I like this squad….

[Davefevs]

….I’m more than content that today has been quiet (in and out).

We’ve stuck to the plan.  We’ve probably done enough cost cutting in the last 12 months (lots of tough decisions impacting the squad strength / depth) to just about give us the option to turn away any interest in our players.

Well done all.

[fgrsimon]

Great that it looks like we've kept everyone but must admit I'm still a bit worried about a points deduction... 

[cityexile]

Agree with all of that.

To add, it’s tough to keep a player if they feel they want to move. All the mood music is that our young stars are happy to stay for now. That might change in time, but is also credit to NP and his team.

I don’t doubt NP looks at it all and would love to be able to strengthen in a couple of areas, but also don’t feel he has lost much sleep today. He just gets on with the hand he had been dealt.

[LondonBristolian]

Two things I really like are 

1) the consistency of strategy from the club. We’ve been told for weeks that we are only selling for the right place and only signing if players leave and the club have stuck to the strategy without panicking.

2) the character of the squad. Scott, Semenyo and Wells were the three rumoured departures and I am not worried about any of the three throwing their toys out the pram because they did not get a move.

[GrahamC]

It is very small for the number of games we have had to cram into August but overall we have coped.

Dave Rennie is probably as important as anyone on the staff but when you consider that we went into our 9th game in the month last night effectively with just Kalas & Klose unavailable, he’s doing a really great job.

We probably will have a couple of occasions when we really are struggling to have a bench that covers all eventualities but most of us understand the FFP constraints that bluffer Ashton has left us under.

If we can get Kalas back over the next month, (I’m sure we’ll see Klose very soon) then we’ll be competitive in the top half, I think.

[Sheltons Army]

9 minutes ago, fgrsimon said:

Great that it looks like we've kept everyone but must admit I'm still a bit worried about a points deduction... 

there’s a good argument to be had that even if we were now likely to pick up a small points deduction , keeping Antoine & Co will ensure that we come out in good profit points wise , on the decision to reject any bids

[Henry]

27 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

….I’m more than content that today has been quiet (in and out).

We’ve stuck to the plan.  We’ve probably done enough cost cutting in the last 12 months (lots of tough decisions impacting the squad strength / depth) to just about give us the option to turn away any interest in our players.

Well done all.

I like it too.

For the first time in years, there’s not a single player in the squad I’d like to get rid of. Upgrade yes, but they’re all on the bus for me

[GrahamC]

25 minutes ago, Henry said:

I like it too.

For the first time in years, there’s not a single player in the squad I’d like to get rid of. Upgrade yes, but they’re all on the bus for me

Really good point.

Andy King we know is winding down his career but can still do a useful job, Max is a decent second choice keeper & the much maligned Vyner & Martin certainly have a role to play.

Absolutely no “clubs in the bag”, or totally pointless, sat in the stand with their coat on squad fillers with us now.

[And Its Smith]

On the whole, I’m happy. My worry is that Pearson says we have no depth other than the XI that started last night and the subs that came on. Assuming you can add Kalas to that.  This means that Wilson and Tanner are not ready yet and Pring isn’t good enough one can assume. That is a very small squad and even two injuries will be stretching it. 

Edited September 1, 2022 by And Its Smith

[Northern Red]

1 minute ago, GrahamC said:

Really good point.

Andy King we know is winding down his career but can still do a useful job, Max is a decent second choice keeper & the much maligned Vyner & Martin certainly have a role to play.

Absolutely no “clubs in the bag”, or totally pointless, sat in the stand with their coat on squad fillers with us now.

Yep. And the smaller squad makes it easier to keep players happy and feel involved, probably does wonders for team unity too. As opposed to having several players who know they're surplus to requirements and aren't ever going to play barring the most severe injury crisis.

[HitchinRed]

Agreed, but we really need to tie down those players with contracts that expire at the end of the season. Otherwise January onwards is going to be really tricky.

[petehinton]

All went the way Pearson said it would, again. You can just fully trust whatever he says in pressers. No sugar coating or speaking in riddles. Refreshing. 

[Sheltons Army]

2 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

Yep. And the smaller squad makes it easier to keep players happy and feel involved, probably does wonders for team unity too. As opposed to having several players who know they're surplus to requirements and aren't ever going to play barring the most severe injury crisis.

An excellent and often overlooked point (Across all clubs) IMHO

Pearson has said since he came he wanted a smaller squad 

It comes with some risk , but has definite benefits

 

I do wonder how happy (a fair few of) Forests new  ‘squad’ will be in a few months 

[Henry]

15 minutes ago, petehinton said:

All went the way Pearson said it would, again. You can just fully trust whatever he says in pressers. No sugar coating or speaking in riddles. Refreshing. 

Absolutely.

I hoped everyone enjoyed their pizzas tonight.

[bcfc01]

1 hour ago, fgrsimon said:

Great that it looks like we've kept everyone but must admit I'm still a bit worried about a points deduction... 

3 points max ?

But more likely no points deduction imo.

[martnewts]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

….I’m more than content that today has been quiet (in and out).

We’ve stuck to the plan.  We’ve probably done enough cost cutting in the last 12 months (lots of tough decisions impacting the squad strength / depth) to just about give us the option to turn away any interest in our players.

Well done all.

I agree with all of this and without getting carried away with luck with injuries is this season going to be our chance?

It seems that by not losing any of our stars and the spirit and togetherness apparent in the squad  that we might have that rare opportunity before we have to sell and rebuild again.

[Mr Popodopolous]

21 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

3 points max ?

But more likely no points deduction imo.

I've worked a range of scenarios.

I think it could be anything from 2 to 6* points. The second portion of the 3 has a big asterix by it as it is linked to the concept of us for example turning down a reasonable bid when we know we are set to fail FFP.

The Birmingham case is the closest precedent. EFL wanted a 2nd deduction, and lost but they won on appeal but no deduction was handed down.

However the EFL seemed keener on getting the principle upheld than the actual deduction as Birmingham passed it that year anyway owing to a late sale and leaseback of St Andrews and included the Che Adams sale in 2019-20 FFP returns.

The League Arbitration Panel appeared to:

a) Uphold the principle of an absolute obligation in this type of case.

b) Decline to deduct points, presumably as the numbers stacked up.

c) Acknowledge that Covid also played a role- they said it set no precedent or provided no future guide for sanctions in this type of case. Verdict was February or March 2020, EFL appealed and final verdict came out maybe mid June 2020.

Of course that's assuming that e.g. sell on clauses don't materialise or bigger Covid losses not accepted or we bite the bullet and sell someone important in January.

Edited September 1, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Superjack]

I like this manager.

[Red-Robbo]

Just a nice feeling, walking down Raynes Road - Ashton Road last game - having watched an entertaining game of football and we've won.

Regardless of whether he gets us to the Prem, Nigel Pearson has created a side that is entertaining to watch. And he's done it with nuppence. 

[James54De]

Now to work on the contractual situations regarding Kalas, Bentley, Dasilva, and more. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

I'm very happy with the squad .seems a good group, developing well together, good age range yet quite a few in theory with room for growth. Not tried to scrounge PL loanees on the cheap either  youth has increasingly got its chance.

Football has been enjoyable too! Sykes given his relative lack of experience on the position has been a revelation at RWB so far!

Edited September 1, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, HitchinRed said:

Agreed, but we really need to tie down those players with contracts that expire at the end of the season. Otherwise January onwards is going to be really tricky.

That’s the next work for RG.  But it won’t be easy to convince players signed on pre-covid wages to alter their contract now to a lower wage.  If you’re a player, you’d drag it out wouldn’t you (if you want to stay).  There will be a time when job security versus injury starts to change the urgency, but I think that’s more as we approach the next window.

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I've worked a range of scenarios.

I think it could be anything from 2 to 6* points. The second portion of the 3 has a big asterix by it as it is linked to the concept of us for example turning down a reasonable bid when we know we are set to fail FFP.

The Birmingham case is the closest precedent. EFL wanted a 2nd deduction, and lost but they won on appeal but no deduction was handed down.

However the EFL seemed keener on getting the principle upheld than the actual deduction as Birmingham passed it that year anyway owing to a late sale and leaseback of St Andrews and included the Che Adams sale in 2019-20 FFP returns.

The League Arbitration Panel appeared to:

a) Uphold the principle of an absolute obligation in this type of case.

b) Decline to deduct points, presumably as the numbers stacked up.

c) Acknowledge that Covid also played a role- they said it set no precedent or provided no future guide for sanctions in this type of case. Verdict was February or March 2020, EFL appealed and final verdict came out maybe mid June 2020.

Of course that's assuming that e.g. sell on clauses don't materialise or bigger Covid losses not accepted or we bite the bullet and sell someone important in January.

No way 6 points.  We aren’t £19m over like Reading.  Nobody could say we have taken the piss and deserve more points deducted on a basis of not selling.  This isn’t Che Adams at Brum.

I still think we won’t get any deduction.

[Mr Popodopolous]

44 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

No way 6 points.  We aren’t £19m over like Reading.  Nobody could say we have taken the piss and deserve more points deducted on a basis of not selling.  This isn’t Che Adams at Brum.

I still think we won’t get any deduction.

6 pts would have been at the worst end of the bad scenarios. Overspend worth say 4 pts - 1 back for cooperation but then a further 3 for not selling in January like Adams at Birmingham 4 seasons ago.

Worth remembering too that the way the Reading one broke down was 6 and then a suspended 6 so a worst case Reading type scenario would be 3 and then 3 suspended for x period of time subject to adherence to a business plan- something that we'd easily stick to if it came to it. There are two big * against my worst case scenario.

Otoh the suspended deduction if there was one would neither mitigate or substitute a punishment for a further overspend or breach in the period.

44 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I still think we won’t get any deduction.

Interested in this, we'll be within limits by March or end of May 2023 at the latest?

Edited September 2, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[cityfan1958]

If nothing else it’s going to be entertaining this season. We are going to score a lot of goals, and also conceded more than a few.

Didn’t/don’t we have the record for the number of goals in a season for one of the divisions (3rd, in old money ? ) but finished mid table because we conceded nearly as many ?

[Malago]

Before we get carried away with the self congratulation, may I remind everyone that last year we only took 3 points out 36 against the clubs who finished in the top 6, and have yet to play a team who are likely to finish in this year’s top 6.  

We will have a much better idea of the merits of this squad in a few weeks, when we play Norwich and Burnley away.

[FNQ]

1 hour ago, Malago said:

Before we get carried away with the self congratulation, may I remind everyone that last year we only took 3 points out 36 against the clubs who finished in the top 6, and have yet to play a team who are likely to finish in this year’s top 6.  

We will have a much better idea of the merits of this squad in a few weeks, when we play Norwich and Burnley away.

But there again… may I remind you that last year we scored the most goals outside of the top 6.. this year we seem even more potent with TC adding even more fire power. You got to admit, it is exciting to watch at the moment.

defendively we were crap and amongst the worst performers last year.. this season while acknowledging that we still have a lot to work on, we are miles ahead of where we were.. Norwich and Burnley will be taking us very seriously this year.

[Robbored]

6 hours ago, Sheltons Army said:

An excellent and often overlooked point (Across all clubs) IMHO

Pearson has said since he came he wanted a smaller squad 

It comes with some risk , but has definite benefits

For any manager it’s about getting the right numerical balance in their squad. A large squad can cause problems in terms of players getting frustrated if they’re not getting games and any unhappy players is obviously not good for morale.

For me whilst the current squad is looking solid it’s a little too thin and if injuries/suspensions begin to build up then Nige’s options become limited - a point that he’s mentioned more than once.

City could certainly use another CB and midfielder to add more depth and now that the window has closed only OOC players will be available.

[Port Said Red]

Transfer deadline day tends to skew people's perception of how their club had traded during the window as a whole, so it's worth reminding ourselves that we have continued the evolution of this squad overall.

Firstly we have removed a couple of seat blockers from coach one so to speak. Bakinson and Palmer have gone all together and Idehen has been relegated to another coach for now. (hopefully to return as a new man), and everyone's whipping boy of the last couple of seasons O'Dowda has also walked the plank.

We added competition in a key areas and a potential leader at the back. Naismith, Wilson and Sykes, and we have added what looks to be quality competition on paper in goal with Bajic. Of those Sykes was probably the one that arrived with the least fanfare, but has been the nicest surprise.

Retaining the services of our "stars" is the icing on the cake.

Perhaps the most important part of these dealings is getting them done early. We have a squad that is all pulling together and are finding their football fun and enjoyable and have spent months together already, some of the teams in this league will have to be introduced to each other on Saturday.

This is also a better environment to add in more of emerging youth talent too, and we have even more optimism on that front.

Off the pitch, Nigel seems to have created a coaching set up that suits him especially with the addition of Jason Euell.

I have faith, (because I have seen it happen before) that the togetherness of this group is worth more than some individuals borrowed from all and sundry, each with their own agenda. I also believe that the fans can see this, and that the backing from the terraces seems to have gone up a notch too.

All in all, I am very happy with this quiet revolution.

 

[Slippin cider]

I like this squad ….Naismith is a worry but iron out his errors and I’d like it even more …

[MarcusX]

8 hours ago, cityexile said:

Agree with all of that.

To add, it’s tough to keep a player if they feel they want to move. All the mood music is that our young stars are happy to stay for now. That might change in time, but is also credit to NP and his team.

I don’t doubt NP looks at it all and would love to be able to strengthen in a couple of areas, but also don’t feel he has lost much sleep today. He just gets on with the hand he had been dealt.

This is the biggest thing for me, it's not that we kept hold of everyone as such it's that we don't seem to have the disruption of players wanting out at the whiff of a big move. Rumoured interest in Antoine doesn't appear to have turned his head and I'm sure we've already heard Scott say he's happy to stay here and get regular football?

Whatever we're doing in the academy, we're doing it right. These kids have good heads and advice around them it seems. Now extend your contracts, have a good season and secure us a big deal next summer if that's what you wish to do.

I can't believe how much more enjoyable we are to watch. I'll take the frustrations of a last minute equaliser for the fact that 85 minutes on Saturday were the most fun I've had watching City in years.

[MC RISK77]

I like the size of the squad, the fact that we don’t have anyone on loan, the mix of experience and undeniable very talented young players.

While I really want him to stay all season I do believe that we need to maximise Antoines value probably in January and hopefully after he has a decent showing in the World Cup.

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

I'm not sure I can add much to what's already been said. I'm liking the squad too, which seems very together, and if we can avoid serious injuries I am looking forward to a comfortable top half of the table finish. I suspect (hope) that we will avoid a points deduction but even if we a small deduction fully expect us to overcome it.

I expect more to come from the U21s. Towler and Idehen going out on loan could mean that Aroaye plays more for the U21s alongside Callum Wood and Joe Low, who looks the real deal and may get a 1st team start or two before the season finishes. Dylan Kadji has already appeared in the Carabao Cup and surely young Owers and, Tommy Backwell will get a look in somewhere, if only training with the 1st team. Exciting times ahead. 

[Sir Geoff]

8 hours ago, Sheltons Army said:

An excellent and often overlooked point (Across all clubs) IMHO

Pearson has said since he came he wanted a smaller squad 

It comes with some risk , but has definite benefits

 

I do wonder how happy (a fair few of) Forests new  ‘squad’ will be in a few months 

Would love to know what Josh Bowler is thinking this morning. Big fish at Blackpool, signs for Forest and immediately loaned to 'big daddies' Olympiakos.

[Shuffle]

9 hours ago, Davefevs said:

….I’m more than content that today has been quiet (in and out).

We’ve stuck to the plan.  We’ve probably done enough cost cutting in the last 12 months (lots of tough decisions impacting the squad strength / depth) to just about give us the option to turn away any interest in our players.

Well done all.

We are so light at CB as we literally are picking 3 for 3 places with Kalas & Klose injured. Happy of course ti keep our key players but until we know what’s happening with Kalas  we could get caught out if injuries & suspensions hit & reluctance to trust Towler & Low it seems. 

[GrahamC]

5 hours ago, Malago said:

Before we get carried away with the self congratulation, may I remind everyone that last year we only took 3 points out 36 against the clubs who finished in the top 6, and have yet to play a team who are likely to finish in this year’s top 6.  

We will have a much better idea of the merits of this squad in a few weeks, when we play Norwich and Burnley away.

I think we already know the answer.

They’re better than us, have more money, stronger depth & of course parachute payments.

Anything we get from 2 of our hardest away games is a bonus, judging us by them is both harsh & pointless.

Pearson has basically had money for 1 significant signing, spent nothing at all this summer, slashed the wage bill & produced an exciting team to watch.

”But we lost 2-0 at Burnley”..

[SE23Red]

21 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

This is the biggest thing for me, it's not that we kept hold of everyone as such it's that we don't seem to have the disruption of players wanting out at the whiff of a big move. Rumoured interest in Antoine doesn't appear to have turned his head and I'm sure we've already heard Scott say he's happy to stay here and get regular football?

Whatever we're doing in the academy, we're doing it right. These kids have good heads and advice around them it seems. Now extend your contracts, have a good season and secure us a big deal next summer if that's what you wish to do.

I can't believe how much more enjoyable we are to watch. I'll take the frustrations of a last minute equaliser for the fact that 85 minutes on Saturday were the most fun I've had watching City in years.

I actually think a big part of this is an obvious change in culture at he club. If you have a CEO consistently delivering the message that all players are tradable, all players have a price, and all players will have their heads turned then it becomes self fulfilling.

Instead we now have the manager front and centre delivering a positive message about their talents and how determined we are to keep and develop them.

It won't stop our best talents leaving, but it must help them believe that staying is an appealing option!

[MarcusX]

7 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Would love to know what Josh Bowler is thinking this morning. Big fish at Blackpool, signs for Forest and immediately loaned to 'big daddies' Olympiakos.

Has that really happened? Wow. I thought he was a real threat against us Saturday, arguably their only serious one to be honest. Him and Thompson were MOM for me from them

[And Its Smith]

9 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Would love to know what Josh Bowler is thinking this morning. Big fish at Blackpool, signs for Forest and immediately loaned to 'big daddies' Olympiakos.

He would have signed knowing he was being loaned out. 

[MarcusX]

1 minute ago, SE23Red said:

I actually think a big part of this is an obvious change in culture at he club. If you have a CEO consistently delivering the message that all players are tradable, all players have a price, and all players will have their heads turned then it becomes self fulfilling.

Instead we now have the manager front and centre delivering a positive message about their talents and how determined we are to keep and develop them.

It won't stop our best talents leaving, but it must help them believe that staying is an appealing option!

Also having a manager with a big reputation in the game. I know he's had failings, but his tenure at Leicester will be what most people know him for. He's the sort of manager I'd want to play for

[JoeAman08]

Can’t argue the squad looks strong especially 1-15. I know NP has said about lack of depth but imo it is probably how most championship clubs should look. A strong XI with a few on the bench that could easily start. Then a few younger faces who can contribute in small spells as they get better. 

[CliftonCliff]

9 hours ago, GrahamC said:

It is very small for the number of games we have had to cram into August but overall we have coped.

Dave Rennie is probably as important as anyone on the staff but when you consider that we went into our 9th game in the month last night effectively with just Kalas & Klose unavailable, he’s doing a really great job.

We probably will have a couple of occasions when we really are struggling to have a bench that covers all eventualities but most of us understand the FFP constraints that bluffer Ashton has left us under.

If we can get Kalas back over the next month, (I’m sure we’ll see Klose very soon) then we’ll be competitive in the top half, I think.

Agree about Rennie and would add as another important positive Pearson’s willingness not to overplay individuals with a history of chronic injury. His management of Williams is the obvious example and has been exemplary. That would not have happened under some previous regimes and it helps enormously with coping with a limited squad size.

We have seen that Nige will stick with players who are delivering, so that Wells, for example, who has finally been given the chance to start regularly, will know that he keeps the shirt as long as he performs well, but alongside that backing, Pearson also shows an eminently sensible approach to rotation in the case of players with a known vulnerability.

If I had to choose one word to sum up this manager’s way of doing things it would be “pragmatic “. It’s the mark of a man who is experienced and knows what he’s doing. It’s the first time in many years that I’ve felt we’ve had someone in charge with his kind of seniority and authority in whom I’ve felt confident.

[Davefevs]

6 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

6 pts would have been at the worst end of the bad scenarios. Overspend worth say 4 pts - 1 back for cooperation but then a further 3 for not selling in January like Adams at Birmingham 4 seasons ago.

Worth remembering too that the way the Reading one broke down was 6 and then a suspended 6 so a worst case Reading type scenario would be 3 and then 3 suspended for x period of time subject to adherence to a business plan- something that we'd easily stick to if it came to it. There are two big * against my worst case scenario.

Otoh the suspended deduction if there was one would neither mitigate or substitute a punishment for a further overspend or breach in the period.

Interested in this, we'll be within limits by March or end of May 2023 at the latest?

I know it’s all guesswork but a points deduction of the likes of Brum and Reading were for vast overspends, Brum almost £10m and Reading £19m…we are significantly smaller (£2-4m).  They aren’t gonna throw an extra 3 points at us for not selling a player, when they’ve seen our other cost cutting, and taken account of covid too.

Personally if we were to get a 2 point deduction, I’d call it churlish.

But that’s just me.

1 hour ago, Port Said Red said:

Transfer deadline day tends to skew people's perception of how their club had traded during the window as a whole, so it's worth reminding ourselves that we have continued the evolution of this squad overall.

Firstly we have removed a couple of seat blockers from coach one so to speak. Bakinson and Palmer have gone all together and Idehen has been relegated to another coach for now. (hopefully to return as a new man), and everyone's whipping boy of the last couple of seasons O'Dowda has also walked the plank.

We added competition in a key areas and a potential leader at the back. Naismith, Wilson and Sykes, and we have added what looks to be quality competition on paper in goal with Bajic. Of those Sykes was probably the one that arrived with the least fanfare, but has been the nicest surprise.

Retaining the services of our "stars" is the icing on the cake.

Perhaps the most important part of these dealings is getting them done early. We have a squad that is all pulling together and are finding their football fun and enjoyable and have spent months together already, some of the teams in this league will have to be introduced to each other on Saturday.

This is also a better environment to add in more of emerging youth talent too, and we have even more optimism on that front.

Off the pitch, Nigel seems to have created a coaching set up that suits him especially with the addition of Jason Euell.

I have faith, (because I have seen it happen before) that the togetherness of this group is worth more than some individuals borrowed from all and sundry, each with their own agenda. I also believe that the fans can see this, and that the backing from the terraces seems to have gone up a notch too.

All in all, I am very happy with this quiet revolution.

 

Great post…Nige made reference to both Luton and Huddersfield over the summer in terms of what can be achieved with a tigh-knit squad, togetherness, busting a gut for each other.  Early days, but I sense teams are seeing that coming to AG isn’t a pleasant away trip anymore.

3 minutes ago, CliftonCliff said:

Agree about Rennie and would add as another important positive Pearson’s willingness not to overplay individuals with a history of chronic injury. His management of Williams is the obvious example and has been exemplary. That would not have happened under some previous regimes and it helps enormously with coping with a limited squad size.

We have seen that Nige will stick with players who are delivering, so that Wells, for example, who has finally been given the chance to start regularly, will know that he keeps the shirt as long as he performs well, but alongside that backing, Pearson also shows an eminently sensible approach to rotation in the case of players with a known vulnerability.

If I had to choose one word to sum up this manager’s way of doing things it would be “pragmatic “. It’s the mark of a man who is experienced and knows what he’s doing. It’s the first time in many years that I’ve felt we’ve had someone in charge with his kind of seniority and authority in whom I’ve felt confident.

is it just me that looks at some of the clips and thinks our players look more muscular.

[Tinmans Love Child]

49 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Would love to know what Josh Bowler is thinking this morning. Big fish at Blackpool, signs for Forest and immediately loaned to 'big daddies' Olympiakos.

Sounds great to me a few months in Greece with a huge club!

[1960maaan]

I think I said to you the other night @Davefevs , might have been @Curr Avon.

I'm really trying not to get excited. Felt the same from pre-season. The impact of the new lads has been mixed, but I'm really optimistic. 

* Naismith has cost us goals, but he is exactly what we have missed for years. Nothing to do with ability, which is clear to see, but having a vocal CB to dig out mistakes but encourage and help with positioning is massive.
*Sykes has been a big surprise, probably most consistent player so far this year.
* Wilson until the injury looked very bright, will have to wait but handy back u to have.

Conway is like having a new signing. I always had high hopes , but I doubt anyone could predict the impact he's had so far.
Semenyo coming back (and staying for now) is big.
Wells link up has given Wells a new life and we now have a real threat up front. 

We have Klose and Kalas waiting , and if they can sort out their issues we have decent depth there.

There is a question at RWB with Pring. I'm a big fan but there is obviously something that Pearson isn't convinced about. That said, with Wilson and Tanner being able to cover it does make sense having them on the bench I guess.

Midfield looks much better too. Williams being able to play twice a week is big. HNM getting support and players being busy around him helps, his running looks part of a plan now and less headless chicken. Which I never thought was his fault, more to do with static players all around him. Scott, is , well Scott. With James and King we seem better placed to cope too.

We finally look able to control and take care of the ball better. Still a work in progress, but flare & work rate, control & threat really does make it feel different to what has gone on in the past 3 years or more.

It's taken a while, it was a big, big job. But we are starting to see what Nige is going for
We still give away too many chances, but hopefully that will get sorted a little. 

One thing I worry about, trying to win the ball infant of a forward. Now I see the benefit , and with the press and intensity we shoed early on fine. But at 1-0 and trying to control the game I'd be happier to see defenders jockey, or the phrase we used to use , get up his pipe. A couple of times later on Weds , Vyner tried to nick the ball and was turned and they had an attack. 
A small moan, but something that stood out to me.

I try to be balanced and not get carried away, but a couple of wins in the next 2 games and that will be harder.

[GrahamC]

54 minutes ago, Shuffle said:

We are so light at CB as we literally are picking 3 for 3 places with Kalas & Klose injured. Happy of course ti keep our key players but until we know what’s happening with Kalas  we could get caught out if injuries & suspensions hit & reluctance to trust Towler & Low it seems. 

You’re right, so I’m trying to see the logic behind letting Towler leave on loan based on all of this.

Pearson seemed very relaxed about Klose, so my assumption is that he’s not a big issue & might even be available for selection tomorrow. If he’s back soon (there’s a free week coming up) we are certainly far better off.

Kalas is a worry & the longer it goes on then the greater the fear this is really long term. I can only assume that is why we are taking a look at Bamba & with no pressure to make a quick decision on him I reckon we’ll keep him if we don’t think Kalas will be back any time soon.

Low is a strange one, we have both heard really good things about him this season but he doesn’t even have a squad number at present & as we didn’t fill the bench in either cup game, that suggests he isn’t being actively considered.

[Robbored]

7 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

You’re right, so I’m trying to see the logic behind letting Towler leave on loan based on all of this.

Pearson seemed very relaxed about Klose, so my assumption is that he’s not a big issue & might even be available for selection tomorrow. If he’s back soon (there’s a free week coming up) we are certainly far better off.

It maybe as simple that Nige doesn’t think that Towler is Championship ready yet and can only assume that as Tins would say Towler needs ‘miles on the clock’ and he’s not going to get regular competitive games at City - there is a January recall option in the deal.

Lets hope he develops massively at Wimbledon.

 

[Rob k]

10 hours ago, billywedlock said:

I agree . Though @harry will want to insult the players and @Kid in the Riottalk to you about penalty decisions that the referees  apologise for are wrong . Common denominator? Oh they love Macca and Lee J and have lost objectivity . Sold down the river . But cannot accept they were conned . 

I keep seeing this….let me put the record straight. I sit with them both within a big group, yes they are both well informed and know what they are talking about when it comes to City’s inner workings, but to say they have lost objectivity is completely wrong. I myself disagreed with them about the penalty decision at Hull and there was a long chat about it in the stands, but they are entitled to an opinion, that doesn’t mean they hate NP because they liked Macca and LJ. 90% of things we all agree on, 10%  we don’t - that’s football. 

[Davefevs]

28 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

You’re right, so I’m trying to see the logic behind letting Towler leave on loan based on all of this.

Pearson seemed very relaxed about Klose, so my assumption is that he’s not a big issue & might even be available for selection tomorrow. If he’s back soon (there’s a free week coming up) we are certainly far better off.

Kalas is a worry & the longer it goes on then the greater the fear this is really long term. I can only assume that is why we are taking a look at Bamba & with no pressure to make a quick decision on him I reckon we’ll keep him if we don’t think Kalas will be back any time soon.

Low is a strange one, we have both heard really good things about him this season but he doesn’t even have a squad number at present & as we didn’t fill the bench in either cup game, that suggests he isn’t being actively considered.

Klose was doing a lot of running and stretching down the side of the Dolman before the players came out on Wednesday.  He can’t be far away from being back fit.

[mozo]

10 hours ago, GrahamC said:

It is very small for the number of games we have had to cram into August but overall we have coped.

Dave Rennie is probably as important as anyone on the staff but when you consider that we went into our 9th game in the month last night effectively with just Kalas & Klose unavailable, he’s doing a really great job.

We probably will have a couple of occasions when we really are struggling to have a bench that covers all eventualities but most of us understand the FFP constraints that bluffer Ashton has left us under.

If we can get Kalas back over the next month, (I’m sure we’ll see Klose very soon) then we’ll be competitive in the top half, I think.

Looking ahead we've just got 4 games before a 2 week international break at the end of this month so no issue there.

Then a long run of 11 games between October 1st and November 12th. If we can keep the levels up through that period tge squad then gets a month off (except for Semenyo who will win the World Cup and be knackered).

Then it's back to the grind. I think our squad depth should be enough for now but by Spring 23 the cracks might appear.

If Semenyo leaves in January we'll probably bring in 2/3 and the squad will be fine.

[Phileas Fogg]

10 hours ago, Davefevs said:

….I’m more than content that today has been quiet (in and out).

We’ve stuck to the plan.  We’ve probably done enough cost cutting in the last 12 months (lots of tough decisions impacting the squad strength / depth) to just about give us the option to turn away any interest in our players.

Well done all.

Agreed Dave, I really like this squad too.

In my opinion, we could do with an upgrade on Vyner (Kalas hopefully) and another quality LWB - probably a bit more naturally attacking than Dasilva. I appreciate that's harsh on Vyner given how he's playing, but just what I think. 

I don't want to get ahead of myself, but I believe if we keep ourselves as injury free as possible this squad could compete for top 8 or playoffs. 

It's the most exciting forward line I can remember that's for sure. 

[Grey Fox]

I like this squad, and I like our manager, however I don’t think we have enough to go up this year when compared to the likes of Burnley , Watford , Sheffield United, WBA and some others. 
 

Pearson tells it as it is, so I’m hanging on to his original “three year” comment and hope that with some backing in the summer we go up next season. As to this, I’m confident that we won’t go down so will just sit back and enjoy, which to be honest is a rare luxury with City.

[Phileas Fogg]

5 minutes ago, Grey Fox said:

I like this squad, and I like our manager, however I don’t think we have enough to go up this year when compared to the likes of Burnley , Watford , Sheffield United, WBA and some others. 
 

Pearson tells it as it is, so I’m hanging on to his original “three year” comment and hope that with some backing in the summer we go up next season. As to this, I’m confident that we won’t go down so will just sit back and enjoy, which to be honest is a rare luxury with City.

I think we've just got to give it our best shot this season and see what happens.

It's entirely feasible that in January we lose both Scott and Semenyo - January is always an awkward month to recruit, so we've got to make a real run of good form over the next few months and see what we can do..

[Alessandro]

29 minutes ago, Rob k said:

I keep seeing this….let me put the record straight. I sit with them both within a big group, yes they are both well informed and know what they are talking about when it comes to City’s inner workings, but to say they have lost objectivity is completely wrong. I myself disagreed with them about the penalty decision at Hull and there was a long chat about it in the stands, but they are entitled to an opinion, that doesn’t mean they hate NP because they liked Macca and LJ. 90% of things we all agree on, 10%  we don’t - that’s football. 

The past is the past, but I have seen a fair amount of re-writing of history recently on here when it comes to LJ and MA.

With the benefit of hindsight, you can take a step back and say "that was wrong" and "that worked".

The fact is, what, 9,10 of those players in the squad vs. Huddersfield were bought or were coming through/developed during the MA/LJ period.

Yes, I've been critical, MA and LJ/DH left us in a FFP mess, the recruitment process wasn't working, however, firstly you can't deny the impact of covid and secondly we were, during that period, one big player sale fee from being closer to, if not well in, the black, simplistically.

Secondly, yes, in the end, the football style became too pragmatic and tough to watch and Holden compounded that, but let's not forget that there were periods of good football, consistent top half challenges and some unforgettable away and home nights (Man Utd e.g). I've read various comments along the line of "years of awful football under LJ is finally over" etc etc - i'm not sure that's entirely fair. 

Thirdly and finally, let's not forget other ground work put in place, off the top of my head the training ground, the influence in facilities at the stadium and work in the academy etc - Alex Scott and Tommy Conway etc didn't come out of nowhere and that era of MA and LJ etc deserves some credit for some of these foundations too IMO.

Anyway, look, as I say past is the past, LJ and MA needed to go and were right to go in the end and we'll learn from their many mistakes - If you never wanted LJ from the start, well i'm sure you're opinion will never change, but to wipe out that whole period as a dark blot our our recent history best forgotten, is IMO unfair and incorrect.

[spudski]

It's fantastic that we have kept the squad together.

What boils my piss, is the talk of our best players leaving in the January window.

Imo...we have to keep them until the summer window...otherwise...what's the point?

It's a very open league this season. Even with a smallish squad, if we keep injury free, then there is no reason we couldn't scrape into the play offs...then anything could happen.

If luck shined on us...we get to keep this young squad developing.

Between now and January, it's going to be speculation after speculation about which clubs are waiting to pounce. What player needs that? 

January is a nightmare to sell and recruit properly. Players need time to gel into a teams methods.

Any good work done between no and January...could all be undone very quickly.

I'm really hoping the Club and players can find a way to give it a go this season as a whole. And if it doesn't work...sell if needs be in the summer.

Giving time to recruit properly. 

I know it's wishful thinking...but one can dream.

The transfer windows are a complete farce imo.

They want clubs to run properly in a calculated and sustainable manner...yet the powers that be make it almost impossible with windows.

[elhombrecito]

2 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

Would love to know what Josh Bowler is thinking this morning. Big fish at Blackpool, signs for Forest and immediately loaned to 'big daddies' Olympiakos.

Big pay rise and a move from Blackpool to Greece. I'd guess he's bloody delighted about the situation!! 

[KegCity]

52 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Agreed Dave, I really like this squad too.

In my opinion, we could do with an upgrade on Vyner (Kalas hopefully) and another quality LWB - probably a bit more naturally attacking than Dasilva. I appreciate that's harsh on Vyner given how he's playing, but just what I think. 

I don't want to get ahead of myself, but I believe if we keep ourselves as injury free as possible this squad could compete for top 8 or playoffs. 

It's the most exciting forward line I can remember that's for sure. 

He's improved his general play a lot but still got a bomb scare in him. The chance where Huddersfield hit the post came from a Vyner mistake.

[HappyClapper]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:is it just me that looks at some of the clips and thinks our players look more muscular.

Nope. You and my wife!

[mozo]

33 minutes ago, spudski said:

It's fantastic that we have kept the squad together.

What boils my piss, is the talk of our best players leaving in the January window.

Imo...we have to keep them until the summer window...otherwise...what's the point?

It's a very open league this season. Even with a smallish squad, if we keep injury free, then there is no reason we couldn't scrape into the play offs...then anything could happen.

If luck shined on us...we get to keep this young squad developing.

Between now and January, it's going to be speculation after speculation about which clubs are waiting to pounce. What player needs that? 

January is a nightmare to sell and recruit properly. Players need time to gel into a teams methods.

Any good work done between no and January...could all be undone very quickly.

I'm really hoping the Club and players can find a way to give it a go this season as a whole. And if it doesn't work...sell if needs be in the summer.

Giving time to recruit properly. 

I know it's wishful thinking...but one can dream.

The transfer windows are a complete farce imo.

They want clubs to run properly in a calculated and sustainable manner...yet the powers that be make it almost impossible with windows.

You say that 'all good work between now and January would be undone' if we sell our assets then (Semenyo most likely), but by January we could be entrenched in mid table obscurity.

I think we should see how the next 4 games go before any talk of this being a playoff push because so far our fixtures have been pretty benign but we've got some tough teams to play now, three of them away from home. 

For Brereton Diaz and Semenyo I think it's just a matter of time before the right offers come in.

 

 

[Sheltons Army]

1 hour ago, Alessandro said:

The past is the past, but I have seen a fair amount of re-writing of history recently on here when it comes to LJ and MA.

With the benefit of hindsight, you can take a step back and say "that was wrong" and "that worked".

The fact is, what, 9,10 of those players in the squad vs. Huddersfield were bought or were coming through/developed during the MA/LJ period.

Yes, I've been critical, MA and LJ/DH left us in a FFP mess, the recruitment process wasn't working, however, firstly you can't deny the impact of covid and secondly we were, during that period, one big player sale fee from being closer to, if not well in, the black, simplistically.

Secondly, yes, in the end, the football style became too pragmatic and tough to watch and Holden compounded that, but let's not forget that there were periods of good football, consistent top half challenges and some unforgettable away and home nights (Man Utd e.g). I've read various comments along the line of "years of awful football under LJ is finally over" etc etc - i'm not sure that's entirely fair. 

Thirdly and finally, let's not forget other ground work put in place, off the top of my head the training ground, the influence in facilities at the stadium and work in the academy etc - Alex Scott and Tommy Conway etc didn't come out of nowhere and that era of MA and LJ etc deserves some credit for some of these foundations too IMO.

Anyway, look, as I say past is the past, LJ and MA needed to go and were right to go in the end and we'll learn from their many mistakes - If you never wanted LJ from the start, well i'm sure you're opinion will never change, but to wipe out that whole period as a dark blot our our recent history best forgotten, is IMO unfair and incorrect.

Or , more simply put

 

 

The era of missed opportunity

[spudski]

8 minutes ago, mozo said:

You say that 'all good work between now and January would be undone' if we sell our assets then (Semenyo most likely), but by January we could be entrenched in mid table obscurity.

I think we should see how the next 4 games go before any talk of this being a playoff push because so far our fixtures have been pretty benign but we've got some tough teams to play now, three of them away from home. 

For Brereton Diaz and Semenyo I think it's just a matter of time before the right offers come in.

 

 

I said...'could'...not 'would'

I just get sick to death of watching our best players being sold on.

It does my head in.

It's all well and good selling...but you have to replace with players that will make you better. Then they have to develop and settle in...so another season gone. It's continual catch up. 

As a team in this league with no parachute payments, imo, the only way of being near promotion is if we develop and keep our assets together for a season minimum. What's the point otherwise.

We buy players, or develop through academy, and during that time we become an average team. As soon as we become good/better...we sell our best players. 

To continue selling we will never go up. No chance. 

It's just continual one step forward, 2 steps back. 

It's the hope that kills you.

 

[Sir Geoff]

58 minutes ago, elhombrecito said:

Big pay rise and a move from Blackpool to Greece. I'd guess he's bloody delighted about the situation!! 

Depends what his ambitions are. If it is to play in the Premier League then he's been sold a dud. Big pay rise great, that will pay for any holiday he wants in Greece. A bit different living there for a year imo.

[CliftonCliff]

2 hours ago, 1960maaan said:

We finally look able to control and take care of the ball better.

Absolutely this, almost above any other consideration.

For what seemed a very long time, I was watching games and tearing my hair out at a glaring inability to string a few decent passes together. It was exasperating and baffling in equal measure. Even experienced, mature players like James appeared at times unable to execute a simple pass and persistently gave the ball away. My mates will tell you I sounded like a stuck record, repeatedly saying through gritted teeth "just look after the ****ing ball, for Christ's sake!" We became for a time a counter-attacking team, and to be fair actually started to look quite good at it, but it was making a virtue out of a necessity. We had no choice but to play on the break, because most of the time we surrendered possession to the other side and were playing without the ball for long periods.

It looks utterly different now. The other night, I watched as Scott and others strutted their stuff, knocking the ball around with confidence, with Huddersfield chasing shadows at times. I could hardly believe I was watching the same group of players. And there was that opening move from the kick-off at Blackpool, when I counted something like ten or a dozen passes without the opposition getting a touch, before Well hit the post. If that had gone in, it would have gone down in history as one of the great City goals, rather like that one of Tammy's that gets replayed every now and again, where we kept the ball for twenty-odd passes or whatever it was.

We're seeing confident, controlled, sustained possession at last: it's a breath of fresh air and a joy to watch. If we can just persuade one or two individuals not to be over-confident and stop playing suicide balls in dangerous territory... (but that's been debated at length elsewhere).

[Alessandro]

20 minutes ago, Sheltons Army said:

Or , more simply put

 

 

The era of missed opportunity

Very simplified conclusion to a very long and detailed argument IMO!

Football’s a game of missed opportunities after all….

[SE23Red]

7 minutes ago, spudski said:

I said...'could'...not 'would'

I just get sick to death of watching our best players being sold on.

It does my head in.

It's all well and good selling...but you have to replace with players that will make you better. Then they have to develop and settle in...so another season gone. It's continual catch up. 

As a team in this league with no parachute payments, imo, the only way of being near promotion is if we develop and keep our assets together for a season minimum. What's the point otherwise.

We buy players, or develop through academy, and during that time we become an average team. As soon as we become good/better...we sell our best players. 

To continue selling we will never go up. No chance. 

It's just continual one step forward, 2 steps back. 

It's the hope that kills you.

 

But isn't our recruitment over the last three months exactly aligned to what you wish for? 

Given the media circus that is deadline day it's noticeable our latest deal for a first team player was way back in mid-July. As a club we basically took control of our own destiny, executed a recruitment plan early and then got to work on building a playing identity.

[Mr Popodopolous]

38 minutes ago, spudski said:

I said...'could'...not 'would'

I just get sick to death of watching our best players being sold on.

It does my head in.

It's all well and good selling...but you have to replace with players that will make you better. Then they have to develop and settle in...so another season gone. It's continual catch up. 

As a team in this league with no parachute payments, imo, the only way of being near promotion is if we develop and keep our assets together for a season minimum. What's the point otherwise.

We buy players, or develop through academy, and during that time we become an average team. As soon as we become good/better...we sell our best players. 

To continue selling we will never go up. No chance. 

It's just continual one step forward, 2 steps back. 

It's the hope that kills you.

 

Just hypothetically, would you therefore be willing to swallow a small to modest points deduction If failure to sell saw us breach limits? I'm starting to think maybe it would be worth it to keep varied players for longer.

Edited September 2, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[swanker]

I like Pearson and it has been interesting to watch how he’s gone about rebuilding the club. I know performances and results haven’t been what we’ve wanted but slowly he’s turned us around. 
 

He said he wanted a project and it’s starting to look like the city job is exactly what he wanted. 
 

I know everyone had a opinion on how thing should be done, especially when things aren’t going well. But Just sit back now and watch a bloke who knows what he doing turn us into a good footballing side. 
 

At the moment I will be expecting us to get some kind of result no matter who we’re playing. 

[spudski]

6 minutes ago, SE23Red said:

But isn't our recruitment over the last three months exactly aligned to what you wish for? 

Given the media circus that is deadline day it's noticeable our latest deal for a first team player was way back in mid-July. As a club we basically took control of our own destiny, executed a recruitment plan early and then got to work on building a playing identity.

I agree...what we did pre season was excellent, as has been this window.

However, it's all well and good recruiting players, if they are already at a level to kick on.

We are in the market for young hungry players that still need to develop and find their level.

My point being...we don't get to a point where our players develop as one and we become a team capable of promotion.

It's great seeing these players develop, but in the end the only people benefiting are the teams they end up at.

It's a never ending circle, of develop and sell your best.

I'm all for the system we have in place...as long as we keep players to eventually benefit from.

Otherwise it pointless...a perpetual chain of just keeping afloat.

8 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Just hypothetically, would you therefore be willing to swallow a small to modest points deduction If failure to sell saw us breach limits? I'm starting to think maybe it would be worth it to keep varied players for longer.

I guess it depends on the points deduction...and whether there are clauses in players contracts, that when triggered means they leave, or they want to.

I can't see us ever being top 6 if we don't hold onto our best players for over a season.

[Sheltons Army]

Just now, Mr Popodopolous said:

Just hypothetically, would you therefore be willing to swallow a small to modest points deduction If failure to sell saw us breach limits? I'm starting to think maybe it would be worth it.

I would Mr P , 

Tye benefits of turning down any bid in the window just closed is

i) We get the benefit on the pitch of Antoine , Scott etc , at least until January

ii) Assuming we get our belief re any ongoing / future transfer value Correct  , I would hope the extra fee we eventually receive anyone subject of a unsatisfactory / derisory bid in the window just gone , will more than compensate for a small amount of points

A point deduction could, of course , in theory push out of a play off place , but , if I’m honest I’m not sure we are yet looking serious play off contenders , if we continue recent results , that may change.
 

And , it would be difficult to quantify but I’d suggest that keeping those players subject of interest , will see us acquire more points by being involved , than we would lose by any points deduction

The good thing is , and credit to them , and something that allows us to make easier decisions, is the conduct and attitude of Scott , Semenyo etc who appear, for now at least , to keep their heads down and play 

Either could have made life more difficult by making it clear they wanted a move , and they put the Boly’s , Fofana’s Ronaldo’s , of the world ,  and their conduct , completely to shame 

 

On the FFP situation , if we were tight or just over , I know the Nathan Baker retirement won’t see us get any FFP‘allowance’ because of it , but I’d suggest it would be pretty good mitigation regarding any possible penalty.

[mozo]

58 minutes ago, spudski said:

I said...'could'...not 'would'

I just get sick to death of watching our best players being sold on.

It does my head in.

It's all well and good selling...but you have to replace with players that will make you better. Then they have to develop and settle in...so another season gone. It's continual catch up. 

As a team in this league with no parachute payments, imo, the only way of being near promotion is if we develop and keep our assets together for a season minimum. What's the point otherwise.

We buy players, or develop through academy, and during that time we become an average team. As soon as we become good/better...we sell our best players. 

To continue selling we will never go up. No chance. 

It's just continual one step forward, 2 steps back. 

It's the hope that kills you.

 

Oh yeah I agree. It's annoying be a selling club, but frankly we've recently become a 'letting them run their contract down' club and that's equally annoying as it keeps our transfer budget at zero! 

Our form recently has been sweet relief. It's a nice change that OTIB is getting giddy and talking about success. I do think it's a bit premature though. 

[Sheltons Army]

2 minutes ago, mozo said:

Oh yeah I agree. It's annoying be a selling club, but frankly we've recently become a 'letting them run their contract down' club and that's equally annoying as it keeps our transfer budget at zero! 

Our form recently has been sweet relief. It's a nice change that OTIB is getting giddy and talking about success. I do think it's a bit premature though. 

It’s actually nice , to , again , have some players that are coveted by other Clubs !!!!