Sack or keep Nigel Pearson

[REDOXO]

Christ alive there is some utter crap in this thread. 
 

There is Still half a season to go and a transfer window. 
 

Yes we urgently need Kalas and another defender, possibly a loan. We need to replace who we sell to fund any other signings and get the remaining dead wood off the books. 

Alan Dicks must laugh his cock off reading stuff like this. Building a team out of matchwood is hard!

Personally I’m not as in the Pearson camp as I once was, but who the hell is better at this kind of job?

[Bris Red]

56 minutes ago, M.D said:

If we have any money to spend in January then we should get Craig Shakespeare in if NP could persuade him to join..

Aswell as Curtis Fleming and Euell? You’d imagine one of them would have to be let go if Shakespeare was to come in. Suppose it all depends on how much of the budget it would it eat up.

I do find Shakespeare an interesting one though, it looks to be the case that whenever Nige has had success at a club Shakespeare has been his right hand man…

Edited December 27, 2022 by Bris Red

[Lanterne Rouge]

1 minute ago, Bris Red said:

Aswell as Curtis Fleming and Euell? You’d imagine one of them would have to be let go if Shakespeare was to come in. Suppose it all depends on how much of the budget it would it eat up.

I do find Shakespeare and interesting one though, it looks to be the case that whenever Nige has had success at a club Shakespeare has been his right hand man…

A bit left field but why not see if Shakespeare fancies the step up to manager with NP moving upstairs to DOF or similar?

[Red-Robbo]

1 hour ago, Major Isewater said:

Suddenly Nigel Pearson is talking about loans. I wouldn’t be at all surprised to see at least one come in in January. 

 

Quite. But a bit late for him to salvage this season. Maybe, at 59, that granite-hard self-assurance is starting to crack and he has started to learn the error of his ways in that respect. 

I never thought he was a stupid man. Just a stupidly stubborn one at times. 

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Quite. But a bit late for him to salvage this season. Maybe, at 59, that granite-hard self-assurance is starting to crack and he has started to learn the error of his ways in that respect. 

I never thought he was a stupid man. Just a stupidly stubborn one at times. 

He did explain why he hadn’t last season, but now feels he can.  Of course he may have been making it up, or perhaps learning from a mistake.  It still wouldn’t surprise me to see no loan coming through the door.

[Red-Robbo]

25 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Christ alive there is some utter crap in this thread. 
 

There is Still half a season to go and a transfer window. 
 

Yes we urgently need Kalas and another defender, possibly a loan. We need to replace who we sell to fund any other signings and get the remaining dead wood off the books. 

Alan Dicks must laugh his cock off reading stuff like this. Building a team out of matchwood is hard!

Personally I’m not as in the Pearson camp as I once was, but who the hell is better at this kind of job?

 

It's only Leicester where he's really done it. With different personnel. Different owner. Different regulatory regime. Different finances.

Did well at Hull, but they'd been relegated, had parachute payments and he was able to bring in the likes of Solano, Koren, Harper etc. 

At Southampton, he faced a problem club and took them down to L1 for the first time in their history. Didn't uproot any trees managing in the Belgian second division either, although I accept that there are challenges with managing abroad. Failed to stop Watford's decline as well.

I personally think that there are all sorts of managers who can and have undertaken long-term rebuilds.  If NP goes, I'll be glad for the work he's put in beginning this process. The real restructuring began when Mark Ashton took another job however. 

 

 

[Red-Robbo]

8 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

He did explain why he hadn’t last season, but now feels he can.  Of course he may have been making it up, or perhaps learning from a mistake.  It still wouldn’t surprise me to see no loan coming through the door.

 

Sadly, it wouldn't surprise me to see no one come through the door. Summer seems the best time for sorting out really exciting loans; January is when you do the fire-fighting, filling-a-specific role short-term loans. 

[Bazooka Joe]

I rate Pearson, and understand what he's trying to do with scant resources, but his stubborness is doing him him no favours.

Tough game coming up against a physically strong Millwall side, with some big players. Which means that barring injury, given Pearson's bloody-mindedness, King will be the first name on the team sheet, as centre-back.

We need a clean sheet to have a chance of getting something from the Den. C'mon Nige, do us all a favour and stick in some, genuine, big strong defenders.

If not, you may soon find yourself fighting adversaries more formidable than a pack of wolves.

 

[Merrick's Marvels]

1 hour ago, M.D said:

If we have any money to spend in January then we should get Craig Shakespeare in if NP could persuade him to join..

100%

[IAmNick]

1 hour ago, robinforlife2 said:

1: He had wasted the career of Nahki Wells here and if it hadn't been for Semenyo getting injured he would have got the Bentley/Massengo treatment.

We had an excellent strike partnership last year, why would he change that?

Nahki worked hard, Pearson gave him a chance (he didn't have to), he took it, is clearly very happy here and just signed a contract extension. He clearly likes Pearson.

To day he's wasted his career is utterly ridiculous.

1 hour ago, robinforlife2 said:

He is a bully!

I don't care what others think, Pearson is a bully, he has frozen out his own choices of purchases, thrown players under the bus, and used the players I can trust nonsense. 

How do you discern between being frozen out compared to not in form or training poorly? The only player I'd consider frozen out is Bakinson, and now Massengo to some degree. Pretty clear reasons there, even though I'd personally still probably have Massengo around the squad.

We have a few examples of players being dropped and coming back better do we not? Wells, Vyner, O'Leary, Dasilva, for example. Maybe there are legitimate reasons?

Any specific quotes where he's thrown a player under the bus? I hear this a lot but it's not something I'd associate with Pearson.

Remember it's a specific thing, not just saying "X didn't have a great game" or "the defense need to work harder". That's not throwing someone under the bus.

[IAmNick]

23 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Quite. But a bit late for him to salvage this season. Maybe, at 59, that granite-hard self-assurance is starting to crack and he has started to learn the error of his ways in that respect. 

I never thought he was a stupid man. Just a stupidly stubborn one at times. 

I'd have probably liked to have seen one or two in the summer, but he gave a pretty clear and understandable reason why we didn't have any - and it wasn't just that he didn't like them.

He even said he looked and spoke to some teams in the summer I'm pretty sure.

[Red-Robbo]

Just now, IAmNick said:

I'd have probably liked to have seen one or two in the summer, but he gave a pretty clear and understandable reason why we didn't have any - and it wasn't just that he didn't like them.

He even said he looked and spoke to some teams in the summer I'm pretty sure.

 

Perchance he was a bit too fussy, seeing that we had a smallish squad and there's no way we were going to get long into the season before injuries starting to limit his in-house options?

[Top Robin]

59 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Christ alive there is some utter crap in this thread. 
 

There is Still half a season to go and a transfer window. 
 

Yes we urgently need Kalas and another defender, possibly a loan. We need to replace who we sell to fund any other signings and get the remaining dead wood off the books. 

Alan Dicks must laugh his cock off reading stuff like this. Building a team out of matchwood is hard!

Personally I’m not as in the Pearson camp as I once was, but who the hell is better at this kind of job?

Pearson has had many transfer windows and has also bought plenty of player, most of whom are not being picked.

[Davefevs]

13 minutes ago, Top Robin said:

Pearson has had many transfer windows and has also bought plenty of player, most of whom are not being picked.

3 windows

10 signings - 2 for fees and 1 for compo, 7 free

2 existing players re-signed (Weimann and Baker - now retired).

That’s the lowest in the Championship over that period.

Those are the hard numbers.

 

[Chivs]

40 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

We had an excellent strike partnership last year, why would he change that?

Nahki worked hard, Pearson gave him a chance (he didn't have to), he took it, is clearly very happy here and just signed a contract extension. He clearly likes Pearson.

To day he's wasted his career is utterly ridiculous.

How do you discern between being frozen out compared to not in form or training poorly? The only player I'd consider frozen out is Bakinson, and now Massengo to some degree. Pretty clear reasons there, even though I'd personally still probably have Massengo around the squad.

We have a few examples of players being dropped and coming back better do we not? Wells, Vyner, O'Leary, Dasilva, for example. Maybe there are legitimate reasons?

Any specific quotes where he's thrown a player under the bus? I hear this a lot but it's not something I'd associate with Pearson.

Remember it's a specific thing, not just saying "X didn't have a great game" or "the defense need to work harder". That's not throwing someone under the bus.

"I played a midfielder at centre back which tells you what I thought" - I really do paraphrase but it was a quote like that when Klose was taken off at half time during Lincoln. A game, btw, where Klose did nothing wrong, and Pearson made about 6 mistakes before the game started...

How people are defending Pearson is beyond me.

 

Ps Also, Bentley frozen out. O'Leary didn't get dropped and come back better. He was average to poor the last time Pearson blamed Bentley for something.  And eventually was so poor that even Pearson couldn't persist with him.

This season O'Leary has been poor to even poorer but Pearson is a "great man-manager" so has decided to continue with him...

[Top Robin]

19 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

3 windows

10 signings - 2 for fees and 1 for compo, 7 free

2 existing players re-signed (Weimann and Baker - now retired).

That’s the lowest in the Championship over that period.

Those are the hard numbers.

 

Still a fair number of Pearson incomings with arguably not much improvement.

[lenred]

23 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

3 windows

10 signings - 2 for fees and 1 for compo, 7 free

2 existing players re-signed (Weimann and Baker - now retired).

That’s the lowest in the Championship over that period.

Those are the hard numbers.

 

But but but but...........

[Northern Red]

59 minutes ago, Top Robin said:

Pearson has had many transfer windows and has also bought plenty of player, most of whom are not being picked.

Yeah, we should sack him so you can get straight on with hounding the next one out.

Because that's what you, and several others on here, will do. Because you always do.

[Superjack]

6 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

We could be mid table with another manager 

Or in League One already.

[IAmNick]

35 minutes ago, Chivs said:

"I played a midfielder at centre back which tells you what I thought" - I really do paraphrase but it was a quote like that when Klose was taken off at half time during Lincoln. A game, btw, where Klose did nothing wrong, and Pearson made about 6 mistakes before the game started...

How people are defending Pearson is beyond me.

 

Ps Also, Bentley frozen out. O'Leary didn't get dropped and come back better. He was average to poor the last time Pearson blamed Bentley for something.  And eventually was so poor that even Pearson couldn't persist with him.

This season O'Leary has been poor to even poorer but Pearson is a "great man-manager" so has decided to continue with him...

To me throwing someone under the bus is blaming them specifically for a loss (or big error) which was a team issue. It's not just saying someone was poor or whatever. Something goes wrong and one individual is named as the reason unfairly - that's my understanding of it.

Bentley had been poor and quite a few were saying Max should be in. Why's that frozen out? He's just been dropped, no? 

I'd probably have Bentley in personally but I can explain why without saying things like thrown under the bus, lost the dressing room, frozen out, or whatever.

I'm only "defending" him because I think there's a lot of legitimate and reasonably objective/fair criticism that could be levelled at him currently, but I don't think adding those kinds of things are it so I push back on it when I see it.

Edited December 27, 2022 by IAmNick

[Top Robin]

59 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

Yeah, we should sack him so you can get straight on with hounding the next one out.

Because that's what you, and several others on here, will do. Because you always do.

I only want managers out because they are not very good and holding our club back.

Unfortunately, the last few we have had have been rubbish which is why people like me have been quite vocal.

Until we get a decent manager in who is taking us forward, I will continue to moan.

I think that shows I care about the club.

 

[Merrick's Marvels]

14 minutes ago, Top Robin said:

I only want managers out because they are not very good and holding our club back.

 

Yeah, Pearson's really holding us back isn't he. We'd be in the Prem now if it wasn't for him. Useless. 

[glynriley]

17 minutes ago, Top Robin said:

I only want managers out because they are not very good and holding our club back.

Unfortunately, the last few we have had have been rubbish which is why people like me have been quite vocal.

Until we get a decent manager in who is taking us forward, I will continue to moan.

I think that shows I care about the club.

 

It shows you don’t have a clue where the real problem lies. 
 

Hint - Who sanctions all these shite managers?

[Top Robin]

20 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Yeah, Pearson's really holding us back isn't he. We'd be in the Prem now if it wasn't for him. Useless. 

Good to agree 

[Top Robin]

17 minutes ago, glynriley said:

It shows you don’t have a clue where the real problem lies. 
 

Hint - Who sanctions all these shite managers?

Good that you admit Pearson is a shite manager....that's a start 

[HappyClapper]

7 minutes ago, Top Robin said:

I only want managers out because they are not very good and holding our club back.

Unfortunately, the last few we have had have been rubbish which is why people like me have been quite vocal.

Until we get a decent manager in who is taking us forward, I will continue to moan.

I think that shows I care about the club.

 

I don’t think it shows you care about the club. It’s your opinion, and you’re entitled to it, but by your definition those that don’t agree with you care less than you??

I think the club is moving forward under NP. I accept that results are mixed and he has made mistakes, but in my opinion lots that is going on is good. To me it feels like he is working to a blueprint and is pushing the players to show that they are worthy of being part of our future. I have absolutely no problem with that, and this narrative of him throwing players under the bus etc is nonsense. All he has done as I see it, is to make decisions about who should be in the team/squad. It’s what he is paid for!! It’s easy with the gift of hindsight to decide that he got it wrong. Amazing how good some players become when they’re not in the team. There have also been plenty of occasions when OTIB has gone into meltdown when the team has been announced only for the team to play well and win.

The first part of the season was as good as we’ve been for a number of years. Things have undoubtedly dropped off and hopefully the squad can be freshened up with some trading/ loans in January. 
 

Keep the faith. Let’s give Pearson the next two windows and see where that takes us. I firmly believe it will be top ten.
 

 

[Merrick's Marvels]

5 minutes ago, HappyClapper said:

I don’t think it shows you care about the club. It’s your opinion, and you’re entitled to it, but by your definition those that don’t agree with you care less than you??

I think the club is moving forward under NP. I accept that results are mixed and he has made mistakes, but in my opinion lots that is going on is good. To me it feels like he is working to a blueprint and is pushing the players to show that they are worthy of being part of our future. I have absolutely no problem with that, and this narrative of him throwing players under the bus etc is nonsense. All he has done as I see it, is to make decisions about who should be in the team/squad. It’s what he is paid for!! It’s easy with the gift of hindsight to decide that he got it wrong. Amazing how good some players become when they’re not in the team. There have also been plenty of occasions when OTIB has gone into meltdown when the team has been announced only for the team to play well and win.

The first part of the season was as good as we’ve been for a number of years. Things have undoubtedly dropped off and hopefully the squad can be freshened up with some trading/ loans in January. 
 

Keep the faith. Let’s give Pearson the next two windows and see where that takes us. I firmly believe it will be top ten.
 

 

Well said. 

[Sturny]

19 minutes ago, HappyClapper said:

Keep the faith. Let’s give Pearson the next two windows and see where that takes us. I firmly believe it will be top ten.
 

 

Sounds familiar 

Edited December 27, 2022 by Sturny

[Silvio Dante]

I’ve given myself a day to think on this question because I think emotion in the face of the question is never a good thing, and because for the first time I thought it was a serious question.

I have a couple of issues with Nige at the moment - he’s intransigent (although we knew that) and it’s really harming things as he’s insisting on doing things that aren’t working. Well trodden, but:
 

Defence: Tbf I think getting Naismith to LCB is the right move as it allows him to ball play without being caught, and then your question is who leads in the middle. It can’t and shouldn’t be King - it should honestly be Vyner who did very well there, but in the absence of Kalas, we miss that natural leading CB - it’s not Rob. That is a bit of an indictment on the recruitment but I think explains the King thinking.

RWB/Midfield: I group these as I think back end of last year we had James/Williams and it worked well. So the choice is Scott in the 10 role or Weimann. Nige is shoehorning - Alex is a better midfielder but he’s also a better RWB and Andis pressing is key to our game. In an ideal world I’d want Alex CM but I think with the players we have he has them the wrong way round

Subs: The first two here I think Nige knows. I think he knows he needs a dominant, leader of a CB. I think he knows he needs to move AW back. But I also think he’s having a mare on game management currently - there was a post on here last week showing we’d be second if games finished at HT and that shows other teams react to us, but we don’t react to them. Martin not being on the bench and losing the instinct to lump it may help, but this is totally my biggest concern.

On balance I’m still in - just. I think he knows we need a dominating CB and if we don’t sign one in January I do fear - and I will admit to thinking at the start of the season we had enough for a real tilt at the top end (and ability wise versus the rest of the division I still think we do - the fact it isn’t a great league is the most damning thing). Changing throws January an absolute loop as well, particularly with RG going. 
 

It’s in still. But for the first time with real doubt.

[Norn Iron]

Who's this women's coach a few have wanted and what team does she come from? I've never heard of Jan Window.

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, Norn Iron said:

Who's this women's coach a few have wanted and what team does she come from? I've never heard of Jan Window.

Dutch not female!

[Norn Iron]

Just now, Davefevs said:

Dutch not female!

Aha! Pronounced Yan Vin Dow.

 

[Lanterne Rouge]

1 minute ago, Norn Iron said:

Aha! Pronounced Yan Vin Dow.

 

You are Shteeve McLaren and I claim my £5

[Norn Iron]

9 minutes ago, Norn Iron said:

Who's this women's coach a few have wanted and what team does she come from? I've never heard of Jan Window.

Apparently he was going to be the next Man Utd boss as he was wanted by the Glaziers

[maxjak]

7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Every word from Nigel Pearson on Bristol City fan criticism, confidence, transfers and loans

Every word from the manager's written press post-match interview following the defeat at home to West Brom

What were your thoughts on the performance, any complaints with the result?

No, not really. No Complaints. We've had chances and not taken them and they're a really good side. Carlos has got the best out of that group of players now so disappointing for us.

What were the thoughts on the second-half performance and the lack of chances created specifically?

In the first half we've conceded another poor goal but worked very hard to get back into it. We finished the first half very well and they dominated in the second half. Because they adopted a defensive sort of shape where they were going to be deep to play those balls in behind. It was difficult for us to break them down.

Do you feel let down by the performances of your players today and their reaction?

No, not at all. The reaction of what?

The reaction to the second-half performance and the fact that West Brom looked so comfortable.

Do you not think that is because are a very good side?

Yes, but I think Bristol City are a good side too.

I don't feel let down by the players at all.

Is that the most difficult or testing day for you as manager of Bristol City?

No, not really. If you're alluding to the reaction from our fans then that's part of football, I'm afraid. Our young players have really only experienced the positive aspects of football so far. What it does, it creates a situation where it will test very much the resolve of who's onside and who's not. Simple as that.

Our fans are entitled to their opinions but what is important is that they stay behind their team. It's never going to be beneficial to have a negative reaction. If they want to have a go at me, they can have a go at me. It's important our team stays together, it's as simple as that.

Do you think the reaction by the supporters was justified?

In what sense?

The reaction towards you was hostile at the end.

Yea but I've had that before. I've had that at some point in every club I've been at. People have their opinions and they can do what they want. It's fine.

Does it hurt you when you hear chants like that?

I think what's important to recognise is that I know exactly the job that I've got to do here so I keep it in context. Football matches are emotional. If people want to vent their frustrations, I'd rather they do it at me and not the players. It doesn't help the players. It's not beneficial towards the players.

Do you think the concerns about relegation at the moment are justified and should fans be concerned? Is this squad of players good enough to be clear of that?

I think we will be fine but the bottom line is that I've been brought here to do a job. Affecting change is something which makes people feel uncomfortable. It is what it is.

How can you pick them up from here because as you said, there's players in this side who haven't experienced an atmosphere like that?

We'll see how we are tomorrow because the bottom line is this, how people see the game compared to or how they feel emotionally about it, I try and keep things in context. We played against a side who were better than us today. In the first half, in particular, we caused them problems.

How people view the game is up to them. I have to keep a more pragmatic view of it. That's my job. I'm a football manager, I'm not a football fan. I'm a football manager.

Is there a danger that this result can damage confidence?

Yea, it could do. Yea, could do.

The key thing is that you've got young players in the side and you've brought a lot of them in yourself, but the worry is isn't it they hear that from the stands and people like Alex Scott won't be able to express themselves as confidently when things like that are going on?

Look, I don't want to confuse the two issues. The players are in there because they are good enough. They are our best players and so the question is, how do we approach January? Can we freshen things up or not? The players that we have, they have to be good enough so I don't know whether people actually like hearing the reality of our situation. Maybe there are a few frustrations with that in terms of being able to freshen the squad.

Look, for me, it's just a very simple situation and that is, we as a football club need to decide whether we can or cannot strengthen in January and if we can, we'll try and do it in the best way possible without affecting our financial fair play scenario.

I'm sorry not to engage on a level of emotion which conflicts with our fanbase. People have had things to say today and they're entitled to their opinions. If they're going to have a go I'd rather they have a go at the players because the players need the support of the fans.

What is the very latest, do you expect to have money to spend or not?

It’s not about having money to spend it’s how we release money so we might have to trade. It means players go out to free up money to offset the wages, it’s more about that. If there is money to spend that’s a different situation.

What we must not do is get into a situation where there’s an air of panic that 'oh dear things aren’t going well we need to splash out' and then we fall foul of the financial fair play. My job is very much to try and keep a steady hand on it and whether things go badly today or not, the season of goodwill it certainly isn’t today and that’s the bottom line.

A lot of damage was done before you came in as well... 

I’m not interested in apportioning blame, what I’m interested in, and I just said to some of the staff at West Brom, the easy thing to do is pat yourself on the back when things are going well. You earn your corn when things aren’t going well so when people start to question what we’re trying to do here they need somebody to have a go at.

So, if they’re going to have a go at me that’s fine but the bottom line is we still need to get ourselves out of the situation that we’re in and that’s not just this season and where we are in the league. I’m talking about the bigger picture of what we’re trying to do at the football club. So, if people want to express their displeasure or whatever, fine. They’re entitled to do it, but it doesn’t really help the team.

Going into January, are you as confident as ever knowing the job that has to be done? 

Yeah, there are plenty of good things yeah. So today my first reflection is, ‘they’re a good side.’ It’s not about picking the bones out of that, you can always do that with your own side, but today we came up against a side who are actually, they’re on 32 points now.

They’re actually now getting the best out of their own players, but when we played them at their place, we beat them 2-0 comfortably on the night because they had players that were coasting, and they weren’t getting the best out of their players, so it depends how you want to look at it. It depends on what the criteria it’s based on. If it’s about having a go at one person, if that’s me, fine. It doesn’t bother me; I’ve been booed off bigger stadiums.

I always try to look at the bigger picture Nigel and the bigger picture is still important...

The bigger picture is important, but we need to start winning games. That’s clear. I’m not getting away from that.

One of the criticisms from the stands Nigel was the square pegs in round holes, playing Weimann at wing-back how do you answer that to the fans? 

What do you mean square pegs in round holes? Instead of who?

I suppose Tanner on the bench 

Yeah, Tanner is a right-back. Mark Sykes has played there and who else? That’s one player Andi Weimann has scored goals from there. 

Andy King at centre-back? 

Because the other players haven’t been up to it recently. We had all this last week and if it’s about Rob Atkinson the same thing applies, he needs to respond. I see them every day, you don’t.

How King after his injury? 

I don’t know. But I thought Rob did okay when he went on apart from a couple of occasions.

And Chris Martin at the moment?

Not in the squad, yeah. But that happens to a lot of players. Choose the squad for the day, but players are still in the squad even if they’re not involved. Maybe the question needs to be can we go out then and strengthen in the areas we’re weak? I think that’s a better question. The players that are playing are the ones that are showing the most in training, so that’s the answer to your question.

What would you like to do in January ideally? 

We need to strengthen at the back is the priority. 

Just one central defender? 

I didn’t say that. We need to strengthen at the back, depending on what we can do.

How difficult is it to trade in this climate as it’s a bit of an unknown quantity after the pandemic with less money? 

I think it depends on whether, if you’re talking about if players move who are on big money in terms of wages, then that could free it up to bring a couple in for one. But again, the availability is a big thing. We are exploring what we could do in the loan market but again all those types of questions there are more variables because there are more people involved.

Whether you can do a loan deal, whether it’s affordable, whether it’s a deal that can be done on the wages all those types of things are quite complex. We’ll try to do some business, but we’ll see what happens.

 

"It is what it is"............should be painted in 10 foot lettering somewhere in the stadium?..........    What does it even express?  Why not... It was what it was?  Or......What will be, will be?   He is such a Contrary Phecker......Ha!

[RedRock]

I’m ‘sticking’. Just.

We could, and should, be doing better.

The Atkinson debacle just sums Bristol City up. It was supposed to change under Pearson’s tenure, its not.

We do our rigorous DNA assessment, we buy someone who is a ‘laid back’ character, we seemingly allowed him to develop his ‘laid back’ trait in training and on the pitch to the degree he is sidelined because he’s ‘laid back’, we put an aging midfielder who can hardly impact midfield let alone the heart of our defence as the replacement lynch pin of our defence …. not good enough I’m afraid. 

It’s the ‘same old’ story, like our injury list, like our weak physical strength, our lack of fitness and leadership, our failed transfer ‘punts’, our tendency to be consistently inconsistent…..the Club appear relentless in pursuit of failure.

Pearson was the man to stop the rot. The majority of fans, while seeking ‘revolution’ have been very accepting, to date, of an ‘evolutionary’ approach. The clock, however, is ticking and Pearson’s cutting it fine.

I always gauge where we are at by the number of players I would be gutted to see leave the Club at the next transfer window. There is ONE for this window, Tommy Conway, just a young lad who has broken into the first team. What an inditement of our playing squad, the manager, coaches and recruitment team is that? 

Fed up of excuses, delivery in performances and results required, and now. 

 

Edited December 27, 2022 by RedRock

[The chief]

2 hours ago, HappyClapper said:

I don’t think it shows you care about the club. It’s your opinion, and you’re entitled to it, but by your definition those that don’t agree with you care less than you??

I think the club is moving forward under NP. I accept that results are mixed and he has made mistakes, but in my opinion lots that is going on is good. To me it feels like he is working to a blueprint and is pushing the players to show that they are worthy of being part of our future. I have absolutely no problem with that, and this narrative of him throwing players under the bus etc is nonsense. All he has done as I see it, is to make decisions about who should be in the team/squad. It’s what he is paid for!! It’s easy with the gift of hindsight to decide that he got it wrong. Amazing how good some players become when they’re not in the team. There have also been plenty of occasions when OTIB has gone into meltdown when the team has been announced only for the team to play well and win.

The first part of the season was as good as we’ve been for a number of years. Things have undoubtedly dropped off and hopefully the squad can be freshened up with some trading/ loans in January. 
 

Keep the faith. Let’s give Pearson the next two windows and see where that takes us. I firmly believe it will be top ten.
 

 

In league one?

[Kingswood Robin]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Dutch not female!

and a right pane in the arse so I've heard

[prankerd]

See, if pearson had been given the funds lee johnson had been given id understand the hate, he hasnt tho, hes had no money to spend and been told to stabalise us.

The club couldnt afford to sack pearson even if they wanted to, if they did it would be a cheap rookie manager in the same situation nigel is in but worse because we had to pay off the last manager.

I think a majority of our fans are in cloud cuckoo land if they think this club should be higher up the table spending less than 2 mill on players in the summer.

[Kodjias Wrist]

1 minute ago, prankerd said:

See, if pearson had been given the funds lee johnson had been given id understand the hate, he hasnt tho, hes had no money to spend and been told to stabalise us.

The club couldnt afford to sack pearson even if they wanted to, if they did it would be a cheap rookie manager in the same situation nigel is in but worse because we had to pay off the last manager.

I think a majority of our fans are in cloud cuckoo land if they think this club should be higher up the table spending less than 2 mill on players in the summer.

Somebody in another thread quoted Gould earlier in the season saying we around top 10 for budget. Crazy thought! I think our squad depth is the problem not the manager. I was hoping that we would have seen Brownhill, Kelly or Webster move on and see a few mill come our way.

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, Kodjias Wrist said:

Somebody in another thread quoted Gould earlier in the season saying we around top 10 for budget. Crazy thought! I think our squad depth is the problem not the manager. I was hoping that we would have seen Brownhill, Kelly or Webster move on and see a few mill come our way.

That’s not what Gould said. He said we are looking for free transfers, and for those that we might need to fight others for we can pay top ten wages. So I think we gave Naismith (free) a healthy wage but we wouldn’t have given that to Sykes, Wilson or Bajic just because they were free.

The wage bill is coming down. It (football club)was £30.2m.  Within a year it was reduced to £23.8m. It will probably be around the £21m mark this season and the £16-18m mark at the end of this season before summer recruiting starts.  The last time it was below £20m was 2016-17 (£17.9m). So next season we will have a wage bill akin to 6/7 years ago. 

[Kodjias Wrist]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

That’s not what Gould said. He said we are looking for free transfers, and for those that we might need to fight others for we can pay top ten wages. So I think we gave Naismith (free) a healthy wage but we wouldn’t have given that to Sykes, Wilson or Bajic just because they were free.

The wage bill is coming down. It (football club)was £30.2m.  Within a year it was reduced to £23.8m. It will probably be around the £21m mark this season and the £16-18m mark at the end of this season before summer recruiting starts.  The last time it was below £20m was 2016-17 (£17.9m). So next season we will have a wage bill akin to 6/7 years ago. 

Thanks for the clarity. Surely though we can't drop as low as we did all those seasons ago? Is there data to suggest most clubs will be following a similar reduction?

Edited December 28, 2022 by Kodjias Wrist

[Mr Popodopolous]

40 minutes ago, prankerd said:

See, if pearson had been given the funds lee johnson had been given id understand the hate, he hasnt tho, hes had no money to spend and been told to stabalise us.

The club couldnt afford to sack pearson even if they wanted to, if they did it would be a cheap rookie manager in the same situation nigel is in but worse because we had to pay off the last manager.

I think a majority of our fans are in cloud cuckoo land if they think this club should be higher up the table spending less than 2 mill on players in the summer.

Few places higher and less shockers goals conceded wise seems not unreasonable to me but we are roughly where we are IMO.

The two goals v Stoke for example, watched the highlights back on Tuesday.

Then I look at the two home games even though we didn't win vs Sheffield United and in particular Watford and think these were good displays, cohesive and competitive vs  top six sides. Not saying that we are top six standard or anything but we should be a bit better.

It's a cliche but fine margins have played a role. Hit woodwork on two separate occasions v Sheffield United, v Stoke when we were 1 up and I think Phillips hit his own bar v Wet Brom.

Norwood could have been off vs us, may or may not have got us a draw, there was a good penalty shout turned down v Sheffield United and one not two v Watford.

Edited December 28, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Davefevs]

18 minutes ago, Kodjias Wrist said:

Thanks for the clarity. Surely though we can't drop as low as we did all those seasons ago? Is there data to suggest most clubs will be following a similar reduction?

As each club announces its 2022 results I’ll feed into the sausage machine.

only us, Norwich and Boro have announced so far. Norwich had one year PL, one year Champ so not good comparison.  Boro’s wages went up from £26.963m (2021) to £28.427m (2022) but too few clubs to see the trend yet. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

22 minutes ago, Kodjias Wrist said:

Thanks for the clarity. Surely though we can't drop as low as we did all those seasons ago? Is there data to suggest most clubs will be following a similar reduction?

We might need to in order to stay within FFP to this year unfortunately. It's a tough situation to say the least, many other clubs did not seek to be running huge Operating losses minus player transfers e.g..

[Davefevs]

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

As each club announces its 2022 results I’ll feed into the sausage machine.

only us, Norwich and Boro have announced so far. Norwich had one year PL, one year Champ so not good comparison.  Boro’s wages went up from £26.963m (2021) to £28.427m (2022) but too few clubs to see the trend yet. 

Birmingham via HK too although their UK accounts will show the full picture.

Depending on exchange rates and extrapolations they may have lost £24-27m last season, those UK accounts due out very soon.

Blackburn total wage bill I reckon £23-24m last season trying to extrapolate from a mix of VLL and the club accounts. After NI etc.

Edited December 28, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[Davefevs]

1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Birmingham via HK too although their UK accounts will show the full picture.

Depending on exchange rates and extrapolations they may have lost £24-27m last season, those UK accounts due out very soon.

Blackburn total wage bill I reckon £23-24m last season trying to extrapolate from a mix of VLL and the club accounts. After NI etc.

Isn’t Brum HK March to March?  Do they publish season to season ones. Can’t recall how they do theirs?

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Isn’t Brum HK March to March?  Do they publish season to season ones. Can’t recall how they do theirs?

Birmingham is difficult due to HK.

They publish their results to end of June by the end of September and it's segmented although the wage bill is bundled up a bit into the group, UK accounts should reveal all. The good news is that by the end of February they also have to publish 6 month accounts made up until the end of December.

Exchange rates fluctuate so when exactly, should it be as of the accounts release date or the final accounting period ie HK$ to £ end of June or September?

Further complicated by segment compensation which seems to be 3/4 of club segment losses. Anyway they seem to be losing quite a lot of money but when Bellingham goes that sell on should help a lot.

[SouthS22]

Thought about this question for a few days, after the Boxing Day horror show.  That’s the worst atmosphere I can remember at the Gate in 15 years. I don’t know if there’s a way back for him after that. I’ve said before that I think he has until January and no doubt he has for the simple reason that no one is actually taking charge of our club.  I think now though that there may just have been too many bizarre decisions, player fallings out and poorly managed games for there to be any other outcome for him other than the sack., whether that’s soon, or later once a new CEO is in.  I do see progress in some areas, but I also see regression in others, and at the end of the day, his record is just not good enough.  Like it or not, I think we may have reached a tipping point where too many fans are fed up with watching the team chuck games away and leaving the ground depressed after yet another poor performance, particularly at home which is so important.  We need to rediscover something like that early season form from the next home game onwards  for him to stand a chance of getting the fans back on side, but I’m not sure the players believe enough to enable that to happen. Most of them looked as dejected as I felt at the end of the Baggies game. Whether there’s a reaction from them against Millwall might just be decisive.  

[Red Army 75]

Left it a couple of days to post as really disheartened and frustrated with the football club. From top to bottom we seem rudderless. The next 4/5 months are huge for us. And the people running the club need to get it right (which makes me nervous). It doesn’t feel like we have a board. 
 

To lose Gould and sack Pearson so close together plus the transfer window I don’t think Lansdown will. 
 

But we can’t continue with these piss poor performances and Pearson’s stubbornness is a big problem. Playing king again centre back after the Stoke game was pathetic. Play Vyner there move Tanner in . I can’t believe Tanner wasn’t starting.

It’s all been covered in this topic. I don’t know what to I want to happen. The whole club feels stale as ****. 
 

Tough times 

[Guest]

Must be NP`s success at Liecs thats the reason he`s still here and his willingness to work within boundaries set for him. SL will be fully aware of fans views on him and NP`s record in the near 2yrs hes been here.

If SL was to sack him he would have to bring in ???? SL`s manager selection record speaks for itself ....almost as bad as the actual managers chosen.

So we go with what we have NP where-ever that takes us, hoping that the next or the next window makes a difference......it wont. Only a COMPLETE CHANGE will do that, so we go around and around until then.

[The Bard]

Can't answer the question until you know what would follow.

Tinnion as caretaker whilst JL flaps around trying to find a replacement? No thanks.

Chris Wilder ready to take over tomorrow? Go on then.

I know for a large chunk of people it's just a matter of sack him then see but this is City with a terrible record of managerial appointments...

[Galley is our king]

So currently 42% stay, 58% go.

If you take into account people are more likely to vote negative than positive, it's hardly a resounding success that the original poster probably wanted is it? ....

Leave him be I say.

[lenred]

3 minutes ago, Galley is our king said:

So currently 42% stay, 58% go.

If you take into account people are more likely to vote negative than positive, it's hardly a resounding success that the original poster probably wanted is it? ....

Leave him be I say.

It’s all Rovers fans voting for him to stay apparently

[GrahamC]

36 minutes ago, The Bard said:

Can't answer the question until you know what would follow.

Tinnion as caretaker whilst JL flaps around trying to find a replacement? No thanks.

Chris Wilder ready to take over tomorrow? Go on then.

I know for a large chunk of people it's just a matter of sack him then see but this is City with a terrible record of managerial appointments...

It wouldn’t be Tinnion Nick, he’s learned his lesson from before & has managed to work his way into a position now where he appears invaluable & almost bulletproof.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, it would almost certainly be Euell, Fleming has shown no real interest in being a manager in his career, whereas Euell definitely has & left Charlton specifically because he was overlooked for Ben Garner.

None of us can know what he would be like, but you’re spot on, we have a departing CEO, an owner who has been trying to sell (but only on his terms) for 18 months & a “chairman” who appears far more interested in basketball.

Pearson cannot survive without an upturn in results but a few days from the start of a transfer window where we are expected to be far more active is the worst time to look to make a change.

[Northern Red]

Be interesting to see what the numbers were like if the poll wasn't private.

[The Bard]

18 minutes ago, lenred said:

It’s all Rovers fans voting for him to stay apparently

No. It's people who make their own minds up off social media

[Red-Robbo]

5 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

It wouldn’t be Tinnion Nick, he’s learned his lesson from before & has managed to work his way into a position now where he appears invaluable & almost bulletproof.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, it would almost certainly be Euell, Fleming has shown no real interest in being a manager in his career, whereas Euell definitely has & left Charlton specifically because he was overlooked for Ben Garner.

None of us can know what he would be like, but you’re spot on, we have a departing CEO, an owner who has been trying to sell (but only on his terms) for 18 months & a “chairman” who appears far more interested in basketball.

Pearson cannot survive without an upturn in results but a few days from the start of a transfer window where we are expected to be far more active is the worst time to look to make a change.

 

Hopefully, they've learned from the Holden appointment fiasco that clubs run by adults take discrete soundings first and then give the manager the push. You can minimise or even cut out the time you need a caretaker to come in. 

Promoting a number two (no jokes please!) to be permanent head honcho has never worked out very well here either, so I trust that wouldn't be the route we go down. 

As our set routines and basic marking seems to be at sixes and sevens, I'd not be unhappy to see the First Team coaches depart with Pearson: Whatever they are trying to impart,  it isn't sinking in  

Fear of who might replace him though is a poor reason to stick with NP.  You have to take that leap sometimes and be brave. If I hadn't,  I'd still be stuck doing a job I'd grown to hate, with a miserable marriage and living somewhere I'd fallen out of love with. 

[Red-Robbo]

5 minutes ago, The Bard said:

No. It's people who make their own minds up off social media

 

Although it's ludicrous to suggest all pro-Pearson votes are Gasheads; it's equally insulting to suggest that those wanting him gone think so because of social media.

I'd reluctantly come to the conclusion that he has to go, after a long, mostly silent car journey back from Monday's game. It wasn't until I came on here that I realised that lots of my fellow fans were having the same thoughts. 

[GrahamC]

4 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Hopefully, they've learned from the Holden appointment fiasco that clubs run by adults take discrete soundings first and then give the manager the push. You can minimise or even cut out the time you need a caretaker to come in. 

Promoting a number two (no jokes please!) to be permanent head honcho has never worked out very well here either, so I trust that wouldn't be the route we go down. 

As our set routines and basic marking seems to be at sixes and sevens, I'd not be unhappy to see the First Team coaches depart with Pearson: Whatever they are trying to impart,  it isn't sinking in  

Fear of who might replace him though is a poor reason to stick with NP.  You have to take that leap sometimes and be brave. If I hadn't,  I'd still be stuck doing a job I'd grown to hate, with a miserable marriage and living somewhere I'd fallen out of love with. 

Respect your views & completely understand how you have drawn this conclusion.

Also get your final point but I cannot share your optimism, this regime’s track record on appointments is off the scale bad, I would love to think there was some reflection on why & lessons learned, I just don’t believe it.

Joe Jordan was (briefly) Cooper’s assistant & that went incredibly well (2nd spell not so much) but although I believe I can make a case for at least one other doing an ok job, your general argument here is a strong one, still reckon that’s what we would do, though..

[Tinmans Love Child]

11 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

Fear of who might replace him though is a poor reason to stick with NP.  You have to take that leap sometimes and be brave. If I hadn't,  I'd still be stuck doing a job I'd grown to hate, with a miserable marriage and living somewhere I'd fallen out of love with. 

Let's hope we don't get a Boris Johnson to Liz Truss situation if we do sack him!

5 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Although it's ludicrous to suggest all pro-Pearson votes are Gasheads; it's equally insulting to suggest that those wanting him gone think so because of social media.

I'd reluctantly come to the conclusion that he has to go, after a long, mostly silent car journey back from Monday's game. It wasn't until I came on here that I realised that lots of my fellow fans were having the same thoughts. 

Agreed, I don't need social media to tell me how poor results and performances have been!  Don't forget when NP joined on a short term deal the results were awful and we still gave him a contract!  What was the point of the trial run if the results are bad but you still get the job?  Nothing has really improved since then.  

I'm gutted as I thought he was the right man (and I wanted him when LJ was hired which would have been perfect timing) but you can't be only winning 30% of your games, have a terrible home record for your whole tenure, and keep your job 

Edited December 28, 2022 by Tinmans Love Child

[lenred]

20 minutes ago, The Bard said:

No. It's people who make their own minds up off social media

To be clear my post was being facetious and was in part referring to a comment made on here yesterday.   

[Red-Robbo]

Just now, GrahamC said:

Respect your views & completely understand how you have drawn this conclusion.

Also get your final point but I cannot share your optimism, this regime’s track record on appointments is off the scale bad, I would love to think there was some reflection on why & lessons learned, I just don’t believe it.

Joe Jordan was (briefly) Cooper’s assistant & that went incredibly well (2nd spell not so much) but although I believe I can make a case for at least one other doing an ok job, your general argument here is a strong one, still reckon that’s what we would do, though..

 

But after that we had Millen, Tinion, Holden, not to mention the brief Fawthorp disaster. And Joe had an incredible pedigree and respect in the game. A bit more than Jason Euell, no offence to him. 

It may be naive to think the board won't make another blunder, but pro-Nige posters can't really have it both ways.

You can't say the board always get everything wrong...... apart from Pearson, where they got it totally right. 

FWIW these discussions are pretty theoretical,  because I agree with you that the board is very unlikely to take any action unless we fall into the relegation zone. If the rest of the season is as dire as it currently is, he might go even if we've retained Championship status.  But that's an "if". 

[The Swan and Cemetery]

11 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

It may be naive to think the board won't make another blunder, but pro-Nige posters can't really have it both ways.

You can't say the board always get everything wrong...... apart from Pearson, where they got it totally right.

Not meant as a dig at you, as agree with the point, but the binary nature of the decision - NP stays or goes - makes the debate more heated,  when I doubt many people are entirely 100/0 or 0/100 either way. As someone who is in the ‘stay’ camp, I’m also a long way from NP is getting everything right/nothing to improve, just that I’m above 50:50 (but not hugely) in his  favour (currently) for a variety reasons including the financial situation, (willing) alternatives and so on. None of that means he’s doing a great job, just that backed into a binary choice, I’d vote stay/remain… Lawdy, time for the politics forum…

[Red-Robbo]

Just now, The Swan and Cemetery said:

Not meant as a dig at you, as agree with the point, but the binary nature of the decision - NP stays or goes - makes the debate more heated,  when I doubt many people are entirely 100/0 or 0/100 either way. As someone who is in the ‘stay’ camp, I’m also a long way from NP is getting everything right/nothing to improve, just that I’m above 50:50 (but not hugely) in his  favour (currently) for a variety reasons including the financial situation, (willing) alternatives and so on. None of that means he’s doing a great job, just that backed into a binary choice, I’d vote stay/remain… Lawdy, time for the politics forum…

 

I agree. I won't be wailing or gnashing my teeth if he stays. Providing we stay in the Championship of course. He does have some good qualities. 

But once you lose confidence in someone, it takes a lot to get it back.  Maybe he will have a stunning January.? Maybe a Matt Smith type loan (not Matt Smith and not an attacker, but you take my analogy) will perk up this season? Stranger things have happened.

But my opinion of Pearson has shifted to the negative and when that happens, the errors, missteps,  rudeness, arrogance, that you were prepared to overlook before, gets thrown into sharper focus.

I'd raise a glass if he was sacked, although I don't expect him to be.  

[The Swan and Cemetery]

2 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

I agree. I won't be wailing or gnashing my teeth if he stays. Providing we stay in the Championship of course. He does have some good qualities. 

But once you lose confidence in someone, it takes a lot to get it back.  Maybe he will have a stunning January.? Maybe a Matt Smith type loan (not Matt Smith and not an attacker, but you take my analogy) will perk up this season? Stranger things have happened.

But my opinion of Pearson has shifted to the negative and when that happens, the errors, missteps,  rudeness, arrogance, that you were prepared to overlook before, gets thrown into sharper focus.

I'd raise a glass if he was sacked, although I don't expect him to be.  

Right now, I’d go for a keeper in the Smith loan role. Whilst we’re struggling defensively across the park, it seems the outfield players have, understandably, low confidence in either O’Leary or Bentley, which is very unhelpful for both open play and set pieces. 

[BrizzleRed]

I’ve been a NP supporter so far and completely accept he’s got a massive job to do here.

That said, walking away from the Gate on Boxing Day, I was as angry and disillusioned with this club as I’ve beenfor a very long time and just wanted NP gone.  After having time to cool down, my view has changed a little.  

It says a lot about this club and SL’s managerial appointments that, despite NP’s piss poor record with results and recent performances on the pitch, my fear of who would be appointed as a replacement actually outweighs my fear of what will happen if NP remains in post.

I’d stick for now, as I really don’t have any confidence that the club would do anything other than make a cheap internal appointment.  The new CEO being appointed would seem another good reason to stick for now I would have thought.

[Red-Robbo]

34 minutes ago, The Swan and Cemetery said:

Right now, I’d go for a keeper in the Smith loan role. Whilst we’re struggling defensively across the park, it seems the outfield players have, understandably, low confidence in either O’Leary or Bentley, which is very unhelpful for both open play and set pieces. 

 

Yeah. Or I'd like a Marvin Elliott type midfielder.  Doesn't have to be a world-beater, just dominant right in the centre of the pitch, very difficult to get past, pushes any attackers headed our way into the narrow wings where things get congested. 

[Phileas Fogg]

Not been nearly as engaged in BCFC recently, but for what it's worth I'd probably keep Pearson for now.

I think his recent decisions seem to defy logic on the face of it (ie Atkinson out, King in). But I can only imagine a man of Pearson's experience is doing these for the right reasons. It's obviously sending a message about something we aren't privy to.

I've met and chatted to Pearson during his time here - and the impression I got of him was that he's exactly as you'd expect. Gregarious and probably a bit intimidating to some players, but ultimately a man with good intentions. If you buy into his methods, he's probably great to work for.

I am bemused by some of the selections, for example Weimann at RWB. It's clear he's playing players he trusts, even if that means utilising them out of position, but I hope whatever is going on behind the scenes gets resolved because it's clearly to the detriment of the team in the short term. I really hope long term though it goes some way to changing the culture here.

Obviously there is some significant disconnect within the squad (Atkinson). To me this shows he's clearly a man who values adherence to his own standards and values over playing our best players. He must have complete confidence the board are invested in what he's trying to achieve here, because in such a tight league it seems crazy to wilfully put the team at a disadvantage with some of these selections.

His comments regarding the fans are obviously a bit unwise, and often spell the beginning of the end for a manager in my experience when things like that start happening. I do think the atmosphere at home games doesn't help. S82 try their best, but the atmosphere was far better with 300 in the old East End next to the away fans. I've said it so many times, but placing our vocal support as far away as possible from away fans has killed atmosphere at AG and I can't see this situation changing unless it's rethought.

I like Pearson as a man and still think he can turn things round. He's been dealt a difficult hand financially but as others have said, this isn't a blanket excuse whilst we're being outperformed by teams on smaller budgets. 

I would be interested to see whether things would improve if someone like Craig Shakespeare was bought in now he's available. That wouldn't be cheap, and would indicate total faith in the Pearson project from the board, but surely it's worth a go if they really want him to succeed.

Apologies - a bit of an essay, but this is basically an amalgamation of my thoughts over the season as I haven't posted too much. 

 

Edited December 28, 2022 by Phileas Fogg