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Engvall’s Splinter

Engvall’s Splinter

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, maxjak said:

Yep I did thanks........the San marino game was the exception that proves the rule.  I DO NOT see the point in the England men's team playing that game, but it was a very rare situation, whereas in women' s  football scores of that nature are commonplace.  There is an elite   dozen of women's international' teams, and then an extremely poor majority.  In men's football the reverse is true.  Some sort of seeding should be introduced to prevent these sort of games, which are completely pointless, and must demoralise teams like Latvia, and do them no favours?

In respect of Englands game - has anyone ever asked a San Marino player if they’ve wanted to play against England ? I bet many would love to continue sharing a pitch with your Beckhams, Kane’s, Linekars etc. different perspective perhaps. Something to tell the grandkids at least. 

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, NorthBris_Southstand said:

Yeah because Michael Owen or Robbie Savage are so much more knowledge and charismatic than Alex Scott for example... At least the latter can be bothered to do some research for the games she is on rather than trotting out tired old clichés. 

I agree Eni Aluko wasn't great, but look, now 3 people have expressed that opinion in this public forum alone... No one has died, no one has been cancelled, no one has been arrested... Stop wetting the bed with your political agendas. 

Scott is very good.

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Northern Red

Northern Red

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, RedRock said:

Actually, back on topic, I thought it was great entertainment.

Really showed that the team can put to the sword inferior opposition and have the mental aptitude to keep pummelling the opposition for 90 minutes by playing fast, expansive, clinical football with brilliant use of the width of the pitch. A great habit. 

I compare and contrast to the men’s team - the disparity between England men’s and San Mariano being very similar - and while difficult to criticise a 10-0 drubbing against the worst team in the world, the occasional lapses into crab ‘neutral’ football during the match shows the men’s underlying mind set. 

How many 10 goal margins do you see in men's international football? There've been 3 in the last 24 hours of women's qualifiers.

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A Horse With No Name

A Horse With No Name

Posted
Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Engvall’s Splinter said:

In respect of Englands game - has anyone ever asked a San Marino player if they’ve wanted to play against England ? I bet many would love to continue sharing a pitch with your Beckhams, Kane’s, Linekars etc. different perspective perhaps. Something to tell the grandkids at least. 

Hmm. " Grandad, what did you do when you were young? "

" Well dear, I played in goal for San Marino in 2021 against England"

" Wow, did you win ? "

Edited by The Horse With No Name
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SecretSam

SecretSam

Posted
Posted
14 hours ago, Pezo said:

Oh yeah I wouldn't want it to sound like I don't use them or even have a problem with them - I have echo's, an Amazon TV and prime.

Prime TV is pretty shite but it's all slowly slowly catchy monkey with Amazon, they will continue to analyse watching patterns and figure out what people like and make it enough to keep people on the platform.

I can remember Sky in the early, early days...it was truly horrific, Prime is nothing like that. Some cracking shows on there, eg Bosch, The Expanse

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maxjak

maxjak

Posted
Posted
Just now, SecretSam said:

No-one's forcing you to watch it

Ha!  Thats correct...but everytime i go onto the BBC Football website i am constantly being told how wonderful it is, and how well it is all going.  I am all for women playing football, and I wish them well.  But it is a million miles away from mens football.  I am still trying to find decent goalkeepers, apart from the top 2 or 3, who aren't bad.  Anyways, my only reason for commenting intially was the ludicrous 20-0 scoreline which does womens football no favours as a product  IMHO  

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Port Said Red

Port Said Red

Posted
Posted

Those whobare criticising standards here need to consider how the hame develops.

I remember England going to places like Turkey in the 70s and winning very easily. Before my time, but only just,  Italy were considered minnows and players like John Charles going there was a shock.

The only way teams like this improve is through playing better teams regularly.

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frenchred

frenchred

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, NorthBris_Southstand said:

Yeah because Michael Owen or Robbie Savage are so much more knowledge and charismatic than Alex Scott for example... At least the latter can be bothered to do some research for the games she is on rather than trotting out tired old clichés. 

I agree Eni Aluko wasn't great, but look, now 3 people have expressed that opinion in this public forum alone... No one has died, no one has been cancelled, no one has been arrested... Stop wetting the bed with your political agendas. 

I don't wet the bed any more young un, unless I've drunk to much alcohol, when you're old enough to drink  you may be the same!  ??

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, frenchred said:

She is absolutely terrible quite possibly the worst. Each to their own egh 

Agreed!

When he was linked to the AFC wimbledon job - she belittled it! Even though its several levels (being kind) above the level shes managing at!

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underhanded

underhanded

Posted
Posted

To claim that women would never get a punditry job on merit, but through 'wokism' is absolutely laughable in an industry where countless male ex-pros who can barely string a sentence together get gig after gig. I've seen some absolute shocking pundits over the last 18 months or so, and not one of them was a woman. Sure, Karen Carney is a pretty dull, middle of the road pundit, but then so is Danny Murphy, Alan Shearer, Michael Owen...the list goes on.

Anyway, we all know Pat Nevin is the best football pundit out there. No need for discussion!

 

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, maxjak said:

By the way, has anyone ever seen Ellen White and Harry Kane in the same room.  Ha!   They look remarkably similar..........or am i just hallucinating yet again?

Think you are looking at it though Ellen Whites “finger goggles “!

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Waconda

Waconda

Posted
Posted
25 minutes ago, Riaz said:

Agreed!

When he was linked to the AFC wimbledon job - she belittled it! Even though its several levels (being kind) above the level shes managing at!

Even though its several levels (being kind) above the level shes managing at!

In your opinion.

What matters is what she thinks surely ?

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Pezo

Pezo

Posted
Posted

I love OTIB, the only place I've ever known where people that agree call each other names because a sentence has highlighted something different than what they would highlight.

Reading this it's fairly obvious that people are finding it hard to find a female pundit that they value the opinion of, they are also finding it hard to find too many male pundits they value the opinion of. On a forum with many views about football I don't find this surprising but can't figure out why people start getting personal.

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, VT05763 said:

Even though its several levels (being kind) above the level shes managing at!

In your opinion.

What matters is what she thinks surely ?

Are you trying to tell me that the womens game in the prem, is better than the lower leagues ?

She would be very lucky to get the wimbledon job, if she wanted to get into the mens game as a manager.

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Club and Country

Club and Country

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Riaz said:

Are you trying to tell me that the womens game in the prem, is better than the lower leagues ?

She would be very lucky to get the wimbledon job, if she wanted to get into the mens game as a manager.

AFC Wimbledon would beat the womens chelsea team about 10-0

that’s not  to say though however that she can’t do the Wimbledon job or indeed do well at it 

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Club and Country said:

AFC Wimbledon would beat the womens chelsea team about 10-0

that’s not  to say though however that she can’t do the Wimbledon job or indeed do well at it 

Who knows, but wimbledon would be good job to try no? cos she thinks its beneath her.

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Pezo said:

I love OTIB, the only place I've ever known where people that agree call each other names because a sentence has highlighted something different than what they would highlight.

Reading this it's fairly obvious that people are finding it hard to find a female pundit that they value the opinion of, they are also finding it hard to find too many male pundits they value the opinion of. On a forum with many views about football I don't find this surprising but can't figure out why people start getting personal.

Idiot!

 

 

 

 

 

 

?????

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Waconda

Waconda

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Riaz said:

Are you trying to tell me that the womens game in the prem, is better than the lower leagues ?

She would be very lucky to get the wimbledon job, if she wanted to get into the mens game as a manager.

You do understand her coaching abilities can be those of someone above Wimbledons level right ?

You need to not compare the womens and mens game. 

Some of the best coaches in the world work at youth levels for instance.

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frenchred

frenchred

Posted
Posted
Just now, VT05763 said:

You do understand her coaching abilities can be those of someone above Wimbledons level right ?

You need to not compare the womens and mens game. 

Some of the best coaches in the world work at youth levels for instance.

Sweeping statement! Who are these beat coaches in the world operating at youth level?

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BTRFTG

BTRFTG

Posted
Posted
18 hours ago, Pezo said:

Why do I feel like this is Amazon just starting to test the water before wiping the floor with Sky and BT.

Testing? Amazon started PL broadcasts in 2019. It's also not competition to the others, rather as Scudamore realised it's a very useful alternate broadcast outlet.

Amazon got games when BT needed to downsize having realised they'd paid far over the odds for their rights and few decided switching to BT was worth it. Sky does and will continue to drive the viewing numbers in the UK. Without them Premier rights aren't worth half as much as few will subscribe to Prime just for their TV channel.

It's a mix that works for both Premier and consumer. Much as why NFL flogged games to Nickelodeon - now there's a tie-up!

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Northern Red

Northern Red

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, iamalagerdrinker said:

If you haven't had a prime trial in the past 12 months you can claim one now. 

 

Get the football tonight and next day delivery for Christmas and the new Grand Tour when that is later in the month!

They've got more football in between Christmas and New Year too.

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The Bard

The Bard

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Riaz said:

Are you trying to tell me that the womens game in the prem, is better than the lower leagues ?

She would be very lucky to get the wimbledon job, if she wanted to get into the mens game as a manager.

Emma Hayes hasn't managed at EFL level but Gazza has. So is Gazza a better manager?

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, The Bard said:

Emma Hayes hasn't managed at EFL level but Gazza has. So is Gazza a better manager?

Probably not. 
 

Point is Emma Hayes has managed in the womens game. Which is nothing like the mens game, especially at professional level. 
 

So like most managers, who don’t have a big name, she would have to start at a lower level, if she wanted to go into the mens game.

Wimbledon would be quite a high level given her limited experience 

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2015

2015

Posted
Posted

Prime is better than Sky and BT. Jon Champion, Peter Drury and Clive Tyldesley with Ally McCoist as a Co-commentator is absolutely worth watching and I watched both games last night (2nd half of Leeds vs Palace) and it is way better than the product Sky put out there, BT is ok for Champions League but poor for domestic football.

I do think Carragher, Keane and Souness are excellent pundits on Sky but there is a part of me that thinks Sky encourage them to say controversial statements to get views on social media and to draw in viewers. Amazon a bit rough around the edges but feels less commercial than SKY or BT and much more pure.

It is rather interesting to see how Soccer Saturday is now without Tommo, Le Tiss and Charlie Nicholas, I have to say I think it's a really poor listen/watch now and when Stelling leaves I'm unsure it will ever recover to the peak it hit about 10 years ago with the usual 5/6 being on the panel every Saturday. 

My preference of pundits will always be with the former footballers who played at the top of their game for an extended period of time (I often listen to John Giles, Liam Brady and Eamon Dunphy in Ireland) all are much more compelling to listen to than the soundbites you hear from ex players like Jamie O'Hara, Clinton Morrison, Trevor Sinclair and the like. 

I don't have a problem with Women being pundits on Men's football, but I am much more likely to listen to a Former Men's Pro who was at the top of their game for a long time.

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The Bard

The Bard

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I haven’t seen her much, as I didn’t watch much of the Euros beyond the England games.  She does have a good reputation though.

Dissects a game with remarkable precision and speed.  Will also tell someone better known than her  that they're wrong and why.

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Davefevs

Davefevs

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Riaz said:

Probably not. 
 

Point is Emma Hayes has managed in the womens game. Which is nothing like the mens game, especially at professional level. 
 

So like most managers, who don’t have a big name, she would have to start at a lower level, if she wanted to go into the mens game.

Wimbledon would be quite a high level given her limited experience 

She might be better coming in and coaching at the appropriate men’s level first.

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The Bard

The Bard

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Riaz said:

Probably not. 
 

Point is Emma Hayes has managed in the womens game. Which is nothing like the mens game, especially at professional level. 
 

So like most managers, who don’t have a big name, she would have to start at a lower level, if she wanted to go into the mens game.

Wimbledon would be quite a high level given her limited experience 

She's got more experience than Lampard, Gerrard had when they got Derby and Rangers jobs.  They had limited to no experience 

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted
Just now, The Bard said:

She's got more experience than Lampard, Gerrard had when they got Derby and Rangers jobs.  They had limited to no experience 

Yes, but they are big names. They are the exception to the rule. But at least they played in the mens game. Emma hayes hasn’t played or coached in the mens game. 
 

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The Bard

The Bard

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, Riaz said:

Probably not. 
 

Point is Emma Hayes has managed in the womens game. Which is nothing like the mens game, especially at professional level. 
 

So like most managers, who don’t have a big name, she would have to start at a lower level, if she wanted to go into the mens game.

Wimbledon would be quite a high level given her limited experience 

I think she is fast becoming a big name.

 

The exact same arguments were used against employing foreign managers. That's changed because someone started taking risks. The same will happen with female coaches.  It's inevitable unless the Taliban take over

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2015

2015

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Riaz said:

Yes, but they are big names. They are the exception to the rule. But at least they played in the mens game. Emma hayes hasn’t played or coached in the mens game. 
 

They've played at the highest level of the Men's game and the impact of Gerrard, Rooney or Lampard going into a club would be much greater than appointing an unknown quantity. I don't even know why gender comes into it, the Men's game is totally different level to Women's, her credentials at the top of Women's football is probably on par to the National League of Men's. It's not fair to compare her to Gerrard when he played at top level Men's football for about 20 years and worked under some of the World's greatest managers, which he would have learned from.

It isn't sexist against Emma Hayes to think she is not anywhere near ready for a job at the higher levels of the Men's game.

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Pezo

Pezo

Posted
Posted
Just now, The Bard said:

I think she is fast becoming a big name.

 

The exact same arguments were used against employing foreign managers. That's changed because someone started taking risks. The same will happen with female coaches.  It's inevitable unless the Taliban take over

It will happen if a team can get a competitive advantage out of it. It’s certainly going to be interesting seeing what happens the first time someone takes a chance. It has to be for the right reasons though (that they are the best candidate) and at the moment I haven’t seen a female pundit that I think would do well in the top 4 leagues but happy to be proved wrong.

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RedRock

RedRock

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Northern Red said:

How many 10 goal margins do you see in men's international football? There've been 3 in the last 24 hours of women's qualifiers.

Do you know what? I used to be like that.

Not proper football, ridiculous scores, can’t  head, shoot, no tactical awareness. … and the goalkeepers. In fact, there’s probably some postings of mine on here sometime back commenting as such.

I take it as pure entertainment now. I was entertained with England playing the type of football I enjoy, with genuine desire, commitment and no little skill. Use of full width of pitch, speedy wingers, great crosses and lethal finishing…what’s not to like?

Far more entertained than watching an England men’s side playing slow crab football across the pitch. Entertained far more than watching Bristol City men attempt to string more than 2 passes together, avoiding at all costs making a hard tackle or creating something resembling a team identity. 

I’m as far from Woke as it’s possible to get…. but I’ve had more enjoyment watching England Women football and rugby sides rattle up big scores over the last few weeks than watching the City Men for 3 seasons now. There’s also little to no play acting or disrespecting the referees which is a welcome bonus as well. Watching Bristol City women for free hasn’t been a bad use of time either. 

 

 

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted
49 minutes ago, The Bard said:

I think she is fast becoming a big name.

 

The exact same arguments were used against employing foreign managers. That's changed because someone started taking risks. The same will happen with female coaches.  It's inevitable unless the Taliban take over

I agree, that it’s inevitable that female managers will come into the game. Once one comes in and does a good job, more will follow.

But i don’t think, a female manager doing well in the womens game, means they can do a job in mens professional game. The two games are chalk and cheese and it’s VERY early days for the women’s game. They are literally 100 years behind. Lots of young girls playing the game now, so i do think there is a good future 

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Yellow&Blue&Red

Yellow&Blue&Red

Posted
Posted (edited)

Emma Hayes was linked with Wimbledon job but I don't think that came from Wimbledon, I think that came from Emma Hayes' agent.

At the time that she said women's football wasn't a step down (what do you expect her to say, she's got to keep the respect of her players!) she also said that Wimbledon couldn't afford her. A couple of months later she signed a new contract with Chelsea. Looks to me like women managers can play the contract renegotiation game every bit as well as the men.

Edited by Yellow&Blue&Red
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The Bard

The Bard

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Riaz said:

what’s yours? You aren’t seriously suggesting that the womens top level is anywhere near league 2 are you?? ???

Not the point is it? 

Wimbledon men would hammer Chelsea women because they are bigger stronger and quicker.  Not because they are more tactically nuanced or better managed. 

They don't need a male coach to be bigger, stronger and quicker do they?  Or even someone with experience of that level of football.  Management is about making the most of what you got through organisation, communication, recruitment etc.  Give Emma Hayes a half decent budget at League 1 level and I suspect she'll be successful even if there would be a constant media circus around her.   She demonstrably has the skill set to succeed.

 

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ExiledAjax

ExiledAjax

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, BanburyRed said:

It's called 'Cockernee', isn't it?!

Saying he expects Newcastle to spend "£200 - £300m in January" and then survive is stupid in any accent.

They can spend that amount, the tight approach under Ashley means they are way off breaking P&S rules.

But I'd argue they could sign 4 or 5 players of top quality...and it won't get them safe.

They basically need an absolute minimum of 30 more points. That gets them to 37, and an outside chance of survival. Ideally they need to hit 40, so need 33 more. They've got 24 games to do that. So they need to go from 0.5ppg to nearly 1.5 ppg, and they need to do that overnight. Their xG is appalling, and last night they were hopeless.

Furthermore, by the end of January they will have played another 9 matches including against Man City, Liverpool, plus so-called "6 pointers" against Burnley, Watford and Leeds. After those 9 games they would have only 15 remaining remaining games. So realistically unless they get 15+ points from the 9 games between now and the end of January, they could be looking at needing nearly 2 ppg to stay safe. 2 ppg is top 4 form.

It's not happening. I don't care if they sign Salah, Kante, Lukaku, Donnarumma and van Dijk in January. They're relegated.

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Robbored

Robbored

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, ExiledAjax said:

Saying he expects Newcastle to spend "£200 - £300m in January" and then survive is stupid in any accent.

They can spend that amount, the tight approach under Ashley means they are way off breaking P&S rules.

But I'd argue they could sign 4 or 5 players of top quality...and it won't get them safe.

They basically need an absolute minimum of 30 more points. That gets them to 37, and an outside chance of survival. Ideally they need to hit 40, so need 33 more. They've got 24 games to do that. So they need to go from 0.5ppg to nearly 1.5 ppg, and they need to do that overnight. Their xG is appalling, and last night they were hopeless.

Furthermore, by the end of January they will have played another 9 matches including against Man City, Liverpool, plus so-called "6 pointers" against Burnley, Watford and Leeds. After those 9 games they would have only 15 remaining remaining games. So realistically unless they get 15+ points from the 9 games between now and the end of January, they could be looking at needing nearly 2 ppg to stay safe. 2 ppg is top 4 form.

It's not happening. I don't care if they sign Salah, Kante, Lukaku, Donnarumma and van Dijk in January. They're relegated.

Problem will be is that if Newcastle are the Championship next season with a huge budget they’ll almost certainly bounce straight back up.

Highlights the issues many clubs have with parachute payments. To me it makes little difference to me who comes down, they’ll all get the advantage of the PP system.

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ExiledAjax

ExiledAjax

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Problem will be is that if Newcastle are the Championship next season with a huge budget they’ll almost certainly bounce straight back up.

Highlights the issues many clubs have with parachute payments. To me it makes little difference to me who comes down, they’ll all get the advantage of the PP system.

For a club like Newcastle PP will be a drop in the ocean. It will help them a little but it's not PP that will mean they will win the Championship next season. They will likely come down with a squad worth a few hundred million, and a wage bill of astonishing terms for a championship club. You'd expect them to smash the division.

PP needs reform, but it's clubs like Norwich that demonstrate its failings rather than Newcastle.

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