Mr Lansdown Just Stick With It!

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, Red Exile said:

I take your point, which is a good one. But I mention Burnley because I recall a discussion on here years ago about their structure. I'd met their Chairman and one of their directors at an event. Humble, down to earth, wealthy but very first among equals, a bunch of local businessmen with a love of the club, all supporting and challenging each other. The contrast with SL's City could not have been greater. Their approach seemed sustainable not in the financial sense but in the sense of involving the local community. It wasn't open to the accusation, however unfair, that it was all a bit of an ego trip. And as it happens it was far more successful. They were, also as it happens, passionate football people. I don't believe that SL is a football person...or, frankly, even much of a City fan in the sense that most of us are.

That's a very interesting insight, thanks.

The behind the scenes there sounds interesting- pushing each other on, challenging- we've possibly missed that here, fair points- SL's way or the highway at times? They were fans then, the Burnley owners?

Whether SL is a fan of us- certainly doesn't have a football background- I'll leave for others to comment on, never met him so can't really offer any view on that.

Certainly he's not beyond criticism though, SL...I would question why he let LJ sign and sell so many players- I appreciate some of it due to financial reasons but I always thought the churn in his time here was shocking, wasteful off the pitch and destroys cohesion on it. Possibly down to Ashton as well.

Not pushing on in January 2008, a wasted opportunity- could be argued 2008/09 as well...then was GJ the man to get the best from Sno, Hartley, Sabario etc in 2009/10? Although his record would suggest keeping him the only realistic option.

Not making the playoffs at least once between 2017/18 and 2019/20, but especially the 2017/18 season- that was not ideal yet we could arguably have pushed a bit harder in Jan 2019 without going nuts- could one more striker have made the difference?

Or one more genuine CM given Hegeler had gone through injury and Korey missed most of the season- to not flog Brownhill and Pack to death or put a 3rd CM in there to ease the burden a bit.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Mr Popodopolous

[Red Exile]

19 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

That's a very interesting insight, thanks.

The behind the scenes there sounds interesting- pushing each other on, challenging- we've possibly missed that here, fair points- SL's way or the highway at times? They were fans then, the Burnley owners?

Whether SL is a fan of us- certainly doesn't have a football background- I'll leave for others to comment on, never met him so can't really offer any view on that.

Certainly he's not beyond criticism though, SL...I would question why he let LJ sign and sell so many players- I appreciate some of it due to financial reasons but I always thought the churn in his time here was shocking, wasteful off the pitch and destroys cohesion on it. Possibly down to Ashton as well.

Not pushing on in January 2008, a wasted opportunity- could be argued 2008/09 as well...then was GJ the man to get the best from Sno, Hartley, Sabario etc in 2009/10? Although his record would suggest keeping him the only realistic option.

Not making the playoffs at least once between 2017/18 and 2019/20, but especially the 2017/18 season- that was not ideal yet we could arguably have pushed a bit harder in Jan 2019 without going nuts- could one more striker have made the difference?

Or one more genuine CM given Hegeler had gone through injury and Korey missed most of the season- to not flog Brownhill and Pack to death or put a 3rd CM in there to ease the burden a bit.

To be honest I think whether one more signing might or might not have made a difference makes for a good discussion but - to my mind - misses the point. Lee Johnson should never have been the man to succeed Cotts, any more than Tinnion was the man to replace Danny Wilson, or Millen to (after the Coppell debacle) replace GJ...what was needed in 2015/16 was the appointment of an experienced manager with a track record of achieving success at Championship level. Any number of folk on here questioned all of those appointments, and that of Mark Ashton, we live with the consequences.

EDIT: I have reached the conclusion that I can barely be arsed to care any more...it's rinse and repeat...again.

 

Edited November 4, 2021 by Red Exile

[Supersonic Robin]

1 hour ago, Alessandro said:

Depending on which side you're bread's buttered you can make the comparison either way for us versus other clubs, successful or otherwise.

As for other clubs wishing to be 'in our position'? Well the majority no doubt wouldn't. We've had very little to cheer on the pitch for 20 years, so very few would swap for that. 

But i'm sure, when you look at the position we are in; recent stadium development, new training ground, stable owner, relatively financially stable club, commercial viability, catchment area, been established in the championship for 6 years etc...i'm sure there are many who would and do envy us, perhaps not in on field success, but in other ways.

Would you rather be like Hull or Cardiff, with a few seasons of 'success' - but at what cost? 

I do sort of see where you're coming from - looking to the long term future, I'd perhaps rather be in our position than many other teams due to our ultimate overall potential.

However, if we're simply looking back on the last couple of decades, it's very very hard to make an argument that we'd be the preferable choice.
How many Hull and Cardiff fans are on their forums saying "Were those seasons of success really worth it when we could have had what Bristol City have?". 

[Fuber]

7 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

We have no idea if Pearson is the right person for the job. So far his team are getting worse the longer he works with them. 

Which coincides with him sacking the two coaches the most hands on with the players; he gave them a chance, they've failed; he's a delegator more than hands on, he's since learned he couldn't trust the coaches under him.

[And Its Smith]

5 minutes ago, Fuber said:

Which coincides with him sacking the two coaches the most hands on with the players; he gave them a chance, they've failed; he's a delegator more than hands on, he's since learned he couldn't trust the coaches under him.

Guess we will very soon see if it was the coaches fault or not. 

[Fuber]

19 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Guess we will very soon see if it was the coaches fault or not. 

Will see, I'll be judging it over the next 5 games once we have similar players available.

I have a feeling losing James when we have - let's hope its not too serious - could severely hamper us. As I personally think losing Nagy is going to be tougher on us than we may have realised, especially with King injured, and Bakinson on his current form; as in nowhere near good enough for this level this season.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Fuber

[Wiltshire robin]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Football in the top 2 tiers is a highly expensive business with no guarantees- albeit had he gone for it in past times, we might have shot up to the PL- thinking in January 2008 and failing that, 2008/09 to push on from Wembley.

How much did Chansiri put into SWFC? Or Morris into Derby? From might I add, a stronger and notably stronger respectively starting position than SL when he took over. What have Reading achieved for their overspending from 2017/18 onwards .Again a playoff season in 2016/17 and then the new owners could give it a go for a year or 2...above us on GD that's where.

QPR had a number of billionaires in charge from 2010 to a few years ago- they must be in the PL on a regular...oh no, wait- they're back at this level and had some seasons of struggle or relative struggle in recent times.

But all of those teams have had at least some success to talk about , we’ve had absolutely f all (unless anyone thinks the jpt and league 1 is an achievement for the top club in one of England’s biggest cities)

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, Fuber said:

Will see, I'll be judging it over the next 5 games once we have similar players available.

I have a feeling losing James when we have - let's hope its not too serious - could severely hamper us. As I personally think losing Nagy is going to be tougher on us than we may have realised, especially with King injured, and Bakinson on his current form; as in nowhere near good enough for this level this season.

I thought losing Nagy wasn't a great thing at all IMO, albeit I understand the wage saving from a financial perspective but he showed some versatility towards the back end of last season- narrow right, goal and assist v Luton, goal or assist- unsure which- at Wycombe. Narrow right could have helped us out in midfield, being one who could go central and a bit wider. Even if not spectacular, he could have offered a bit of stability.

Plays strongly for Hungary as we know- was he not fairly solid/steady at Wembley not long ago?

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, Wiltshire robin said:

But all of those teams have had at least some success to talk about , we’ve had absolutely f all (unless anyone thinks the jpt and league 1 is an achievement for the top club in one of England’s biggest cities)

If we mean over history or just in certain time periods, agree.

Historically we are surely significant underachievers. In the last 10-20 years though I do sort of to an extent stand by what I said about football being an increasingly expensive business- the Championship eg is a money pit. Although not everywhere and there are notable examples to point to of sides who surpassed us with less- Swansea a fine example. Brentford too.

I don't know, I'm somewhere in the middle I guess.

[IAmNick]

The thing is this recent period, and Gary's in the Championship before it (so 2008 onwards) have been more successful than about 30 years before it.

We actually had better finishes last time we were in the Championship (4th, 10th, 10th) compared to this time (only one top 10 finish).

It doesn't really feel good, let alone exciting though because of our "slow and steady" approach where 1 position further up the table is a pat on the back. It never feels like we're pushing on, driving for promotion, and going for it... we just bumble around in a reasonable area and hope we squeeze over the line (and inevitably don't).

It's football, give me the boom and bust of Hull/Cardiff/Swansea any day imo.

I'd rather be having an extra few pints in celebration, then crying into them 2 years later than having one to numb me before every game for about 10 years on the trot.

[Davefevs]

5 hours ago, lenred said:

Said it before numerous times. Give me their journey over ours any time of day or night! Imagine the memories they’ve had over the time SL has been in charge.  Maybe Cov’s good times were slightly before but still. Would take any of their recent (25 year) history over ours. 

5 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

I doubt a single Cardiff fan would want to swap places with us. In the last 15 years they've won promotion to the Prem twice and been in an FA Cup and League Cup final. 

I agree with you both to a large extent…..even having an owner who tucked his trousers under his armpits.

There is more than one way to run a club, plan for success, achieve success etc.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, billywedlock said:

There has not been a strategy . It has been random and superficial . It has changed with the wind. When it worked we were smug , when it did not work we were bemused because we had no idea what had happened .

There has not been a playing identity . It has been random and superficial . It has changed with the wind. When it worked we were smug , when it did not work we were bemused because we had no idea what had happened .

[Rebounder]

I always feel that he's made a rod for his own back. 

Every time we come up the talk is always about promotion and that sets a tone of expectation and promise. Of course this has to be the aim, but I am sure that if he had said that the first aim is to build and maintain a solid championship club with a positive playing identity that this would have been accepted. 

Ultimately that would have been more than we'd ever had in my lifetime as a "big" league one club and it may well have clicked at one point resulting in a promotion. I always feel that talk of promotion was a big arrogant in a league like this and I am not sure that many other clubs our size talk this way and some of the "smaller" ones that passed us did so methodically without fanfare. 

I hate the rebuild now as I feel it's sucked the little bit of life that was left from when I started going in the mid-90's. It's the same problem that Cardiff and Swansea have now. It is no coincidence that games against Cardiff feel shit compared to past, but I also recognise that the games moved on and this is probably the only way to survive. I am sure that there are many who would hate to go back to the old and they are probably the future and are more likely to spend in other areas of the ground. 

He has shown a disdain to lower income fans imo, but billionaire owners often don't understand this reality so he's not unique,  and he has also often got it wrong when it comes to fans who want to make an atmosphere. Problem is that people will sacrifice a lot of that for on the field success/excitement as they did at Cardiff, but that has not happened.

The team is as sterile as the ground - Can you see any future Murray's, Tinnion's, Gow's or Gus Ceasers in this team? It doesn't even have to be linked to success as Albert Adomah proves. Fans like players that get them off their seat, or are absolute battlers who achieve a certain level of performance. 

Also though I am just getting old and the "characters" as I see them in football are slowly dying in the face of an ultra professional, public facing and highly athletic billion dollar industry. 

Went massively off topic there I realise, but I do respect Lansdown for what he has done and I am aware we could have much worse, but he is also part of the problem with football in my opinion. I don't even mind the Bristol sport stuff as I can kind of see what he's trying to do there having also done a tour of Barcelona's stadium myself once.

Do feel it's better the devil you know, but even if it did go tits up I am sure there would still be people around to fight for its existence. 

Edited November 5, 2021 by Rebounder

[Rocking Red Cyril]

SL has given us great Ashton gate and held to he clubs finances together . Yes we need players and quick. But sure FFP has a big effect on that. 

Always red

 

COYR

[Sir Geoff]

6 hours ago, Rebounder said:

I always feel that he's made a rod for his own back. 

Every time we come up the talk is always about promotion and that sets a tone of expectation and promise. Of course this has to be the aim, but I am sure that if he had said that the first aim is to build and maintain a solid championship club with a positive playing identity that this would have been accepted. 

Ultimately that would have been more than we'd ever had in my lifetime as a "big" league one club and it may well have clicked at one point resulting in a promotion. I always feel that talk of promotion was a big arrogant in a league like this and I am not sure that many other clubs our size talk this way and some of the "smaller" ones that passed us did so methodically without fanfare. 

I hate the rebuild now as I feel it's sucked the little bit of life that was left from when I started going in the mid-90's. It's the same problem that Cardiff and Swansea have now. It is no coincidence that games against Cardiff feel shit compared to past, but I also recognise that the games moved on and this is probably the only way to survive. I am sure that there are many who would hate to go back to the old and they are probably the future and are more likely to spend in other areas of the ground. 

He has shown a disdain to lower income fans imo, but billionaire owners often don't understand this reality so he's not unique,  and he has also often got it wrong when it comes to fans who want to make an atmosphere. Problem is that people will sacrifice a lot of that for on the field success/excitement as they did at Cardiff, but that has not happened.

The team is as sterile as the ground - Can you see any future Murray's, Tinnion's, Gow's or Gus Ceasers in this team? It doesn't even have to be linked to success as Albert Adomah proves. Fans like players that get them off their seat, or are absolute battlers who achieve a certain level of performance. 

Also though I am just getting old and the "characters" as I see them in football are slowly dying in the face of an ultra professional, public facing and highly athletic billion dollar industry. 

Went massively off topic there I realise, but I do respect Lansdown for what he has done and I am aware we could have much worse, but he is also part of the problem with football in my opinion. I don't even mind the Bristol sport stuff as I can kind of see what he's trying to do there having also done a tour of Barcelona's stadium myself once.

Do feel it's better the devil you know, but even if it did go tits up I am sure there would still be people around to fight for its existence. 

Yes we have 11 of them in the team....in fact Gus Ceaser was so poor he probably wouldn't even get in this side.

[GrahamC]

8 hours ago, Davefevs said:

There has not been a playing identity . It has been random and superficial . It has changed with the wind. When it worked we were smug , when it did not work we were bemused because we had no idea what had happened .

Depends how far you want to go back, but I’d argue there has been, but it has entirely depended on who is the manager/head coach, what there certainly hasn’t been is a consistent one.

This leads on to recruitment which has been haphazard & scattergun, obvious examples being Adelakun & Watkins (it is arguable we needed either, certainly not both), the Szmodics, Palmer, Paterson all at the same time nonsense & very many others.

Bigger picture here (& this has certainly been said before) is SL has employed people in a football sense who have performed so poorly that Hargreaves Lansdown would have never been the success that it is if it happened there.

Fundamentally he just doesn’t understand the football industry, which is fine, but his judgment on who to trust because of this is largely what is holding us back.

Whatever anyone’s views on Pearson, it is typical of us that we get exactly the right “type” when someone else has already spent all the money & we are in an era that reminds me most of when Osman took over from Denis Smith, “here’s £100k Russell, now build us a team that can stay up”..

[Waconda]

13 hours ago, Fuber said:

Which coincides with him sacking the two coaches the most hands on with the players; he gave them a chance, they've failed; he's a delegator more than hands on, he's since learned he couldn't trust the coaches under him.

Are you sure they were sacked ?

Would check that - IMO.

[Waconda]

12 hours ago, Fuber said:

Will see, I'll be judging it over the next 5 games once we have similar players available.

I have a feeling losing James when we have - let's hope its not too serious - could severely hamper us. As I personally think losing Nagy is going to be tougher on us than we may have realised, especially with King injured, and Bakinson on his current form; as in nowhere near good enough for this level this season.

Agree with this.

Nagy would be very useful to us at the moment.

Seems he was determined to leave though.

[Pezo]

16 hours ago, Red Exile said:

And then Lee Johnson was such an ego trip of an appointment...'I'll show them...'

nice though the stand he named after himself might be.

He has stated that he thought it was too early for LJ in his management career but was convinced by LJ eventually, hardly sounds like an ego trip.

He didn't name the stand, he actually said something along the lines of if someone names a stand after me I will fire them. It was a board decision - a board he no longer sits on.

Other than getting basic facts wrong your post makes quite a bit of sense.

[Davefevs]

47 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Depends how far you want to go back, but I’d argue there has been, but it has entirely depended on who is the manager/head coach, what there certainly hasn’t been is a consistent one.

This leads on to recruitment which has been haphazard & scattergun, obvious examples being Adelakun & Watkins (it is arguable we needed either, certainly not both), the Szmodics, Palmer, Paterson all at the same time nonsense & very many others.

Bigger picture here (& this has certainly been said before) is SL has employed people in a football sense who have performed so poorly that Hargreaves Lansdown would have never been the success that it is if it happened there.

Fundamentally he just doesn’t understand the football industry, which is fine, but his judgment on who to trust because of this is largely what is holding us back.

Whatever anyone’s views on Pearson, it is typical of us that we get exactly the right “type” when someone else has already spent all the money & we are in an era that reminds me most of when Osman took over from Denis Smith, “here’s £100k Russell, now build us a team that can stay up”..

Back to Cotts for a consistent playing identity.

I don’t think LJ had one.  He had short periods of success with lots of different identities, and short periods of failure with those and others.  Even the autumn of 17/18 never turned into “right, I’ve got my philosophy, everything is now geared to that”.

I bet if you asked most fans where we fell down in 17/18, it was knackering Smith and Pack, because when he rotated Brownhill centrally he lost what he brought wide, and when he put Bryan back to LB he lost what he brought down that left side.

He recruited in the summer of 2018.

Webster to replace Flint,

Weimann to replace Reid,

Assume O’Dowda was the Bryan replacement, which was fair enough at the time.

For me the combo of Reid / Paterson was consigned to the bin, because he had to accommodate Diedhiou, his record signing at the time, who didn’t fit the system he got going!

But tye obvious omission was the central midfielder to compete with Pack and Smith.  If he felt that Brownhill was that player, then was Watkins / Adelakun really the RM/RW replacement for Brownhill?  The answer is no!

That season was in fact the lowest number of players signed and lowest fees paid in his 4 seasons here.

[chinapig]

34 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Back to Cotts for a consistent playing identity.

I don’t think LJ had one.  He had short periods of success with lots of different identities, and short periods of failure with those and others.  Even the autumn of 17/18 never turned into “right, I’ve got my philosophy, everything is now geared to that”.

I bet if you asked most fans where we fell down in 17/18, it was knackering Smith and Pack, because when he rotated Brownhill centrally he lost what he brought wide, and when he put Bryan back to LB he lost what he brought down that left side.

He recruited in the summer of 2018.

Webster to replace Flint,

Weimann to replace Reid,

Assume O’Dowda was the Bryan replacement, which was fair enough at the time.

For me the combo of Reid / Paterson was consigned to the bin, because he had to accommodate Diedhiou, his record signing at the time, who didn’t fit the system he got going!

But tye obvious omission was the central midfielder to compete with Pack and Smith.  If he felt that Brownhill was that player, then was Watkins / Adelakun really the RM/RW replacement for Brownhill?  The answer is no!

That season was in fact the lowest number of players signed and lowest fees paid in his 4 seasons here.

For me the signing of Fammy was a pivotal point as you suggest. When he came in LJ said he wanted to play a quick passing, high pressing game, which was music to my ears and which he delivered for a period.

But as soon as you bring in a big man to lead your attack that goes out of the window. Then he never found a way of playing that fitted Fammy's strengths (clue: he isn't a target man).

I have no idea why he went down that road, though I wonder whether Fammy was one of those "trading club" signings - get a season or two out of him then sell at a profit and ignore whether he fits a playing philosophy.

[cidered abroad]

My first match at Bristol City. April 1950 a Third Division (South) against Aldershot. Harry Dolman had just taken over as the Chairman. The first eleven years we finished below Bristol Rovers who operated a "No Buy / No Sell" policy under a very good football manager.

I was football mad as a young boy. I also loved cricket and rugby, still do. I dreamt of City being in the FA Cup Final at Wembley and in the First Division. My Welsh father took me to Cardiff City, First Divsion, when we went to see Nana.

Promotion in 1955 with a mgnificent City team. HD was not shy with his money but goofed up with Peter Doherty so back to Div 3. Another five years to go up, followed by one year missing promotion to Division One by a gnat's whisker.

The AD with several relegation scraps before his youth policy began to work. After 65 years, we got back to where we should be. Harry D by this time was an old tired person and was surrounded by a board of greedy, selfish idiots. Sensible investment in players would have seen us stay there for a long time. Board and others, skimming of thousands of £'s. 36,000 gate for Man U turned out as 27,000 and the same for every home game. Save on the VAT, police numbers at matches and bring in players who were not good enough for Division 3.

So there ended my dream of us competing with the big clubs. Back to 2, 3 and 4 in successive years and financial disaster.

Since then under achievement year on year with one or two bright spots. Cooper from 4 to 3, Jordan from 3 to 2, Ward from 3 to 2 and straight back down. Johnson from 3 to 2, missed play off and back down again. Cotterill 3 to 2 all interspersed with the occasional "Micky Mouse" Cup. We have won this more than anyone else. WOW!

HD built the Dolman Stand - a two tier indoor bowling arena with seats on the roof. And then sold Chris Garland to pay for it! He did put in £55,000 in 1960 after relegation. The various chairmen between 1995 and now put some in, mostly squandered by various managers. Ward, three high price strikers when we needed a centre half. Danny Wilson's boozers. Cotterill wanted to get in two high value, centre half and striker, to improve us, make the most of promotion and the "New Stadium". Agreed, allegedly, and then blocked while he was on holiday.

Since then we have been on a money spending spree with LJ and the scumbag who's name I refuse to mention. £65 million is generally accepted as the amount. The first top quality manager, Nigel Pearson, since Cooper and Jordan, yet he is, IMO, doomed to relegation back to Division Three.

I have dreamed and dreamed all my life, but old age and the reality of Bristol City is to be where a chairman in the 1990's said " We like being the big fish in the pond(Third league). I's better that little fish in big pond. (Prem or Championship now)". Unless a miracle happens in the January window, I'm sad to say we are doomed to the drop. 

Edited November 5, 2021 by cidered abroad

[Red Exile]

1 hour ago, Pezo said:

He has stated that he thought it was too early for LJ in his management career but was convinced by LJ eventually, hardly sounds like an ego trip.

He didn't name the stand, he actually said something along the lines of if someone names a stand after me I will fire them. It was a board decision - a board he no longer sits on.

Other than getting basic facts wrong your post makes quite a bit of sense.

hmm...another very generous poster. 

Look...he wanted to be the star-maker with Lee Johnson. It didn't work out. If he was convinced by LJ's patter, well...what can I say?!

What was needed with a manager with a demonstrable track record. 

How many people doubted that the stand would be named after him? It was 'board' decision? - give me a break - who exactly is or was the 'board'? SL, his son, and his mates. There is no 'board'.

But fine if that's your take on matters.

[Pezo]

18 minutes ago, Red Exile said:

hmm...another very generous poster. 

Look...he wanted to be the star-maker with Lee Johnson. It didn't work out. If he was convinced by LJ's patter, well...what can I say?!

What was needed with a manager with a demonstrable track record. 

How many people doubted that the stand would be named after him? It was 'board' decision? - give me a break - who exactly is or was the 'board'? SL, his son, and his mates. There is no 'board'.

But fine if that's your take on matters.

Hmm... I've been critical of SL for things we can be critical of since he has been chairman and owner - you don't need to make stuff up.

His dilution of shares where he has been issuing new ones and buying them to take full control of the club to cover debts he has been responsible for creating is my biggest issue.

His it's my money and my club and I will do what I want attitude (with the first point in mind).

His appointment of Tinnion, Millen with zero experience, his inability to learn from these mistakes. His loyalty to pretty much all managers when it is clearly gone stale. A saying SL should be used to is "it's better to walk when people ask why rather than when people say why not" I would make this case for most managers he has employeed about 2 years before he has finally got rid of them.

That being said balance is what is needed in any criticism and IMO SL comes out about even which from his personal perspective must be embarrassing because if I had spent £150m+ to come out even I would be severely frustrated and wondering if it was me as the one factor that's been consistent along this period of time.

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Back to Cotts for a consistent playing identity.

I don’t think LJ had one.  He had short periods of success with lots of different identities, and short periods of failure with those and others.  Even the autumn of 17/18 never turned into “right, I’ve got my philosophy, everything is now geared to that”.

I bet if you asked most fans where we fell down in 17/18, it was knackering Smith and Pack, because when he rotated Brownhill centrally he lost what he brought wide, and when he put Bryan back to LB he lost what he brought down that left side.

He recruited in the summer of 2018.

Webster to replace Flint,

Weimann to replace Reid,

Assume O’Dowda was the Bryan replacement, which was fair enough at the time.

For me the combo of Reid / Paterson was consigned to the bin, because he had to accommodate Diedhiou, his record signing at the time, who didn’t fit the system he got going!

But tye obvious omission was the central midfielder to compete with Pack and Smith.  If he felt that Brownhill was that player, then was Watkins / Adelakun really the RM/RW replacement for Brownhill?  The answer is no!

That season was in fact the lowest number of players signed and lowest fees paid in his 4 seasons here.

A fit Hegeler could have stopped us flogging some of those CMs to death, either as a third man at times or a rotation option at others.

Sadly he was not fit most of the time. Korey also had a long term injury, didn't seem to trust Walsh and Morrell was starting to  push through- we definitely needed one more, agreed.

Did Walsh have injuries that season? Can't remember but wouldn't surprise me.

Also agree on Diedhiou. He had his uses particularly away from home but often had a negative impact on our fluidity at home. Being a record signing probably increased pressure to play him.

Held an occasional view, that if we were to play Diedhiou it should have been 4-3-3 with wingers. O'Dowda right, Eliasson left kinda thing.

That aside..Diedhiou aside. Fielding was injured until January after all.

           Maenpaa

Hunt Kalas Webster DaSilva

                 Pack

Brownhill Walsh New CM Paterson 

              Weimann

Could go Pisano and Kelly at full back to go narrower.

A fit Hegeler could have been used more readily either to partner Pack or cover at times.

              Maenpaa

Pisano Kalas Webster Kelly

Brownhill Pack Walsh DaSilva

                Paterson

                Weimann

Or my (if fit)Hegeler alternative.

             Maenpaa

  Hunt Kalas Webster Kelly

              Hegeler

Brownhill Pack Walsh Paterson

              Weimann

Obviously can switch full backs as required, could go asymmetrical with a Hunt-Brownhill or Kelly-Eliasson left side or focus on more true width- Kelly-Eliasson.

Weimann central would surely also lead the press quite well in that side, a good focal point.

Edited November 5, 2021 by Mr Popodopolous

[mozo]

Steve Lansdown is 69, so still plenty of living left to do. But he is on track to go to his grave with a billion in the bank, if not two, (paying as little tax as he can). That makes no sense to me.

I'm not saying he should one day throw one and a half billion at Bristol City, but hopefully he will throw that much at good causes. Preserving billionaire status for the Lansdown estate would be a sad legacy in my opinion. 

Edited November 5, 2021 by mozo

[Red Exile]

1 hour ago, Pezo said:

Hmm... I've been critical of SL for things we can be critical of since he has been chairman and owner - you don't need to make stuff up.

His dilution of shares where he has been issuing new ones and buying them to take full control of the club to cover debts he has been responsible for creating is my biggest issue.

His it's my money and my club and I will do what I want attitude (with the first point in mind).

His appointment of Tinnion, Millen with zero experience, his inability to learn from these mistakes. His loyalty to pretty much all managers when it is clearly gone stale. A saying SL should be used to is "it's better to walk when people ask why rather than when people say why not" I would make this case for most managers he has employeed about 2 years before he has finally got rid of them.

That being said balance is what is needed in any criticism and IMO SL comes out about even which from his personal perspective must be embarrassing because if I had spent £150m+ to come out even I would be severely frustrated and wondering if it was me as the one factor that's been consistent along this period of time.

Can’t see that I’ve made anything up. But have it your way - LJ was very persuasive and he is forced to grin and bear sitting in a stand with his name emblazoned on it. Poor chap!

Hey - we’re all frustrated City fans. Personally I’ve had enough. 

[Alessandro]

17 hours ago, Supersonic Robin said:

I do sort of see where you're coming from - looking to the long term future, I'd perhaps rather be in our position than many other teams due to our ultimate overall potential.

However, if we're simply looking back on the last couple of decades, it's very very hard to make an argument that we'd be the preferable choice.
How many Hull and Cardiff fans are on their forums saying "Were those seasons of success really worth it when we could have had what Bristol City have?". 

I can see what you're saying - but to be honest in my opinion it's kind of a pointless debate, because it's all hypothetical. What if this, what if that. Positives and negatives. Whose to say "going for it" would have worked, even for a season?

I think my over-arching feeling r.e SL is - despite the many mistakes made and all the money wasted, there are 2 main thoughts I have, which aren't hypothetial 'what if's:

1) The club is in a better position than when he arrived. Certainly off the pitch and generally in terms of average league position on the pitch.

2) SL has never IMO, unlike Allam at Hull, Morris at Derby, Tam at Cardiff, Venky's Blackburn, Dr Xia at Villa etc etc etc list goes on - gambled with the long term future of the club or been reckless financially. For that I applaud him. Even for one season in the big boys league. That's just my opinion. 

Everything in between i'm happy to debate till the cows come home, and there's plenty to debate!