Bristol R*vers dustbin thread

[Numero Uno]

4 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Rule of thumb used to be that each seat costs 2k for a reasonable build standard.

I would guess that is closer to 3k these days.

So a 17k seater would be in the region of 50m.

Best of luck to them...

The issue is, and the new guy has admitted it, the Few are totally reliant on the Developers of the site being able to make it work. If the numbers don’t stack up things will either be delayed until they do or worse for them the Developer could just flip the site, get their money back and run. It’s not uncommon.

A proper stadium of 20k seats, if done properly, could easily set the Developer back £50m plus. It won’t have dawned on our blue cousins that there is a lot of work to be done before a design is tabled let alone a spade put in the ground. You’re also looking at a the best part of two years to build it.

No wonder the newbie is asking for patience. Could be five years away if there aren’t huge obstacles to overcome.

[weepywall]

1 hour ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

From Gaschat, politics on their side with voter numbers apparently:-

10000+ active Bristol Rovers fans (many based/voting in Bristol) and 40,000+ passive 'fans' based on Wembley attendances..

Those inflated Wembley attendances they continuously harp on about FFS, I know plenty that went to Wembley with Rovers just for a day out, they would have no interest in watching them for a game against Barnsley, Port Vale etc...its the same with us, we have actually taken over 40k to Wembley but plenty of that 40k wouldn't regularly watch us....deluded is an understatement.

[milo1111]

12 minutes ago, weepywall said:

Those inflated Wembley attendances they continuously harp on about FFS, I know plenty that went to Wembley with Rovers just for a day out, they would have no interest in watching them for a game against Barnsley, Port Vale etc...its the same with us, we have actually taken over 40k to Wembley but plenty of that 40k wouldn't regularly watch us....deluded is an understatement.

What are you talking about?? Everyone absolutely adores them. 

[BetterRedthanBlue]

14 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

The issue is, and the new guy has admitted it, the Few are totally reliant on the Developers of the site being able to make it work. If the numbers don’t stack up things will either be delayed until they do or worse for them the Developer could just flip the site, get their money back and run. It’s not uncommon.

A proper stadium of 20k seats, if done properly, could easily set the Developer back £50m plus. It won’t have dawned on our blue cousins that there is a lot of work to be done before a design is tabled let alone a spade put in the ground. You’re also looking at a the best part of two years to build it.

No wonder the newbie is asking for patience. Could be five years away if there aren’t huge obstacles to overcome.

Brentford's 17k seater cost £71m. Plough Lane which is 9k cost £34m.

I'd say you'd be looking at £65-80m for the stadium as costs will have gone up since Brentford built their stadium.

[Bristol Rob]

25 minutes ago, weepywall said:

Those inflated Wembley attendances they continuously harp on about FFS, I know plenty that went to Wembley with Rovers just for a day out, they would have no interest in watching them for a game against Barnsley, Port Vale etc...its the same with us, we have actually taken over 40k to Wembley but plenty of that 40k wouldn't regularly watch us....deluded is an understatement.

It's a family day out, one die hard wants to take the kids, which in turn means the Doris, who then decides she ought to invite her parents along to share the burden of the kids, but it would be wrong to not invite his folks as well and before you know it, one fan turns in to 8 tickets.

[1960maaan]

42 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

In the interview Hussain Al-Saeed states that he hopes the developer will build the stadium for them in return for getting the Memorial Stadium site. Out of interest, does anyone know the value of the land at Horfield?  Rovers are talking about getting a 17,000 seater stadium but the figures don’t add up. As a comparison, York City’s new 8,500 capacity ground cost £44m to build, and work started on that 6 years ago. 

Going back to Sainsbury days, they were willing to pay over the odds because of the size and where it was. When that fell through the only other interest that I remember was housing which was around £20m. 
Now I don't know how land values have move since 2015, but the cost of building has gone up and that surely means profits are reduced so no one will be throwing money around. Even if you think that land has risen by half, £30m is well short of a decent stadium, as others have said you'd be looking at around £2.5k - £3k per seat , for a decent Stadium.
Brentford's ground (17,200) cost £70m.
Wimbledon ( 9,300) £30m +
Anyone taking the Memorial site as payment would want to make a profit even if they were fans. Plus as has been said  "The Covenant on the land, explicitly states that it should be used for sport or recreation, for the benefit of the community, in perpetuity" 
The figures don't seem to add up.
I wonder if they regret not becoming renters at the UWE.

[bcfc01]

Just now, BetterRedthanBlue said:

Brentford's 17k seater cost £71m. Plough Lane which is 9k cost £34m.

I'd say you'd be looking at £65-80m for the stadium as costs will have gone up since Brentford built their stadium.

London prices for Brentford and Wimbledon.

 

[Bristol Rob]

3 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

London prices for Brentford and Wimbledon.

 

Cost of the land is a MASSIVE factor. And also part of the reason I struggle to watch Four In A Bed on Channel 4.

Yes, you can charge £25 for a night in your B&B in Blackpool because the building cost you a pigeon, 2 loaves of Hovis and a greyhound. But why moan about the fella offering a night in London for asking £125 for a similar experience when his guest house cost 2mil+

[Lanterne Rouge]

Brentford`s was a bugger to build as well given what was around it.

[bcfc01]

1 minute ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

Brentford`s was a bugger to build as well given what was around it.

Must be one of the smallest footprints for a stadium in the country.

Luton may rival it.

[pillred]

It looks like a young construction worker has died at the building of the new Everton stadium very sad news.

[Numero Uno]

22 minutes ago, BetterRedthanBlue said:

Brentford's 17k seater cost £71m. Plough Lane which is 9k cost £34m.

I'd say you'd be looking at £65-80m for the stadium as costs will have gone up since Brentford built their stadium.

With a developer building it I can see the gas stadium coming in a bit cheaper but it won’t be the shiny glossy, better than they gurt teds model they are expecting. It certainly won’t be 28k capacity either.

[pillred]

3 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

With a developer building it I can see the gas stadium coming in a bit cheaper but it won’t be the shiny glossy, better than they gurt teds model they are expecting. It certainly won’t be 28k capacity either.

Didn't the Lansdown stand cost £90 million alone?

[Quedgeley Exile]

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

Covenant paperwork conveniently not able to be found at the time of the Sainsbury farce.

 

Rovers binned everything belonging to Bristol Rugby when they took control or the ground.  

[The Gasbuster]

1 minute ago, pillred said:

Didn't the Lansdown stand cost £90 million alone?

Using sag logic, then yes.

Actual total for AG rebuild was £45M-£50M.

[Numero Uno]

5 minutes ago, pillred said:

Didn't the Lansdown stand cost £90 million alone?

They will get what the developer can afford to build them. That reality won’t hit them for a while………

[Bonkey Dollocks]

27 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Cost of the land is a MASSIVE factor. And also part of the reason I struggle to watch Four In A Bed on Channel 4.

Yes, you can charge £25 for a night in your B&B in Blackpool because the building cost you a pigeon, 2 loaves of Hovis and a greyhound. But why moan about the fella offering a night in London for asking £125 for a similar experience when his guest house cost 2mil+

Oddly specific

I can think of hundreds of reasons not to watch Four in a Bed on Channel 4. Cost of the land is way down the list tbf

[Open End Numb Legs]

Rovers media team are filming a spin off series - Four in a Stand.

[Port Said Red]

3 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Rovers media team are filming a spin off series - Four in a Stand.

First they have to find a stand to film in.  

[chinapig]

4 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Rovers media team are filming a spin off series - Four in a Stand.

Shouldn't that be Forty Thousand in a Stand?

[ExiledAjax]

10 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Rovers media team are filming a spin off series - Four in a Stand.

Four in a Tent?

[bcfc01]

Looking at the land registry, there is a covenant from 1917 which prohibits the land being used for anything other than sporting activity. It also states that no building related to sporting activity shall be over 10 feet in height.

It was updated in 1921 to say that the height restriction has been deleted.

Cost £3 to find that out, thats one less pint tonight 

[View from the Dolman]

Seems like a perfectly reasonable way to run a football club... 

 

[pongo88]

56 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

London prices for Brentford and Wimbledon.

 

That’s true, but York City’s ground which holds 8,500 cost £44m, with the build starting 6 years ago. The ground includes a leisure complex and a community hub, so let’s say £35m ish just for the stadium which is roughly the same as Wimbledon. However, York started building 6 years ago and Wimbledon 4years, so allowing for building cost inflation it’s approx £40m ish for 8,500 seats 

[Rudolf Hucker]

8 minutes ago, View from the Dolman said:

Seems like a perfectly reasonable way to run a football club... 

 

If Harvey is anything like Arno’s he’ll be dead good. 

[Bristol Rob]

30 minutes ago, Bonkey Dollocks said:

Oddly specific

I can think of hundreds of reasons not to watch Four in a Bed on Channel 4. Cost of the land is way down the list tbf

Alright. I'll level with you.

It's one of my guilty TV pleasures.

 

[bcfc01]

Harvey Vale was the Captain of the U20 team that won the euro champs.

Team mate of Alex Scott.

 

[weepywall]

2 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Harvey Vale was the Captain of the U20 team that won the euro champs.

Team mate of Alex Scott.

 

Looks like a good signing to be fair.

[Sleepy1968]

8 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

What? He tells his subscribers first! That’s mental. 

I think his usual  release order is

1. OnlyFans

2. Insta

3. Twitter/X

4. Facebook

5. OS

[bcfc01]

2 minutes ago, weepywall said:

Looks like a good signing to be fair.

Not sure.

76 minutes in the EFL with Hull last season.

Time will tell, good player for England u20 tbf.

[Bristol Rob]

5 minutes ago, weepywall said:

Looks like a good signing to be fair.

Unless you have ambition to develop your own players, in which case a concerned parent would never let their child sign for them as the pathway is blocked.

[David Brent]

16 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Harvey Vale was the Captain of the U20 team that won the euro champs.

Team mate of Alex Scott.

 

I wonder why Hull gave him very little game time in our division 
 

[bcfc01]

6 minutes ago, David Brent said:

I wonder why Hull gave him very little game time in our division 
 

Its a hell of a jump straight from youth football to the Championship. Watching the U20s confirmed that.

Scott is an anomaly..along with a couple of others from that team.

Edited August 14, 2023 by bcfc01

[StGeorge]

41 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Cost £3 to find that out, thats one less pint tonight 

Spoons?

[BS3City]

Probably a decent signing for the Blue Few, but they do seem to have shelled out a few quid on signings / wages this summer in their desperation to catch / match us.

Surely the idea is flawed though? If they don't make it it's an expensive gamble, with little prospect of any significant rise in income (over and above the current stand fiasco) until they get a new stadium (which looks years away at best). However if they did fluke promotion I don't believe the financial rewards of The Championship are sufficient to make it worthwhile anyway, and even if it was I'd guess the amount of investment necessary to give them a fighting chance of playing survival would be on a level they are incapable of sustaining with the current regime.

Therefore, it looks like a gamble to make them a more attractive investment opportunity perhaps?

OTIBers with far superior financial knowledge than me please correct my understanding if I'm wrong.

In the meanwhile FTG...

[Bristol Rob]

16 minutes ago, StGeorge said:

Spoons?

For a half.

[Ska Junkie]

When the Atyeo is discussed, I appreciate we do things properly, not cheaply, the discussion surrounded £1k per seat so a South stand at the Atyeo end would cost £7M for 2000 extra seats. 

Was that right or was I dreaming?

[Open End Numb Legs]

I guess the final Atyeo cost would have included the addition of the previous changing rooms and facilities?

[petehinton]

25 minutes ago, BS3City said:

Probably a decent signing for the Blue Few, but they do seem to have shelled out a few quid on signings / wages this summer in their desperation to catch / match us.

Surely the idea is flawed though? If they don't make it it's an expensive gamble, with little prospect of any significant rise in income (over and above the current stand fiasco) until they get a new stadium (which looks years away at best). However if they did fluke promotion I don't believe the financial rewards of The Championship are sufficient to make it worthwhile anyway, and even if it was I'd guess the amount of investment necessary to give them a fighting chance of playing survival would be on a level they are incapable of sustaining with the current regime.

Therefore, it looks like a gamble to make them a more attractive investment opportunity perhaps?

OTIBers with far superior financial knowledge than me please correct my understanding if I'm wrong.

In the meanwhile FTG...

They’re going for broke this season. They’ll be hugely over budget especially given the lost revenue of the stand. L1 is very weak this season, so they will probably finish top half/10. Would think they’ll be in a bit of bother next season. 

[James54De]

1 hour ago, pillred said:

Didn't the Lansdown stand cost £90 million alone?

Hahaha, no. ~£52 million for the whole redevelopment I think. 

[pillred]

33 minutes ago, James54De said:

Hahaha, no. ~£52 million for the whole redevelopment I think. 

That now seems like a bargain, I bet it would probably cost double that now.

[luke_bristol]

18 minutes ago, pillred said:

That now seems like a bargain, I bet it would probably cost double that now.

Building materials are very expensive since covid and the global supply chain issues that caused. Even the impact of the Suez Canal blockage is still causing issues in international shipping.

[SirColinOfMansfield]

3 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

Four in a Tent?

They have signed a new player so there are five of them now!

[bcfc01]

3 hours ago, StGeorge said:

Spoons?

Wash your mouth out.

 

[Simpleton Gas]

6 hours ago, petehinton said:

They’re going for broke this season. They’ll be hugely over budget especially given the lost revenue of the stand. L1 is very weak this season, so they will probably finish top half/10. Would think they’ll be in a bit of bother next season. 

Is the Championship much better? Luton and Sheffield United are bang average sides who got promoted last season.

L1 includes Bolton and Barnsley, two clubs who have played in the PL within living memory, unlike BCFC. 

And as for being over budget...planks and splinters come to mind. 

[Simpleton Gas]

8 hours ago, weepywall said:

Looks like a good signing to be fair.

Elliot Anderson was a huge success for BRFC, winning national plaudits, and Barton has a good eye for a midfielder. 

BRFC signed two promising players from Chelsea before - Colkett and Clarke-Salter. Great things were expected of the former, but he struggled to live up to the physical demands of the league and had his loan cancelled early before briefly resurfacing at Swindon. 

The latter didn't live up to the billing, but subsequently became a championship-level player (QPR, mind)

With the exception of a very few, it is extremely hard to tell at this stage if players will make it. 

 

[Monkeh]

1 hour ago, Hot Air said:

Is the Championship much better? Luton and Sheffield United are bang average sides who got promoted last season.

L1 includes Bolton and Barnsley, two clubs who have played in the PL within living memory, unlike BCFC. 

And as for being over budget...planks and splinters come to mind. 

Yes it's much better then again a non league club over.achieving wouldn't know that

Edited August 15, 2023 by Monkeh

[BetterRedthanBlue]

1 hour ago, Hot Air said:

Is the Championship much better? Luton and Sheffield United are bang average sides who got promoted last season.

L1 includes Bolton and Barnsley, two clubs who have played in the PL within living memory, unlike BCFC. 

And as for being over budget...planks and splinters come to mind. 

Sheffield United are now a yo yo club who have financial means well above most championship teams.

As for Luton they are there on merit whilst at the same time there's always an anomaly in a season. Luton /Coventry last season, Huddersfield in 21/22. Barnsley in 20/21 etc

[Bar BS3]

2 hours ago, Hot Air said:

L1 includes Bolton and Barnsley, two clubs who have played in the PL within living memory, unlike BCFC. 

Reading, Derby, Charlton, Portsmouth, Blackpool, Wigan (Ipswich a bit longer ago) ......

[Taz]

11 hours ago, weepywall said:

Looks like a good signing to be fair.

 

11 hours ago, bcfc01 said:

Not sure.

76 minutes in the EFL with Hull last season.

Time will tell, good player for England u20 tbf.

I raise you Taylor Moore. 

[petehinton]

3 hours ago, Hot Air said:

Is the Championship much better? Luton and Sheffield United are bang average sides who got promoted last season.

L1 includes Bolton and Barnsley, two clubs who have played in the PL within living memory, unlike BCFC. 

And as for being over budget...planks and splinters come to mind. 

Deary me

[glynriley]

4 hours ago, Hot Air said:

Is the Championship much better? Luton and Sheffield United are bang average sides who got promoted last season.

L1 includes Bolton and Barnsley, two clubs who have played in the PL within living memory, unlike BCFC. 

And as for being over budget...planks and splinters come to mind. 

I bet you were itching to put '82' on the end of that...

[supercidered]

22 minutes ago, petehinton said:

Deary me

“Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

― Mark Twain

[Open End Numb Legs]

4 hours ago, Hot Air said:

.....planks and splinters come to mind. 

Thanks for bringing the stadium back into the conversation.

If Rovers spend big and get promoted then fair enough, any promotion is tough, but the wage bills for the various divisions tell the story about what is needed in terms of quality, there is a big difference.

Having an 'eye for midfielders' is not enough in itself if the signings are all loans.

The joint owners have one thing right, these things do take time. Why they then try to take short cuts is a mystery.

[Bar BS3]

20 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Thanks for bringing the stadium back into the conversation.

If Rovers spend big and get promoted then fair enough, any promotion is tough, but the wage bills for the various divisions tell the story about what is needed in terms of quality, there is a big difference.

Having an 'eye for midfielders' is not enough in itself if the signings are all loans.

The joint owners have one thing right, these things do take time. Why they then try to take short cuts is a mystery.

I think the "these things take time" probably referred to their temporary new stand...!

[Leveller]

4 hours ago, Hot Air said:

Elliot Anderson was a huge success for BRFC, winning national plaudits, and Barton has a good eye for a midfielder. 

BRFC signed two promising players from Chelsea before - Colkett and Clarke-Salter. Great things were expected of the former, but he struggled to live up to the physical demands of the league and had his loan cancelled early before briefly resurfacing at Swindon. 

The latter didn't live up to the billing, but subsequently became a championship-level player (QPR, mind)

With the exception of a very few, it is extremely hard to tell at this stage if players will make it. 

 

The new owner seems to be an unknown quantity. It will be interesting to see if he is willing to put in funds to follow the Fruitihad dream and upgrade the team. And will Wael be sidelined now he’s just a minority shareholder?

[petehinton]

replies are gold

[Port Said Red]

28 minutes ago, Leveller said:

The new owner seems to be an unknown quantity. It will be interesting to see if he is willing to put in funds to follow the Fruitihad dream and upgrade the team. And will Wael be sidelined now he’s just a minority shareholder?

What do we think the chances are that he is both an unknown quantity and has sufficient funds necessary to spend on a football club over a significant period of restructuring? 

[Open End Numb Legs]

33 minutes ago, petehinton said:

replies are gold

Could you paste some onto here please?

I don't do Twitter so can't see them.

[petehinton]

6 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Could you paste some onto here please?

I don't do Twitter so can't see them.

 

[BS3 Ark at Ee]

One of their posters claims we’ve stagnated in the championship and only get crowds of 12-15,000 these days  That’s odd considering we’ve got just shy of 15,000 season ticket holders!

Edited August 15, 2023 by BS3 Ark at Ee

[Leveller]

2 minutes ago, BS3 Ark at Ee said:

One of their posters claims we’ve stagnated in the championship and only get crowds of 12-15,000 these days  That’s odd considering we’ve got just shy of 15,000 season ticket holders!

This is the old argument about tickets sold v. actual bums on seats.

[Open End Numb Legs]

Thanks for the Twitter pastes.

You can understand the frustration from the average fans who pay good money when times are hard and expect better. Success on the pitch is never easy, treating your fanbase with respect can be planned for.

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

44 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Could you paste some onto here please?

I don't do Twitter so can't see them.

 

8 minutes ago, BS3 Ark at Ee said:

One of their posters claims we’ve stagnated in the championship and only get crowds of 12-15,000 these days  That’s odd considering we’ve got just shy of 15,000 season ticket holders!

Eh? 

[LilRascal]

 

Maybe stream the urinals through to the Fanta taps? 

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

13 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Thanks for the Twitter pastes.

You can understand the frustration from the average fans who pay good money when times are hard and expect better. Success on the pitch is never easy, treating your fanbase with respect can be planned for.

They've got the club their supporters deserve.

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

15 minutes ago, Leveller said:

This is the old argument about tickets sold v. actual bums on seats.

Our attendances and theirs are calculated on tickets sold. As we’ve seen often especially at certain times of the year (ie Summer Holidays, Christmas) not everyone who has a ST will be there.

To suggest that we only get, on average, 12-15k though is rubbish. 

They love to point out that we are merely ‘treading water’ in the Championship but would they get the sort of crowds we get if they were in the bottom 10 in this division for the best part of 3 years? No chance.

 

 

[BS3 Ark at Ee]

It’s the same for every club. So if their average attendance is 8,500 then we can claim they get about 5,500 that actually attend then

[BS3 Ark at Ee]

They just love to pluck random figures out the sky and claim it as fact,

[Monkeh]

1 hour ago, petehinton said:

 

Fair play to those, the gas are normally blowing smoke up the clubs ass, more and more are starting to see them for what they actually are