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"His Arm is an Unnatural Position"


Port Said Red

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5 minutes ago, Rossi the Robin said:

IMO shouldn’t have been sent off— defo a pen though 

The problem is, as soon as it's a pen, it has to be a red card as it's denying a goalscoring opportunity. As soon as someone uses their hand to block a shot on the line, the referee doesn't have much of a choice. 

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Not sure how anyone could say it wasn't a penalty, its obvious.

Also, if the ref gives the penalty, the player has to have a red card for stopping a goal scoring opportunity, thats pretty obvious as well.

As for Mitrovic, he's just a **** who's cost them the game.

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3 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Not sure how anyone could say it wasn't a penalty, its obvious.

Also, if the ref gives the penalty, the player has to have a red card for stopping a goal scoring opportunity, thats pretty obvious as well.

As for Mitrovic, he's just a **** who's cost them the game.

This is where the rule is wrong

Sent off for stopping a goal scoring opportunity BUT they are given a penalty so still have that opportunity

 

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1 minute ago, Maltshoveller said:

This is where the rule is wrong

Sent off for stopping a goal scoring opportunity BUT they are given a penalty so still have that opportunity

 

Which they might miss.

If the red card rule wasn't in place you'd have loads of hand balls on the line with players knowing they can stop a certain goal with no punishment and the keeper may save a penalty.

Red card every time.

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I thought that todays rules were if it hits your hand in the box it’s a penalty - whether you have your hand out or not - you could have your back to the ball and it hits your hand it’s still a pen. 
The old ‘ball to hand’ rule no longer exists. 
A red card is for when the referee thinks it was deliberate. 
If it’s accidental then it’s just unfortunate - it’s still a penalty- but at least you won’t get sent off!!!

Thats my understanding anyway - I might be wrong…..

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4 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Which they might miss.

If the red card rule wasn't in place you'd have loads of hand balls on the line with players knowing they can stop a certain goal with no punishment and the keeper may save a penalty.

Red card every time.

Yes they might miss it but it is still an opportunity

For me it is a penalty but should only be yellow

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4 minutes ago, Maltshoveller said:

This is where the rule is wrong

Sent off for stopping a goal scoring opportunity BUT they are given a penalty so still have that opportunity

 

It was more than a goalscoring opportunity had he not deliberately handballed it it would've been a goal. It's all very well saying that by awarding a penalty it has provided another goalscoring opportunity but that opportunity could be missed, thus if players aren't sent off for preventing a goal by foul means it would encourage all players to become second goalkeepers if the official keeper is beaten in the hope that the resultant penalty would be missed.

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I have personal experience of this as in our over 50s hybrid of Walking Football just a few weeks ago I had a shot that was going in the top corner and had beaten the keeper all ends up. A defender then dived with his arm outstretched and saved it with his hand on the line. 

Of course, in our football, we cannot go sending players off who have paid to play. So no other punitive measures bar a penalty was awarded which a teammate then walloped against the post and it was cleared. We lost 2-1 but we had a certain goal prevented by foul means and were given a goalscoring opportunity, which was missed, and nothing else in response. 

The guilty party seemed to be embarrassed by what he had done as he is fairly new to our group and hopefully it won't happen again, but if it does we will have to entertain the unpalatable prospect of sending off players who have paid like everyone else to play who deliberately stop certain goals by foul means as otherwise it might become the norm. 

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1 hour ago, Port Said Red said:

Unless you are Man Utd at Old Trafford apparently. 

Clearly a handball, he even moved his hand! Red card is a given, whether its against Man Utd, Liverpool, Barcelona or Bristol Rovers.

As for Mitrovic, bar Di Canio, that has to be one of the most stupid sendings off of all time. At one point I thought he was going to turn around and thump someone!!!

Surely a fine is likely for Fulham now, as two players AND the manager all sent off within minutes of each other. Absolutely ridiculous as the game was their's to lose, and up to then were the better side.

Edited by Taz
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52 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

My main question would be why the ref needed VAR to tell him it was handball, one of the more obvious ones you'll see.

Always going to be red in that situation and then Mitrovic's head went, I suspect partly because he knew they should have been out of sight by that point.

Probably because he isn’t watching the incident from a tv camera giving a view that he will never have. If he has the use of about 15 camera angles  rather than the ‘one’ he had, he is going to use them. 

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34 minutes ago, WECANDO said:

It was a def handball to prevent a goal. So he had to be sent off. As for Mitrovic, he should be band for months not games for that threatening behaviour.

I agree he should have a real long ban

but as i said in another post

Bruno should also have been done for pushing the linesman v Liverpool

 

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Not sure how the manager and centre forward can argue about the decision. Can you tell me any time where a ref has looked back at the remonstrating player and said "hang on mate, you have a point" It's what is totally wrong with football, dissent.

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12 hours ago, maxjak said:

How lucky are Man U?  They are being outplayed, and then the opposition self destruct..........Just hope Brighton stuff them in the Semi's, really would like to see  ....   Webster in the Final   

Hope we have a bonus clause in the deal!

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9 hours ago, Swede said:

Not sure how the manager and centre forward can argue about the decision. Can you tell me any time where a ref has looked back at the remonstrating player and said "hang on mate, you have a point" It's what is totally wrong with football, dissent.

It did happen once in rugby...

 

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14 hours ago, bcfc01 said:

Not sure how anyone could say it wasn't a penalty, its obvious.

 

Almost every referee in a Bristol City game could easily do so.

If it was against us, obviously!

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11 hours ago, Swede said:

Not sure how the manager and centre forward can argue about the decision. Can you tell me any time where a ref has looked back at the remonstrating player and said "hang on mate, you have a point" It's what is totally wrong with football, dissent.

 Roy Kean is well qualified to  elaborate on this point!

The Man U "posse" was a common site during Fergie's reign. That, and fear of incurring Fergie's wrath,  certainly caused Man U to get more than their share of decisions at that time.

image.thumb.png.4907b51fc73fca6c987adf81dd288106.png

1 hour ago, Super said:

You have to set an example. 10 game ban.

Bailey Wright won;t be happy with that!

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6 minutes ago, Midred said:

If only Mitrovic had been sent off for some of his antics in previous games -  diving, fouling in the penalty area and others!

The "penalty" that Fulham are claiming they should have had yesterday was him kicking into the defender and throwing himself to the floor.

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I am not usually in favour of making an example of someone but here it is totally justified.

We know that amateur players copy the behaviour of the pros and that refs at the lower levels are in fear of their safety with violence against officials on the increase.

It was only a push but Mitrovic should get a long ban and all clubs reminded of their responsibilities about aggressive behaviour including screaming into the face of officials. No ref, no game. Set the example at the top level.

In balance, refs just need to be careful with their body language. When issuing cards do it in a calm manner rather than some type of rigid salute which exaggerates their authority. Sometimes a smile and a quiet word goes a long way to diffuse an angry situation.

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33 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

I am not usually in favour of making an example of someone but here it is totally justified.

We know that amateur players copy the behaviour of the pros and that refs at the lower levels are in fear of their safety with violence against officials on the increase.

It was only a push but Mitrovic should get a long ban and all clubs reminded of their responsibilities about aggressive behaviour including screaming into the face of officials. No ref, no game. Set the example at the top level.

In balance, refs just need to be careful with their body language. When issuing cards do it in a calm manner rather than some type of rigid salute which exaggerates their authority. Sometimes a smile and a quiet word goes a long way to diffuse an angry situation.

De Canio received an 11 match ban for pushing the ref after being sent off, although I think the fact that the ref fell over exacerbated the incident.

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2 hours ago, downendcity said:

De Canio received an 11 match ban for pushing the ref after being sent off, although I think the fact that the ref fell over exacerbated the incident.

Unfortunately for him he wasn't playing for Manchester United at the t8me!

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3 hours ago, Midred said:

If only Mitrovic had been sent off for some of his antics in previous games -  diving, fouling in the penalty area and others!

Yep ............your right, he is the only player in the entire Premiership who ever antics, dives, fouls  and ........  (others??)  ?

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On 19/03/2023 at 20:27, Maltshoveller said:

I agree he should have a real long ban

but as i said in another post

Bruno should also have been done for pushing the linesman v Liverpool

 

Mitrovic charged with violent and improper behaviour!

How lucky was Bruno to get away with nothing?

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14 hours ago, downendcity said:

 Roy Kean is well qualified to  elaborate on this point!

The Man U "posse" was a common site during Fergie's reign. That, and fear of incurring Fergie's wrath,  certainly caused Man U to get more than their share of decisions at that time.

image.thumb.png.4907b51fc73fca6c987adf81dd288106.png

Bailey Wright won;t be happy with that!

That pic of the Man Utd players surrounding the ref is sickening. It just goes to show how ingrained this sort of thing is that it has been going on for so long. 

FWIW, my son plays grassroots football and has been since he was 7 (he’s 15 now). This season the attitude of many players towards the refs is getting visibly worse. Also players diving or standing waving their arms rather than just getting on with the game if they think they’ve been fouled. It might be partially the players’ age but it’s replicating what they see in the professional game. Very sad to see. 

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12 hours ago, Midred said:

Mitrovic charged with violent and improper behaviour!

How lucky was Bruno to get away with nothing?

To me, it seems Mitrovic is being made an example of for this. What he did is wrong but plenty of other players have done similar and got away with it (fernandes). Just watch any PL game and see how many players touch officials and nothing is done.

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4 minutes ago, wayne allisons tongues said:

To me, it seems Mitrovic is being made an example of for this. What he did is wrong but plenty of other players have done similar and got away with it (fernandes). Just watch any PL game and see how many players touch officials and nothing is done.

Yeah - I'd agree with this. I'm not defending Mitrovic, and I've no idea what he said and whether that was a factor, but it does seem inconsistent. 

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44 minutes ago, wayne allisons tongues said:

To me, it seems Mitrovic is being made an example of for this. What he did is wrong but plenty of other players have done similar and got away with it (fernandes). Just watch any PL game and see how many players touch officials and nothing is done.

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39 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

Yeah - I'd agree with this. I'm not defending Mitrovic, and I've no idea what he said and whether that was a factor, but it does seem inconsistent. 

He doesn’t need to be made an example of, he just needs to be dealt with properly.  There are precedents, e.g. Di Canio to fall back on.  It is obviously not a “normal foul” red card, because he pushed the ref.  He should be treated the same way as any other player who has pushed an official and got red carded.

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On 20/03/2023 at 09:49, Northern Red said:

The "penalty" that Fulham are claiming they should have had yesterday was him kicking into the defender and throwing himself to the floor.

You just described almost all of Ivan Toney’s career there.

Most of Brentford’s penalties (& they get loads) are like this.

Massive cheat.

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10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

⬇️⬇️⬇️

He doesn’t need to be made an example of, he just needs to be dealt with properly.  There are precedents, e.g. Di Canio to fall back on.  It is obviously not a “normal foul” red card, because he pushed the ref.  He should be treated the same way as any other player who has pushed an official and got red carded.

If this is the way they're going then it's got to be  done consistently particularly where var is in use. There can be no favouritism to clubs or players. Where var isn't used there are enough match officials to witness what happens. Why did that linesman not report Fernandes?

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1 hour ago, Midred said:

If this is the way they're going then it's got to be  done consistently particularly where var is in use. There can be no favouritism to clubs or players. Where var isn't used there are enough match officials to witness what happens. Why did that linesman not report Fernandes?

I didn’t want to bring Bruno Fernandes into it, in case I was accused of Liverpool / Man Utd bias.  But how the hell did he get away with that?

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7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

⬇️⬇️⬇️

He doesn’t need to be made an example of, he just needs to be dealt with properly.  There are precedents, e.g. Di Canio to fall back on.  It is obviously not a “normal foul” red card, because he pushed the ref.  He should be treated the same way as any other player who has pushed an official and got red carded.

I see what you did there!

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What was also wrong with all that went on is the Ref retreated backwards away from the Fulham players - he should have stood still and if they knocked him over then even more would get sent off - players need to show proper respect and accept decisions without losing their heads.

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46 minutes ago, Denbury Red said:

What was also wrong with all that went on is the Ref retreated backwards away from the Fulham players - he should have stood still and if they knocked him over then even more would get sent off - players need to show proper respect and accept decisions without losing their heads.

That's easier said than done I would imagine. 

I've never been charged at by a group of angry men at my work thankfully, but I would guess that I would probably take a step or two backwards... 

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9 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

Yeah - I'd agree with this. I'm not defending Mitrovic, and I've no idea what he said and whether that was a factor, but it does seem inconsistent. 

 

8 hours ago, Davefevs said:

⬇️⬇️⬇️

He doesn’t need to be made an example of, he just needs to be dealt with properly.  There are precedents, e.g. Di Canio to fall back on.  It is obviously not a “normal foul” red card, because he pushed the ref.  He should be treated the same way as any other player who has pushed an official and got red carded.

I think it's the overall attitude that is the problem, like I said at the time he looks like he is about to hit the referee which is quite different from other incidents. like the Di Canio one which was more "get out of my way". 

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