrators in the next week or so.

Won't get disowned then, and they'll feel sorry for him. Wally goes back to living in their shadows, whilst taking a big dump in the middle of the Mem.

Meanwhile back in Sag land, they start going to the council with their begging bowl as they have no ground, no owner, and no hope.

So many false dawns, and yet they still think that they're going places.....

[Tinmans Love Child]

11 hours ago, Gashead2017 said:

What a time to be a Gashead, debt free tonight and a multi million new stadium development being announced next week, not sure life can get better than this, we jut need to convince Matty Taylor we can offer him better prospects than Oxford and it will have been a perfect summer. 

Where have I heard that before?

[Tinmans Love Child]

It’s funny that when SL writes of our debt they mock this approach and gloat how it will all go wrong when SL sells up, yet when exactly the same thing happens to them it’s amazing news and the start of a new era!

[Port Said Red]

26 minutes ago, Tinmans Love Child said:

It’s funny that when SL writes of our debt they mock this approach and gloat how it will all go wrong when SL sells up, yet when exactly the same thing happens to them it’s amazing news and the start of a new era!

Suddenly the.boy wonder is a financial genius. This despite showing no discernible business acumen of his own throughout his life. I wonder why his brother has hung on to that 10%? It could be a punt with a small amount of his money, or Wael couldn’t stretch to buying the whole kit and caboodle.

As far as I can see, he has no income from other ventures that would allow for ongoing debt support or investment, so this is a one off gamble with daddy’s inheritance. I guess you can’t take it with you.

[fatchers]

I thought Wally ran a travel company ,thus making him a travel agent. Not the best time to be a travel agent and certainly not going to make the millions needed to support a tin pot outfit like the pikeys.

[HoldenBall]

1 hour ago, Tinmans Love Child said:

It’s funny that when SL writes of our debt they mock this approach and gloat how it will all go wrong when SL sells up, yet when exactly the same thing happens to them it’s amazing news and the start of a new era!

It's always different rules for them.

[pongo88]

9 hours ago, Ska Junkie said:

What's the motivation for the investors then? I don't get it.

Exactly. Things are not as presented by Wael and the Rovers supporters. This is a business land development deal, with the Rovers thrown in as a red herring to ease the planning process. There will be much joy by the Rovers fans for the next few months or years, but the truth will emerge in time.  As the man himself says, “these things take time”

[Eddie Hitler]

Well, after all the laughs they've given us stretching all the way back to the Wonga loan and the watertight contract with Sainsbury's I am happy to acknowledge that these financing changes are without question tremendous news for the Rovers.  No qualifying statement it is simply very good news indeed.

Now with that conceded please go back to making us laugh.

[Bristol Rob]

I won't be at all surprised to see Wally get an option to buy the Fruit Market and secure planning permission before selling up.

Or at least trying to sell up.

I presume the fruit market site will be a fairly complicated deal to conclude (I have no idea how it would work) but...

Both Rovers and the Fruits are still trading, so neither could move until a new home is in place, so I would guess that stage 1 would be, build a new home somewhere for the fruit Market, then knock down the old fruit Market and build a new stadium, then move out the Mem.

Sounds like the sort of thing that would take a long time.

[Born and Red in 82]

So in simple terms for this simple person

they are debt free but wont own anything !

it will be interesting to see how it un ‘folds’

 

[steviestevieneville]

17 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Well, after all the laughs they've given us stretching all the way back to the Wonga loan and the watertight contract with Sainsbury's I am happy to acknowledge that these financing changes are without question tremendous news for the Rovers.  No qualifying statement it is simply very good news indeed.

Now with that conceded please go back to making us laugh.

Rumours that I’ve seen are . A consortium buying the fruit market land . Building a stadium and housing but not having a stake in the football club.

if this is true then they’d be back to being rent boys and depending on the lease agreement , it could end up back to a eastville scenario or a Coventry 

[luke_bristol]

Just now, Born and Red in 82 said:

So in simple terms for this simple person

they are debt free but wont own anything !

it will be interesting to see how it un ‘folds’

 

That’s why I can’t understand their joy

 

they owe **** all but they own **** all

 

The only assets they’d have would be their players, and it’s been a long time since they had players like Lambert on their books

[Bristol Rob]

23 minutes ago, luke_bristol said:

That’s why I can’t understand their joy

 

they owe **** all but they own **** all

 

The only assets they’d have would be their players, and it’s been a long time since they had players like Lambert on their books

So sustainability would need to come from their academy and developing players for resale?

Tricky market to get right I would wager, we have had some success in developing young players, but a lot of our youth we've paid transfer fees for.

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

3 hours ago, Tinmans Love Child said:

It’s funny that when SL writes of our debt they mock this approach and gloat how it will all go wrong when SL sells up, yet when exactly the same thing happens to them it’s amazing news and the start of a new era!

I’m going to answer this post ‘Sagstyle’:

“Ye but deY is a SugA dAddys plAstic pLayFing I cAnt wAyt TIL hE pullS dA pLug n deY gO bUst looooooooool a nEw earrer iz cuMin”

[Gazred]

Seems like Wally learnt his lesson when Higgs lumbered him with a polished turd.

I'm sure at this point he's just applying a fresh coat of polish before moving it on and breaking even or making a small profit now he's had his fun with it.

[italian dave]

49 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said:

Rumours that I’ve seen are . A consortium buying the fruit market land . Building a stadium and housing but not having a stake in the football club.

if this is true then they’d be back to being rent boys and depending on the lease agreement , it could end up back to a eastville scenario or a Coventry 

Or what they could have had at UWE. As you say, dependent on the lease terms (I think that was the problem at UWE) but they can't know now what they'll likely be.

[Crackers Corner]

16 hours ago, DSTAF said:

It looks like the start of something for the slags and wally.  Is it going to be a happy or sad ending? 

 

They wouldn't know a happy ending if they paid for it in a Thai red light district.

[steviestevieneville]

12 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Or what they could have had at UWE. As you say, dependent on the lease terms (I think that was the problem at UWE) but they can't know now what they'll likely be.

I’m guessing but tying it in with wael buying his brother out who was completely against uwe. It could be a case peppercorn rent but no bar/ hospitality takings . Which will have them in a financial headlock 

[pongo88]

37 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

So sustainability would need to come from their academy and developing players for resale?

Tricky market to get right I would wager, we have had some success in developing young players, but a lot of our youth we've paid transfer fees for.

The academy route seems to be the likely option as Rovers have said they want to get rid of their “expensive” (!) players and replace them with lower league cheaper players with potential. As Rovers are in League 1, and aren’t prepared to pay much,  the players they get aren’t likely to be of high standard. Any exceptional local young players will have the choice of joining City’s academy or Rovers. An easy choice 

[Ska Junkie]

13 hours ago, Miah Dennehy said:

You are worried- brilliant!

Shitting myself Miah, absolutely bricking it.

Better? 

[Ska Junkie]

So the gas get a shiny new methanarium they don't own so pay rent for it and the consortium build houses around it and probably take a fair chunk of the generated non match day revenues? Is that right?

Apart from the fact they would have a new venue, given they're paying rent and lose all the stuff that's made a difference to us, doesn't that make them worse off then? 

[1960maaan]

1 hour ago, pongo88 said:

The academy route seems to be the likely option as Rovers have said they want to get rid of their “expensive” (!) players and replace them with lower league cheaper players with potential. As Rovers are in League 1, and aren’t prepared to pay much,  the players they get aren’t likely to be of high standard. Any exceptional local young players will have the choice of joining City’s academy or Rovers. An easy choice 

But, if they have to really trim the squad, those youngster could potentially get first team football. Something which, even in our Division now, would be a lot harder to achieve . It is a potential selling point for them. Be interesting to see how deep Waels , or/and the new peoples pockets are. Academies can be expensive things to run, and take time to return a profit.

I wish they'd just bugger off back to non League and get it over with.

[pride of the west]

The irony is that they are only in the position they thought they were in when he took over

[Rich]

13 hours ago, Miah Dennehy said:

You are worried- brilliant!

I have to admit to being worried Miah.

1. Worried that my council rates would be used to assist BRFC to play in a new stadium, at no cost to themselves.

2. Worried that they'd get an unfair advantage to be just a little more successful than anytime in the last 40 years.

3. Worried that they'd Mop up a few floating supporters who would otherwise have continued flocking to see BCFC.

4. Worried that they'd hold up the charge of BCFC by continuing to cling onto our shirt tails.

5. Worried that there will be a massive court case against BCC for misdemeanors during land transfers/sales/leases, resulting in more costs to the citizens of Bristol.

6. worried that any displacements from existing premises in the surrounding areas, will result in more money paid out by the citizens of Bristol finding alternative premises.

7. Worried that the few BRFC supporters I know, might be getting excited about this and as a result, messing with their deluded minds even more..

8. Worried that I've already spent enough of my time worrying about something that most probably won't happen.

[italian dave]

2 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

I’m guessing but tying it in with wael buying his brother out who was completely against uwe. It could be a case peppercorn rent but no bar/ hospitality takings . Which will have them in a financial headlock 

I'm certainly not basing this on anything I 'know', but Id always assumed that was the problem with UWE, and that either Wael was either not aware of it when he bought it, or maybe as you suggest didn't think it a problem but his brother did.

I think it was/will be a big problem personally. Look at the massive difference expanding hospitality, food outlets etc has made to City - and we had some to start with!

19 minutes ago, pride of the west said:

The irony is that they are only in the position they thought they were in when he took over

What? You mean he really is the 6th richest person in football??

[Guest]

1 hour ago, 1960maaan said:

But, if they have to really trim the squad, those youngster could potentially get first team football. Something which, even in our Division now, would be a lot harder to achieve . It is a potential selling point for them. Be interesting to see how deep Waels , or/and the new peoples pockets are. Academies can be expensive things to run, and take time to return a profit.

I wish they'd just bugger off back to non League and get it over with.

Those youngsters could also potentially take them down. They were hardly smashing it in League One as it was, and it seems they have got rid of a couple of decent players for that level that the fans wanted to keep. The striker could be gone at the next opportunity, and they could have a squad that may really struggle next season. Easy to say get rid of the experience/costs and replace them cheaply, but in reality it will be a lot harder, even if they find a couple of gems along the way. Add in the fact the costs of running an academy, getting it right and bringing players through, it is hardly a quick easy fix.

It seems their fans seem to think they are debt free, will have a superb academy and a new stadium and things couldn't be better, when in reality they probably won't actually own anything bar the players and the Colony? Matchday costs will go right up, and where are the extra fans going to come from to cover all these costs? 

[1960maaan]

2 hours ago, wood_red said:

Those youngsters could also potentially take them down. They were hardly smashing it in League One as it was, and it seems they have got rid of a couple of decent players for that level that the fans wanted to keep. The striker could be gone at the next opportunity, and they could have a squad that may really struggle next season. Easy to say get rid of the experience/costs and replace them cheaply, but in reality it will be a lot harder, even if they find a couple of gems along the way. Add in the fact the costs of running an academy, getting it right and bringing players through, it is hardly a quick easy fix.

It seems their fans seem to think they are debt free, will have a superb academy and a new stadium and things couldn't be better, when in reality they probably won't actually own anything bar the players and the Colony? Matchday costs will go right up, and where are the extra fans going to come from to cover all these costs? 

If they get a core of reasonable players, then give the odd young kid a chance, a little like we do, they sale at a profit an repeat. It's easier further down the League, and easier if you have no real ambition. 

As for debt free, I've not looked at it but you could say we are debt free. Difference is we have a Billionaire owner who is happy to pay while he builds. They have an owner who's family is worth (I think) £400m maybe. His wealth a lot less than that and has links with investment bankers. I still think he has done this to get the books looking good, a potential new ground lined up, and then look to get rid. I might be wrong, but if he's in it for the Club, it will cost him a lot of money.  If they rent the fruit market site, at least he can sale the Mem, take his money and then it's just the club . Rent and match day costs Vs match day income (some that could be claimed by the ground owners) , not sure how long that would be viable. And what is in it for the owners of the ground? They get rent, maybe a cut from match day sales. But an initial multi million outlay only to get a paltry ant in return seems strange, unless. I wonder if when they sale the Mem , maybe the training ground too, he hands the club over and walks with all his money back. Just thinking out loud , but I don't get what is going on there TBH.

[MC RISK77]

18 hours ago, Lew-T said:

rovers5charlton5 Fans' Favourite 4 hours ago Tilly's Thighs, socrates, and 1 more like this

Quote

19th June 2020

Put that date in your diary Gasheads

The day we started to dream!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why are they so incredibly tragic and cringeworthy?

Yeah because we don’t have our fair share of soppy melts on here!!

[Ska Junkie]

I think this f@ckwit actually believes this rubbish! 

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

19 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said:

I think this f@ckwit actually believes this rubbish! 

Yes, of course...once they move into their soulless, plastic bowl miles away from their traditional heartland we may as well fold the club.

Idiots 

 

Edited June 20, 2020 by Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan

[Miah Dennehy]

23 hours ago, fatchers said:

I thought Wally ran a travel company ,thus making him a travel agent. Not the best time to be a travel agent and certainly not going to make the millions needed to support a tin pot outfit like the pikeys.

No, he isn't a travel agent. Whether or not he is the Messiah or not is another matter.

[S25loyal]

21 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

Rumours that I’ve seen are . A consortium buying the fruit market land . Building a stadium and housing but not having a stake in the football club.

if this is true then they’d be back to being rent boys and depending on the lease agreement , it could end up back to a eastville scenario or a Coventry 

We (Bristol city) pay rent to pay at Ashton Gate. 

We (Bristol city) do not own Ashton gate and haven’t for a long long time. 

[City Rocker]

34 minutes ago, S25loyal said:

We (Bristol city) pay rent to pay at Ashton Gate. 

We (Bristol city) do not own Ashton gate and haven’t for a long long time. 

I believe Ashton Gate stadium is owned by Bristol City Holdings Ltd which, along with the various other companies in the group, is ultimately owned by Steve and Maggie via Pula Sport Limited. No problemo. 

I think most clubs have restructured in this sort of way in modern times. Which is very different from, say, a Coventry City situation where they sold their stadium and then rented a new one from a third party, which was absolutely ruinous for them. 

[pongo88]

29 minutes ago, S25loyal said:

We (Bristol city) pay rent to pay at Ashton Gate. 

We (Bristol city) do not own Ashton gate and haven’t for a long long time. 

The structure involving Bristol Sport, Bristol City and Bristol Bears etc is complicated to say the least and I don’t  try to understand the way money flows between the various parts of the structure. There is however one thing that’s clear from the City accounts and that’s commercial income for City was (from memory) approx £15M last year. If Rovers end up in a stadium owned and paid for by a consortium, then the consortium will almost certainly get the commercial income. Ruinous for Rovers as said by @City Rocker . The only way to make money from the new ground will be for Wael to buy the portion of the fruit market site to be used for the stadium and finance it’s build himself. He may decide to do this or he may not. Time will tell

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

 

[Ska Junkie]

Am I right in saying they never reached full capacity at Eastville or is that rubbish?

[weeble]

49 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said:

Am I right in saying they never reached full capacity at Eastville or is that rubbish?

The theoretical capacity of Eastville was 39,000. The safety at sports ground act reduced that to 12,500.  The record attendance was 38,472 against Preston in the FA cup in 1960.

I watched a league cup game against Stoke as a youngster in the seventies. The crowd was over 33,000 and it was scarily packed. The idea that you could legally still squash  in another 6,000 horrifies me. It’s amazing that there weren’t more crowd fatalities than there were over the years.

Edited June 21, 2020 by weeble

[swindon fan]

This is eerily like the Oxford situation when Uncle Firoz got hold of the club. Sold the Manor Ground for redevelopment, built a cheap as chips 3-sided monstrosity and then charged the club £750,000 per annum to rent it.

[redsquirrel]

regarding the build, they could get a bunch of clueless gasheads to start it for free season tickets then call in diy sos when it falls down

[reddoh]

10 minutes ago, redsquirrel said:

regarding the build, they could get a bunch of clueless gasheads to start it for free season tickets then call in diy sos when it falls down

not sure they do tents.

[slartibartfast]

9 hours ago, weeble said:

The theoretical capacity of Eastville was 39,000. The safety at sports ground act reduced that to 12,500.  The record attendance was 38,472 against Preston in the FA cup in 1960.

I watched a league cup game against Stoke as a youngster in the seventies. The crowd was over 33,000 and it was scarily packed. The idea that you could legally still squash  in another 6,000 horrifies me. It’s amazing that there weren’t more crowd fatalities than there were over the years.

Especially with ALL the Stokies in the Tote (I know, I joined them there )

[CiderJar]

If you look closely you can see the flames coming from his pants...

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3010721795689610&id=102814153147070

 

Edited June 22, 2020 by CiderJar

[slartibartfast]

6 hours ago, CiderJar said:

If you look closely you can see the flames coming from his pants...

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3010721795689610&id=102814153147070

 

This vid reminds me of Matt Hancock et al being asked very searching questions at a Covid update !

[Bristol Rob]

A development (of sorts)...

Go Outdoors has filed something or another with the courts that stops creditors from taking any action against them for the next 10 days.

Evidently they are in some sort of financial strife, not sure what that means for their redevelopment plans, other than it can't be good news.

[Gazred]

6 hours ago, CiderJar said:

If you look closely you can see the flames coming from his pants...

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3010721795689610&id=102814153147070

 

Q: Clubs losing £3m+ a year, what are you doing to reduce that?

A: I'm building a training ground to help with future sustainability.

Yeh, that should do it keep going.

 

[Bristol Rob]

13 minutes ago, Gazred said:

Q: Clubs losing £3m+ a year, what are you doing to reduce that?

A: I'm building a training ground to help with future sustainability.

Yeh, that should do it keep going.

 

If there is on thing bound to reduce losses, it's a training ground.

We all know how lucrative 3 porta-cabins and a field is.

Can't believe just how much they have closed the gap over the weekend.

[Jim Davey]

go outdoors are having a closing down sale , that should save them a few quid. 

[italian dave]

On 20/06/2020 at 21:25, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

Yes, of course...once they move into their soulless, plastic bowl miles away from their traditional heartland we may as well fold the club.

Idiots 

 

Their traditional heartland being where?!

[Lanterne Rouge]

9 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Their traditional heartland being where?!

A couple of cul-de-sacs in Warmley last I heard.

[redsquirrel]

i wonder if they have got cameron balloons on board ,plenty of cheap stand materials with lots of hot air

[RumRed]

I have my own non league side I follow, Worthing. They’ve raised almost 50k in a couple of weeks, surely Rovers can manage something like that for the dubbin to waterproof their ‘stands’.

Sad thing is we were going to piss the Isthmian league this year and they cancelled the season.

Players move constantly at that level so no guarantees for next season.
 

Football doesn’t half suck at times.

 

Manager’s grandad played for us btw, Wally Hinshelwood.

Edited June 22, 2020 by RumRed

[Bob Taylor is GOD]

12 hours ago, italian dave said:

Their traditional heartland being where?!

It would be interesting to know where the current "Blue Few" come from?

Eastville/Fishponds,     Kingswood/Hanham/Warmley,    Bath,   Horfield...

[Miah Dennehy]

2 hours ago, Bob Taylor is GOD said:

It would be interesting to know where the current "Blue Few" come from?

Eastville/Fishponds,     Kingswood/Hanham/Warmley,    Bath,   Horfield...

Well I was brought up in Fishponds, now live in Hanham, have also lived in Eastville, Kingswood and very briefly Warmley. So I nearly have the full set!  Maybe it just depends where I'm living

Edit: I also lived in Lawrence Weston 30 odd years ago which- at the time- I would have said was more Rovers than City!  Mind you when I lived in Redfield and St George it was more of a 50/50 split.

Edited June 23, 2020 by Miah Dennehy

[Bob Taylor is GOD]

2 hours ago, Miah Dennehy said:

Well I was brought up in Fishponds, now live in Hanham, have also lived in Eastville, Kingswood and very briefly Warmley. So I nearly have the full set!  Maybe it just depends where I'm living

Edit: I also lived in Lawrence Weston 30 odd years ago which- at the time- I would have said was more Rovers than City!  Mind you when I lived in Redfield and St George it was more of a 50/50 split.

Didn't move to Bath and Horfield with them then?

[Major Isewater]

On 19/06/2020 at 23:19, Miah Dennehy said:

It's the hope that kills you.

Amen brother. 

[Miah Dennehy]

8 minutes ago, Bob Taylor is GOD said:

Didn't move to Bath and Horfield with them then?

Sorely tempted

[Ska Junkie]

19 hours ago, italian dave said:

Their traditional heartland being where?!

The lamb, that's it! I'll give them the crown and horseshoe as well, just and even that's shut!

Edited June 23, 2020 by Ska Junkie

[NOTBLUE]

3 hours ago, Miah Dennehy said:

Well I was brought up in Fishponds, now live in Hanham, have also lived in Eastville, Kingswood and very briefly Warmley. So I nearly have the full set!  Maybe it just depends where I'm living

Edit: I also lived in Lawrence Weston 30 odd years ago which- at the time- I would have said was more Rovers than City!  Mind you when I lived in Redfield and St George it was more of a 50/50 split.

L Dub was more Blue than red, where As  Shire was the opposite, more red that blue.

[22A]

17 hours ago, RumRed said:

Manager’s grandad played for us btw, Wally Hinshelwood.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wally_Hinshelwood

[myol'man]

6 hours ago, Bob Taylor is GOD said:

It would be interesting to know where the current "Blue Few" come from?

Eastville/Fishponds,     Kingswood/Hanham/Warmley,    Bath,   Horfield...

Used to be 1 on Bemmy Down but I think he's gone now 

[cider hoss rules]

5 hours ago, Miah Dennehy said:

Well I was brought up in Fishponds, now live in Hanham, have also lived in Eastville, Kingswood and very briefly Warmley. So I nearly have the full set!  Maybe it just depends where I'm living

Edit: I also lived in Lawrence Weston 30 odd years ago which- at the time- I would have said was more Rovers than City!  Mind you when I lived in Redfield and St George it was more of a 50/50 split.

can you confirm that the Rovers 50 in the above is actually in thousands, like the Wembley attendance?, therefore more than our portion.

[bert tann]

Reading tonight's Bristol Post article headlined "Wael Al-Qadi, Bristol Rovers and the truth" I was reminded of the old Gene Pitney song "Somewhere in the West Country"

Nobody wants him he's nobody's child
Nobody seems to care
Isn't it funny now that he needs someone
There's nobody there ...

 

[Midlands Robin]

Wally cetainly has all his eggs in one basket now.

If he can't secure some sort of deal in the next 1 or 2 years there's going to be one giant omlette in the middle of the Gloucester Road.

[Rich]

13 hours ago, Midlands Robin said:

Wally cetainly has all his eggs in one basket now.

If he can't secure some sort of deal in the next 1 or 2 years there's going to be one giant omlette in the middle of the Gloucester Road.

Yes, it's a fruit basket.

Trouble is, the people that want to buy the fruit basket, don't appear to care, need or want BRFC on board.

I would imagine that the Mayor of BCC and his best mate are doing their utmost to tempt those prospective fruit basket owners into including a stadium, with the transfer/sale of cheap public owned land. Thing is, they'd get a better and quicker return on their investment if it were developed for residential use.

[redsquirrel]

8 minutes ago, Rich said:

Yes, it's a fruit basket.

Trouble is, the people that want to buy the fruit basket, don't appear to care, need or want BRFC on board.

I would imagine that the Mayor of BCC and his best mate are doing their utmost to tempt those prospective fruit basket owners into including a stadium, with the transfer/sale of cheap public owned land. Thing is, they'd get a better and quicker return on their investment if it were developed for residential use.

they wont get no return on their investment with that shower gung ho on nicking it

[Midlands Robin]

Can any of the financial wizz kids on here explain to me how capitalising debt works? 

I know SL has done it for us so it's industry practice but I don't quite get it. 

I sort of understand that instead of paying a debt the company pays its loaner the debt value in shares and that due to the two companies being under the same roof its a bit like paying yourself however, what does that do to a clubs value? 

If the methane snorters were valued at 13.5 million and the share issue was greater than that then surely that would now value the club at the level of the share issue otherwise the share holder will have to wait for the value of his stock to be at that level or greater to make any money. 

If I have 20 million pounds worth of shares but someone wants to buy me out they have to give me 20 million to buy 13.5 million pounds worth of assets? 

It's confusing. 

 

[nebristolred]

51 minutes ago, Midlands Robin said:

Can any of the financial wizz kids on here explain to me how capitalising debt works? 

I know SL has done it for us so it's industry practice but I don't quite get it. 

I sort of understand that instead of paying a debt the company pays its loaner the debt value in shares and that due to the two companies being under the same roof its a bit like paying yourself however, what does that do to a clubs value? 

If the methane snorters were valued at 13.5 million and the share issue was greater than that then surely that would now value the club at the level of the share issue otherwise the share holder will have to wait for the value of his stock to be at that level or greater to make any money. 

If I have 20 million pounds worth of shares but someone wants to buy me out they have to give me 20 million to buy 13.5 million pounds worth of assets? 

It's confusing. 

 

I've no basis for this, but I always assumed it worked so that the owner takes a larger slice of the club, diluting the value of other shareholders in the process.

So let's say there are 100 shares of Bristol Rovers. Wael owns 49 shares and other investors own 51 shares. So 49% v 51%.

The club has racked up debts to Wael.

Instead of calling in the debt, Wael can capitalise it as equity instead. So the club will create maybe 20 extra shares, all going to Wael (so it's now 69 shares v 51 shares). This leaves the split at 57.5% v 42.5%. So the other investors own the same number of shares as before, but they are now worth less as Wael has taken a bigger chunk of the pie as part of the debt capitalisation.

The club's value remains exactly the same theoretically. It's just distributed differently internally.

I could be way, way off but this is how I assumed it works, and I think it's this practice which has allowed Wael to take control of Rovers.

Fully prepared to be ripped to shreds here now!

Edited June 25, 2020 by nebristolred

[weeble]

3 hours ago, nebristolred said:

I've no basis for this, but I always assumed it worked so that the owner takes a larger slice of the club, diluting the value of other shareholders in the process.

So let's say there are 100 shares of Bristol Rovers. Wael owns 49 shares and other investors own 51 shares. So 49% v 51%.

The club has racked up debts to Wael.

Instead of calling in the debt, Wael can capitalise it as equity instead. So the club will create maybe 20 extra shares, all going to Wael (so it's now 69 shares v 51 shares). This leaves the split at 57.5% v 42.5%. So the other investors own the same number of shares as before, but they are now worth less as Wael has taken a bigger chunk of the pie as part of the debt capitalisation.

The club's value remains exactly the same theoretically. It's just distributed differently internally.

I could be way, way off but this is how I assumed it works, and I think it's this practice which has allowed Wael to take control of Rovers.

Fully prepared to be ripped to shreds here now!

Wael took effective sole control by negotiating the acquisition of the other family shareholdings in Dwane Sports after the death of his father. He now holds 90% of the family share holding and his brother Sami 10%.

Although I’m no expert on capitalising debt, I think your description is pretty much spot on. By issuing more shares that he then acquires, Wael can remove the outstanding debt, but this also dilutes the percentage held by other people. I believe it’s the process SL has used at City to remove debt, although I stand to be corrected.