45 crosses

[And Its Smith]

What are peoples views on this?  Most games we produce about 15 crosses, sometimes as high as 20.  Tonight it was 45.  Is that because Coventry packed the central areas and forced us wide or is it down to a lack of bravery and taking the easy option?  Or was it a tactic from Nige?  Hard to say really, maybe his post match interview or press conference will reveal more.  The problem with crossing 45 times comes about when your players (a) can’t really cross a consistent ball and (b) your strikers aren’t attacking great areas.

Disappointed at a missed opportunity for 3 points.  For me, it was a lack of bravery in pass choice and also lack of movement, which often can go hand in hand.  We either dominate possession and then chances to break are rare, with our slow build up allowing teams to set their defence with ease or we get dominating and can then break but the opposition puts our defence under too much pressure.  
 

Very interested to see what Nige has to say 

[BS3City]

45 crosses, the majority of which were crap...

[Southport Red]

I don’t have a clue, but, on commentary, Tinman said a lot of it was down to CCFC’s RB giving JD way too much space. 

[Lack of Action Man]

Dominate possession but get little reward for it. It worries me. Better teams will capitalise on our inability to build a lead. 

[The Gasbuster]

The three monsters they had at the back just lapped them up.

[cidercity1987]

6 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

What are peoples views on this?  Most games we produce about 15 crosses, sometimes as high as 20.  Tonight it was 45.  Is that because Coventry packed the central areas and forced us wide or is it down to a lack of bravery and taking the easy option?  Or was it a tactic from Nige?  Hard to say really, maybe his post match interview or press conference will reveal more.  The problem with crossing 45 times comes about when your players (a) can’t really cross a consistent ball and (b) your strikers aren’t attacking great areas.

Disappointed at a missed opportunity for 3 points.  For me, it was a lack of bravery in pass choice and also lack of movement, which often can go hand in hand.  We either dominate possession and then chances to break are rare, with our slow build up allowing teams to set their defence with ease or we get dominating and can then break but the opposition puts our defence under too much pressure.  
 

Very interested to see what Nige has to say 

 

Starting with Norwich , the Champ teams realised we have zero attacking threat from our wing backs and plenty from central areas.

Hence letting the wing backs have all the ball knowing they won't do anything with it

[steveybadger]

Last 2 games have been slightly concerning in terms of teams appearing to have worked us out a bit. 

[grifty]

Every cross seemed to be a bit aimless, curling away from the goal and slightly behind where the attackers were.

The one time we cut inside and 'crossed' the ball from Williams, Conway got a glancing header and Wells could have diverted it in.

We needed to get to the byline and drill the ball across at shin height for our good finishers and their big centre backs to slice it in.

[Gimme Shelton]

If I was Sykes tonight I'd be going mental. Ball passed to him then everyone else disappears, no-one showed

[And Its Smith]

1 minute ago, steveybadger said:

Last 2 games have been slightly concerning in terms of teams appearing to have worked us out a bit. 

Just had a look as didn’t check QPR game when looking at averages and it was 35 on Saturday so yes, last two games big change.  80 crosses in two games. I just wish we were brave enough to sometimes ignore the space afforded to us and go through the middle 

[Robbored]

9 minutes ago, BS3City said:

45 crosses, the majority of which were crap...

Dasilva was getting into very decent positions but his crosses were the worst. I can’t recall any of them hitting a City target.  I was yelling at him to lift the bloody cross! it was so frustrating…….jeez………

At least City managed to keep a clean sheet.

[IAmNick]

I thought it was the speed at which we got the ball to a crossing position as much as the delivery today personally.

We do best by getting to the 18 yard line, byline, driving in the box, or whatever as quickly as possible and getting the ball in early for our mobile front men to aggressively attack. Today we were much more ponderous, and it let Coventry pack the area and that's not the environment for Wells / Semenyo and co to thrive in.

The other side is I don't think we pose enough of the threat from outside the box to help draw teams out - Massengo and Williams aren't going to be striking dangerous 25 yard shots if they get half a chance.

Coventry had their flat back 5, then a flat 3 in front of it for a lot of the game and it was just too congested to play like that. We had to be more brave/decisive with our decision making at times which plays to our strengths.

Disappointing overall - the wing backs need to do better. I think Jay looked more of a threat than Sykes personally, but I don't think it's entirely down to them.

Edited October 4, 2022 by IAmNick

[stephenkibby.]

6 minutes ago, cidercity1987 said:

Starting with Norwich , the Champ teams realised we have zero attacking threat from our wing backs and plenty from central areas.

Hence letting the wing backs have all the ball knowing they won't do anything with it

Good start to the season again will probably keep us in good stead.

There is no way we will trouble the top 6. 

Were so far off challenging wele finnish 6 or 7 places outside the drop.

[Kingswood Robin]

Far too repetitive and predictable. The same patterns of play over and over. Any competent defence will deal with the predictable all day long.  Antoine got in behind them a few times, other than that nothing incisive.

[Sir Geoff]

45 crosses and about 3 made it into the box.

[Numero Uno]

One cross from Vyner was in a fantastic area but Weimann just held his position when he would have had a great chance to score if he had attacked it. Martin would have buried it. It wasn’t only about the delivery.

[Sleepy1968]

15 minutes ago, steveybadger said:

Last 2 games have been slightly concerning in terms of teams appearing to have worked us out a bit. 

Yeah. That's what tends to happen with us, isn't it? Get worked out - continue to pummel head against brick wall for another 20 games.

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

One cross from Vyner was in a fantastic area but Weimann just held his position when he would have had a great chance to score if he had attacked it. Martin would have buried it. It wasn’t only about the delivery.

That was the best cross of the night I thought.  Weimann with confidence attacks that ball 

[Numero Uno]

Just now, And Its Smith said:

That was the best cross of the night I thought.  Weimann with confidence attacks that ball 

Exactly. I thought we played slightly within ourselves tonight. That’s three defeats in a row for you.

[Simon bristol]

27 minutes ago, The Gasbuster said:

The three monsters they had at the back just lapped them up.

Exactly,, and we had wells trying to compete with them. Someone should have seen that wasnt working and come up with something different 

[The Bard]

The crossing in play, from free kicks and from corners was utterly abysmal.  We hardly stressed their defence who kept shape and lapped it up. 

[Numero Uno]

1 minute ago, Simon bristol said:

Exactly,, and we had wells trying to compete with them. Someone should have seen that wasnt working and come up with something different 

But had Weimann attacked the one cross put in with real quality we walk away with the points.

[Jimbo76]

What we need is an attacking full back who got loads of assists last year and was named league player of the season. 

 

[GrahamC]

Coventry set up to let us have a lot of possession away from their goal & to defend the aerial ball in.

Thought Dasilva’s crossing tonight was really poor & we rarely won the first ball in the air.

Frustrating night.

[firstdivision]

22 minutes ago, stephenkibby. said:

Good start to the season again will probably keep us in good stead.

There is no way we will trouble the top 6. 

Were so far off challenging wele finnish 6 or 7 places outside the drop.

I agree. Far more likely. 

[Lew-T]

We’re not a big physical side. Even their forwards won the majority of the ball in the air from the goal kicks.

We stopped getting to the byline for the pull backs. We were getting some joy with it in the first half from Semenyo, but soon stopped and started lumping it from the sideline.

[BUTOR]

When teams set up in a way that reduces our main threats (the cat is out the bag regarding our attack) we have to find different patterns of play and alternative ways of grinding out goals, not just buckets of hopeful crosses. That’s 3 of the last 4 sides who have seemingly worked us out.

Complimentary in some ways that teams are almost stifling themselves to cope with us but we have to give them more to think about with Plan B’s and C’s. 

Unpopular decisions may have to be taken for that to happen. Martin playing in a side with proper shape (not 4/5 striker mayhem) who are consistently delivering crosses is bound to get on the end of some of them in a way that other strikers won’t. Weimann is now (in an attacking sense) a passenger and his threat vanishes when we play like that, Pearson may need to view him as liable to a substitution once in a while. Maybe we also need to think about Wilson’s crossing ability which has always been very good and would create more opportunities than the average deliveries of Sykes and JD, but he’s going to have to start getting minutes as he looks miles off the pace right now. 

This is where managers earn their corn, we’re still keeping hold of the ball and that remains big step forward. There are now however some tactical tweaks to be made before early season confidence starts to drain. If the goals dry up where does that leave us? 

[AppyDAZE]

When I click on this thread something inside me wants to just say 96 Tears  :laugh: I have no idea why.

The 68 Guns

Brimful of Asha on the 45

[Lrrr]

Crossing is the least efficient method of creating goals 

[Dr Balls]

It’s frustrating as the crosses were poor quality as were the set pieces, especially when neither play to the strengths of Wells and Semenyo who are better running on to through balls on the ground. My reasoning behind replacing Semenyo with Conway was that at least it gave us someone who likes to get their head on crosses. That said we did little in possession a lot of the time and we were a bit ponderous in attack, which allowed Coventry to get lots of men behind the ball, which is exactly what QPR did at the weekend. There were also a number of wasted shirt corners. If you have Atkinson and Vyner up from the back why play it short and not get into the penalty box?

Certainly areas for improvement. Whether we have the personnel to enact those changes is another matter altogether…

[Cityboy1954]

1 hour ago, BS3City said:

45 crosses, the majority of which were crap...

Dasilva only hits opponants in the mid driff cant pass p...s

[pongo88]

1 hour ago, Robbored said:

Dasilva was getting into very decent positions but his crosses were the worst. I can’t recall any of them hitting a City target.  I was yelling at him to lift the bloody cross! it was so frustrating…….jeez………

At least City managed to keep a clean sheet.

I lose interest when Dasilva gets the ball at the edge of the opposition penalty area. As you say, almost every cross is awful and goes to an opposition player and if he’s in a shooting position you know he’s going to miss. It’s no good doing the nice stuff in the build up if the finish just gives the ball away. 

[Red-Robbo]

1 hour ago, And Its Smith said:

What are peoples views on this?  Most games we produce about 15 crosses, sometimes as high as 20.  Tonight it was 45.  Is that because Coventry packed the central areas and forced us wide or is it down to a lack of bravery and taking the easy option?  Or was it a tactic from Nige?  Hard to say really, maybe his post match interview or press conference will reveal more.  The problem with crossing 45 times comes about when your players (a) can’t really cross a consistent ball and (b) your strikers aren’t attacking great areas.

Disappointed at a missed opportunity for 3 points.  For me, it was a lack of bravery in pass choice and also lack of movement, which often can go hand in hand.  We either dominate possession and then chances to break are rare, with our slow build up allowing teams to set their defence with ease or we get dominating and can then break but the opposition puts our defence under too much pressure.  
 

Very interested to see what Nige has to say 

 

 

We were too slow. By the time the crosses went in, they had 4 men (or more) back and with the keeper's help as well, dealt with them in a perfunctory matter.

By contrast, they broke with speed, causing mayhem among our midfield - such that it was - and defence. 

I think they were more likely to score.  Quick counters have worked for us in the past, but tonight we seemed to favour advancing up the field with the urgency of a man driving to lunch with his in-laws. 

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

What are peoples views on this?  Most games we produce about 15 crosses, sometimes as high as 20.  Tonight it was 45.  Is that because Coventry packed the central areas and forced us wide or is it down to a lack of bravery and taking the easy option?  Or was it a tactic from Nige?  Hard to say really, maybe his post match interview or press conference will reveal more.  The problem with crossing 45 times comes about when your players (a) can’t really cross a consistent ball and (b) your strikers aren’t attacking great areas.

Disappointed at a missed opportunity for 3 points.  For me, it was a lack of bravery in pass choice and also lack of movement, which often can go hand in hand.  We either dominate possession and then chances to break are rare, with our slow build up allowing teams to set their defence with ease or we get dominating and can then break but the opposition puts our defence under too much pressure.  
 

Very interested to see what Nige has to say 

 

My rather simplistic response is “poor execution” tonight.  On another night / afternoon, like most of this season, we probably create several really good chances.

As for why we got to many…we actually controlled a lot of possession in their half, but we didn’t get round the back very often.  Dabo and Bidwell normally play high, but we forced them back (or maybe they were happy to be deep?), but we didn’t hit our targets.  I thought we worked our “positions” pretty well tonight, but both Dasilva and Sykes were very poor with their crossing.

[NcnsBcfc]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

My rather simplistic response is “poor execution” tonight.  On another night / afternoon, like most of this season, we probably create several really good chances.

As for why we got to many…we actually controlled a lot of possession in their half, but we didn’t get round the back very often.  Dabo and Bidwell normally play high, but we forced them back (or maybe they were happy to be deep?), but we didn’t hit our targets.  I thought we worked our “positions” pretty well tonight, but both Dasilva and Sykes were very poor with their crossing.

I can only remember JD's cross to Wells for the Luton game being the one real one of quality so far this season.

The whole of last season JD only had 4 assists from LWB. With precious few coming from the 10 other players to play RWB.

I think we all hoped Wilson would make a difference, but he looks a bit short on quality at the moment in both defensive, and offensive positions. It's a big leap from L2, so we may be looking at him in 6-12 months being a bit more accustomed to the pace and physicality of the Championship.

I can see JD going at the end of the season now. We need an upgrade at LWB, and I don't see us progressing there with giving him a new 2-3 year deal unfortunately. 

[DaveInSA]

I watched Jay closely against QPR and again last night.

The lad has talent to burn, seriously technically brilliant.

But. I feel he has a crisis of confidence (not the only one of our players by the way). 

I’d love to see him play, truly play with him and vigour and whip balls in. He can do it. But something stops him.

[DirtySanchez]

Think we missed a trick by not getting Martin involved with the amount of crosses going into the box. Of all those crosses, I think we got on the end of 2-3 maximum. But the quality of the crosses was quite poor and no one really attacking the ball. Onwards and upwards.

[Davefevs]

29 minutes ago, DaveInSA said:

I watched Jay closely against QPR and again last night.

The lad has talent to burn, seriously technically brilliant.

But. I feel he has a crisis of confidence (not the only one of our players by the way). 

I’d love to see him play, truly play with him and vigour and whip balls in. He can do it. But something stops him.

Think Jay just lacks that but of extra pace to get enough space on the outside unless he beats his man with trickery.  When he comes inside he is often attacking the defenders wrong foot and can be more effective.

Ive always been critical of his final ball, tends to hit an area rather than a player, but I do think he’s improved that a bit this season, but last night was off-target. 

[Northern Red]

I was a bit surprised that Martin didn't come on, especially as he usually does even when we haven't been crossing it to the levels we did last night.

[Ivorguy]

10 hours ago, BS3City said:

45 crosses, the majority of which were crap...

And no winger on the pitch……

[spudski]

I've mentioned about the effectiveness of crosses from open play before. Many times.

It's one of the least proficient ways of scoring. The odds are often stacked against you. GK can jump and use hands, and often more defenders than attackers in box. 

You are relying on the defence making mistakes rather than your own good play.

There is so much analysis and study on the subject. 

Yesterday it seemed our only form of creativeness was to come from the flanks.

We were pedestrian and missed Alex Scott's creativeness and speed of feet and mind.

We offered nothing from CM. Hence Weimann and Semenyo often dropping back and trying to link play and create something. Which left no overloads in the box to try and win a cross. Even our wing backs were lack luster in getting on the back post from crosses.

For all his faults Naismith creates from the Centre of the park as does Scott. That became even more apparent in the second half.

After watching that yesterday...I really do see an opportunity missed if Kai and Scott aren't used together in CM. Both can defend...both can create.

A case for Vyner, Atkinson, Pring back three before Kalas is back? To keep defensively sound. 

Kai and Scott CM 

The rest as usual...

 

PROBABILITY OF SCORING A GOAL FROM A CROSS [1.6%].

---

This means that, on average, it takes 64 crosses to score a goal.

Obviously, from these stats we cannot extrapolate the number of times a goal is indirectly scored after cross, like after a failed clearance by the opponents. However, we are not sure this really matters. Our point is: should you really base your attacking strategy on exploiting the opponents’ defensive mistakes?

[DaveInSA]

10 minutes ago, spudski said:

I've mentioned about the effectiveness of crosses from open play before. Many times.

It's one of the least proficient ways of scoring. The odds are often stacked against you. GK can jump and use hands, and often more defenders than attackers in box. 

You are relying on the defence making mistakes rather than your own good play.

There is so much analysis and study on the subject. 

Yesterday it seemed our only form of creativeness was to come from the flanks.

We were pedestrian and missed Alex Scott's creativeness and speed of feet and mind.

We offered nothing from CM. Hence Weimann and Semenyo often dropping back and trying to link play and create something. Which left no overloads in the box to try and win a cross. Even our wing backs were lack luster in getting on the back post from crosses.

For all his faults Naismith creates from the Centre of the park as does Scott. That became even more apparent in the second half.

After watching that yesterday...I really do see an opportunity missed if Kai and Scott aren't used together in CM. Both can defend...both can create.

A case for Vyner, Atkinson, Pring back three before Kalas is back? To keep defensively sound. 

Kai and Scott CM 

The rest as usual...

 

PROBABILITY OF SCORING A GOAL FROM A CROSS [1.6%].

---

This means that, on average, it takes 64 crosses to score a goal.

Obviously, from these stats we cannot extrapolate the number of times a goal is indirectly scored after cross, like after a failed clearance by the opponents. However, we are not sure this really matters. Our point is: should you really base your attacking strategy on exploiting the opponents’ defensive mistakes?

That’s the strategy other teams use against us - apparently it’s a winning formula for them

In all seriousness though, our squad is totally threadbare. We have two fit CBs and our midfield is powder puff and lightweight. Plus, the players we do have fit and available have too many “off days”.

 

[spudski]

22 minutes ago, DaveInSA said:

That’s the strategy other teams use against us - apparently it’s a winning formula for them

In all seriousness though, our squad is totally threadbare. We have two fit CBs and our midfield is powder puff and lightweight. Plus, the players we do have fit and available have too many “off days”.

 

I agree that we can't just rely on Scott and James in CM. As you say there are off days. Finding a formula that is consistent is the key. However as you imply...our quality is lacking in depth in certain departments.

 

[OneTeamInBristol]

I like Jay's general play, think he's very skilful on the ball especially for a wing back.

But his crossing is woeful, most of them don't beat the first man or he tries to generate so much power on it that it sails out of play beyond the goal.

I can't recall a player who gets in so many great crossing positions and then fluffs the ball in.

Edited October 5, 2022 by OneTeamInBristol

[Super]

2 minutes ago, OneTeamInBristol said:

I like Jay's general play, think he's very skilful on the ball especially for a wing back.

But his crossing is woeful, most of them don't beat the first man or he tries to generate so much power on it that it sails out of play beyond the goal.

I can't recall a player who gets in so many great crossing positions and then fluffs the ball in.

The formation that we play the most important players are the WB's. The final ball from both last night was terrible.

[mozo]

I much prefer when we drill low crosses across the 6 yard box but we didn't really do that. Semenyo had a golden opportunity to pass across to Wells and instead smashed the ball high and long.

I'm surprised we waited so long to bring Conway on. It was also clear that Sykes was struggling to create anything so Wilson made sense.

I've noticed this that Williams and Weimann are struggling with their delivery this season when they should typically be creating chances. 

Summary: it's all got a bit shit.

Edited October 5, 2022 by mozo

[spudski]

17 minutes ago, Super said:

The formation that we play the most important players are the WB's. The final ball from both last night was terrible.

Coventry played deep and narrow to stop the space in behind centrally. It gives our attackers no room to move into.

When a team does that...you use your wing backs to go wide and draw the opposition's defence out and wider. Creating space in behind and angles.

We didn't do that. 

Coventry kept their shape and discipline and allowed aimless crosses into the box, that they easily dealt with...then countered. 

It was a ridiculous tactic by us yesterday considering how Coventry set up.

My only conclusion for us doing so, was that we realised we had no creativity in midfield and that crossing was our best opportunity of scoring...relying on their defence to make a mistake rather than our guile.

I can see Birmingham doing similar.

Hopefully if Scott returns, we can play as we've done in the past 

[Bazooka Joe]

45 crosses?

Add one more to that.

The cross we have to bear as City fans,

 

One day all these crosses will hopefully amount to something and we'll crucify the opposition.

[beaverface]

I thought when Atkinson\Semenyo worked the ball with DaSilva down the left by offering overlaps, we looked especially dangerous when getting to the byline, but then we stopped doing that, and DaSilva just attempted to cross ball rather than use an overlap.

I thought getting to the touchline and dribbling along was our best chance of scoring, but we didn't do it often enough.

Don't get me started on our shooting from distance. I can't remember the last time we scored a 25yarder - probably Bakinson last season.

Joe William's shooting is atrocious - I've never seen such a high % of shanked shots, but to be fair, nobody in midfield seems to shoot decently from distance any more.

[The Journalist]

2 hours ago, spudski said:

I've mentioned about the effectiveness of crosses from open play before. Many times.

It's one of the least proficient ways of scoring. The odds are often stacked against you. GK can jump and use hands, and often more defenders than attackers in box. 

You are relying on the defence making mistakes rather than your own good play.

There is so much analysis and study on the subject. 

Yesterday it seemed our only form of creativeness was to come from the flanks.

We were pedestrian and missed Alex Scott's creativeness and speed of feet and mind.

We offered nothing from CM. Hence Weimann and Semenyo often dropping back and trying to link play and create something. Which left no overloads in the box to try and win a cross. Even our wing backs were lack luster in getting on the back post from crosses.

For all his faults Naismith creates from the Centre of the park as does Scott. That became even more apparent in the second half.

After watching that yesterday...I really do see an opportunity missed if Kai and Scott aren't used together in CM. Both can defend...both can create.

A case for Vyner, Atkinson, Pring back three before Kalas is back? To keep defensively sound. 

Kai and Scott CM 

The rest as usual...

 

PROBABILITY OF SCORING A GOAL FROM A CROSS [1.6%].

---

This means that, on average, it takes 64 crosses to score a goal.

Obviously, from these stats we cannot extrapolate the number of times a goal is indirectly scored after cross, like after a failed clearance by the opponents. However, we are not sure this really matters. Our point is: should you really base your attacking strategy on exploiting the opponents’ defensive mistakes?

So, if anything, what you’re saying is… we didn’t put enough crosses in? Another 20 or so and we’d have pinched a 1-0?

[Bris Red]

12 hours ago, pongo88 said:

I lose interest when Dasilva gets the ball at the edge of the opposition penalty area. As you say, almost every cross is awful and goes to an opposition player and if he’s in a shooting position you know he’s going to miss. It’s no good doing the nice stuff in the build up if the finish just gives the ball away. 

Agreed. Dasilva’s end product often leaves a lot to be desired i find.

Edited October 5, 2022 by Bris Red

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 hours ago, DaveInSA said:

our midfield is powder puff and lightweight. Plus, the players we do have fit and available have too many “off days”.

 

How do you square this with Scott getting 5 bookings in 11 League games? Thought Williams has a bit of bite or has in the past- picked up 4 already no? Sorry just checked and it says 5.

Perhaps it's low for midfield, haven't checked comparable stats but it doesn't exactly align.

Edited October 5, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Mr Popodopolous]

Although an interesting stat.

BBC stats said we committed 7 fouls and received 2 bookings.

Coventry committed 11 fouls...and received 1.

[Mr Popodopolous]

As for crossing, these days I don't see it as all that effective with congested central areas- although different types of crossing, wingers- low and fast better than high hanging I think.

[Lew-T]

2 hours ago, OneTeamInBristol said:

I like Jay's general play, think he's very skilful on the ball especially for a wing back.

But his crossing is woeful, most of them don't beat the first man or he tries to generate so much power on it that it sails out of play beyond the goal.

I can't recall a player who gets in so many great crossing positions and then fluffs the ball in.

I’ve said it before but Jay is great around the middle of the park with the quick one two or sharp turns to get away from a player.
 

But his final ball and end product is lacking. He’s not quick enough to beat his man to the byline either.

[Harry]

2 hours ago, OneTeamInBristol said:

 

I can't recall a player who gets in so many great crossing positions and then fluffs the ball in.

I can. 
Sykes. 

[And Its Smith]

Lots of moaning about Dasilva last night in contrast to Pearson who specifically mentioned him as ‘excellent’

[Harry]

Just now, And Its Smith said:

Lots of moaning about Dasilva last night in contrast to Pearson who specifically mentioned him as ‘excellent’

Interestingly, I was walking back across the park last night infront of some Cov fans and heard them saying how they though JD looked really good. They also thought Massengo had a good game! 
I was with my daughter so couldn’t be arsed to get into the conversation with them and inform that, despite JD apparently “looking good” to them, they probably failed to notice that he delivered the square root of eff all on the six hundred and fifty nine excellent crossing positions he got into. 
 

Same goes for Sykes. I’ve been quite surprised that he hasn’t come under fire prior to now. I’ve seen quite a few posters / Twitter comments etc saying how impressed they’ve been by him. I can’t help but laugh my gonads into my throat when I see this!  He’s been dreadful. Again, work rate, yes. Happy with that. He manages to get himself into some very good attacking positions. But 9 out of 10 times he completely effs up the final ball/cross. His effort has been good, but his quality, composure and intelligence has been severely lacking. Not just last night, but all season. 
 

On a wider point, re the crosses. I think the loss of Conway severely hampered our game. We looked so static and seemed to be plodding. I don’t think I saw a single 3rd man run last night. It was all very slow and ponderous. As soon as Conway came on, we had energy and desire up front, and the melee on the half way line was due to Conway working back and closing down their midfield. I can’t actually believe that a total rookie is so integral to our success already. 
 

Last night the quality was severely lacking. The crossing and final balls were awful (but I’ve come to expect that from Dasilva and Sykes anyway), but it was more the lack of movement that was worrying. There were no passages of play that you’d expect us to have trained, for example, one time Sykes had the ball wide, half way into their half. He played a ball inside to Williams. Any team that was being well-coached would have had a midfield runner breaking in between the full back and centre back, a third man runner, looking for the first time through ball as soon as Sykes lays it back to Williams. Or one of the strikers bending a run behind to give the midfielder an immediate passing option. 
We had none of that last night, and in the one example given, all it meant was that Williams received the pass, had nothing on, so had to turn and go back to Vyner. 
 

Yes. The crossing was awful last night. It is every week from those 2.  But my worry was the lack of any play developing elsewhere, which meant we ended up playing it to the wing backs every time. 
 

As for the wider ‘crossing’ debate. Yes, when crossing from wide it’s a low success ratio. This is why good teams are coached to ‘upgrade the cross’. 
A cross from wide is a low percentage chance. If you develop play so that the wide player manages to play a cute ball inside into the box, to an on running midfielder, then you’ve upgraded the cross to a better position. Best example I use for this is the Leeds team that got promoted a couple of years ago. The majority of their goals came from cut-backs from the byline, from inside the 18. The defence was turned and there was always on oncoming midfielder to receive the cut back near the penalty spot. They got their wide players onto the ball but played an extra pass into the box before the cut back cross. They upgraded their crosses to one which had a much higher percentage of success. 
We don’t have any movement from midfield so always end up just swinging in pointless crosses from wide areas which invariably hit the first man or sail yards over everyone. 
We need to learn to upgrade the cross (or at least try Pring and Wilson in the wingback areas who have both been proven to be able to deliver more accurate crosses). 

[Daniro]

2 hours ago, beaverface said:

Joe William's shooting is atrocious -

... as was a lot of his passing last night, which, on top of his stupid booking, made me wonder what's the point of him.

[The Bard]

1 hour ago, Harry said:

I can. 
Sykes. 

Close run thing. 

There's a great quote from David Lacey an old football journalist, that Bobby Robson had the look of a man who'd just realised that he'd left the oven on.

Sykes reacts to about half his 'situations' like that. As if there were no indication it was going to happen.  Life is an endless stream of surprises. 

[big dosser]

one thing with crosses is we always seem to take a touch then cross, cant understand why we seem to lack confidence putting the ball in first time, makes it so much harder for a defender as you can whip it in-between the defence and the keeper

[Harry]

59 minutes ago, big dosser said:

one thing with crosses is we always seem to take a touch then cross, cant understand why we seem to lack confidence putting the ball in first time, makes it so much harder for a defender as you can whip it in-between the defence and the keeper

Said the same to my mate next to me last night. 
It seems the ‘first time cross’ is a thing of the past. Not many seem to do it these days. 

[Numero Uno]

7 hours ago, DirtySanchez said:

Think we missed a trick by not getting Martin involved with the amount of crosses going into the box. Of all those crosses, I think we got on the end of 2-3 maximum. But the quality of the crosses was quite poor and no one really attacking the ball. Onwards and upwards.

45 crosses and I would bet the house that Martin gets on the end of at least 2-3 of them. Like I said previously had he been on the pitch when Vyner put in a peach of a delivery he wins us the game. If the opposition tactic is to let you have it out wide and put in that many crosses then you need Martin and Conway up front, our two best attackers of crosses.

[Northern Red]

1 hour ago, Ghost Rider said:

First game we haven't scored isn't it? 

You'd never know it, would you?

[IAmNick]

Here are Skyes and Dasilvas forward cross positions from last night:

and their backwards (so cut backs) ones:

So I think they did try a bit of both - I'd have liked to see a few more cut backs personally but they did happen. I think it was the quality that was the main issue - we were too ponderous getting to those positions, which let Coventry set up and pack the box which is not one of our strengths to play into.

[Lew-T]

5 hours ago, Harry said:

Interestingly, I was walking back across the park last night infront of some Cov fans and heard them saying how they though JD looked really good. They also thought Massengo had a good game! 
I was with my daughter so couldn’t be arsed to get into the conversation with them and inform that, despite JD apparently “looking good” to them, they probably failed to notice that he delivered the square root of eff all on the six hundred and fifty nine excellent crossing positions he got into. 
 

Same goes for Sykes. I’ve been quite surprised that he hasn’t come under fire prior to now. I’ve seen quite a few posters / Twitter comments etc saying how impressed they’ve been by him. I can’t help but laugh my gonads into my throat when I see this!  He’s been dreadful. Again, work rate, yes. Happy with that. He manages to get himself into some very good attacking positions. But 9 out of 10 times he completely effs up the final ball/cross. His effort has been good, but his quality, composure and intelligence has been severely lacking. Not just last night, but all season. 
 

On a wider point, re the crosses. I think the loss of Conway severely hampered our game. We looked so static and seemed to be plodding. I don’t think I saw a single 3rd man run last night. It was all very slow and ponderous. As soon as Conway came on, we had energy and desire up front, and the melee on the half way line was due to Conway working back and closing down their midfield. I can’t actually believe that a total rookie is so integral to our success already. 
 

Last night the quality was severely lacking. The crossing and final balls were awful (but I’ve come to expect that from Dasilva and Sykes anyway), but it was more the lack of movement that was worrying. There were no passages of play that you’d expect us to have trained, for example, one time Sykes had the ball wide, half way into their half. He played a ball inside to Williams. Any team that was being well-coached would have had a midfield runner breaking in between the full back and centre back, a third man runner, looking for the first time through ball as soon as Sykes lays it back to Williams. Or one of the strikers bending a run behind to give the midfielder an immediate passing option. 
We had none of that last night, and in the one example given, all it meant was that Williams received the pass, had nothing on, so had to turn and go back to Vyner. 
 

Yes. The crossing was awful last night. It is every week from those 2.  But my worry was the lack of any play developing elsewhere, which meant we ended up playing it to the wing backs every time. 
 

As for the wider ‘crossing’ debate. Yes, when crossing from wide it’s a low success ratio. This is why good teams are coached to ‘upgrade the cross’. 
A cross from wide is a low percentage chance. If you develop play so that the wide player manages to play a cute ball inside into the box, to an on running midfielder, then you’ve upgraded the cross to a better position. Best example I use for this is the Leeds team that got promoted a couple of years ago. The majority of their goals came from cut-backs from the byline, from inside the 18. The defence was turned and there was always on oncoming midfielder to receive the cut back near the penalty spot. They got their wide players onto the ball but played an extra pass into the box before the cut back cross. They upgraded their crosses to one which had a much higher percentage of success. 
We don’t have any movement from midfield so always end up just swinging in pointless crosses from wide areas which invariably hit the first man or sail yards over everyone. 
We need to learn to upgrade the cross (or at least try Pring and Wilson in the wingback areas who have both been proven to be able to deliver more accurate crosses). 

Think you’re being a little harsh on Sykes to be fair. He’s been very good up until the QPR game.

Blackburn away he was excellent.

[Simon bristol]

9 minutes ago, Lew-T said:

Think you’re being a little harsh on Sykes to be fair. He’s been very good up until the QPR game.

Blackburn away he was excellent.

Sykes has probably exceeded all our expectations, i got the feeling last night he was running through treacle,, he needs to come out for a game or 2

[marcofisher]

As average as JD’s crossing is, if nobody is running between the lines when he has it in an attacking position then what else is he supposed to do? It’s not his game 

[Lew-T]

57 minutes ago, Simon bristol said:

Sykes has probably exceeded all our expectations, i got the feeling last night he was running through treacle,, he needs to come out for a game or 2

Yep, maybe a rest would do him good. But to say he’s been poor all season is harsh IMO.

[Harry]

2 hours ago, Lew-T said:

Think you’re being a little harsh on Sykes to be fair. He’s been very good up until the QPR game.

Blackburn away he was excellent.

Nah. He’s worked hard so people tend to like that and let it cloud judgement. His actual quality when in great positions has been poor all season.