Life Without Alex Scott

[GBF]

Yesterday too many players had an off day. I rate both Pring and Tanner  yet both were poor .

Even without Scott I believe we can play a lot better in midfield. Yesterday was surely as bad as any of our midfielders selected can play.
Knaismith in the absence of Scott our most creative passer was unavailable.  

If however Knight  is not a good passer and doesn’t take up positions to facilitate an easy pass for the person on the ball (both skills were not evident yesterday), we need to buy another midfielder who can do that .

Personally I thought Zac was exceptional 2nd half and good generally and Dickie good throughout the whole game but with the obvious exception of their goal!

Despite most things  not being good yesterday we were minutes away from a good result and maybe  that means things aren’t as bad as they appea

 

[Dr Balls]

For so many seasons we have said that the central midfield is the problem. That was masked to a large degree last season by the efforts of Scott, but since the days of Pack and Smith at their best, we have struggled to find the right combination. We had minimal movement and zero creativity yesterday, with no one willing to carry the ball forward other than Pring, Vyner and Dickie. That shouldn’t be just their responsibility, and it wouldn’t be if we had some half decent midfielders. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

22 minutes ago, Dr Balls said:

For so many seasons we have said that the central midfield is the problem. That was masked to a large degree last season by the efforts of Scott, but since the days of Pack and Smith at their best, we have struggled to find the right combination. We had minimal movement and zero creativity yesterday, with no one willing to carry the ball forward other than Pring, Vyner and Dickie. That shouldn’t be just their responsibility, and it wouldn’t be if we had some half decent midfielders. 

Individually I don't think a few of our midfielders are too bad, but collectively without Scott and quite possibly Naismith with his distribution the combination doesn't quite mesh.

Knight will grow, James is more about stability and Williams more about bite than technical play.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Offside]

We definitely missed him yesterday - his ability to grab a game by the scruff of the neck and carry the ball to drag the opposing players out of position. Yesterday, apart from Bell’s pace, we didn’t have anything to really worry them. 

[RED4LIFE]

5 hours ago, johnbytheriver said:

My eyes don't decieve me! Cornick can't even trap a ball! He is never going to come good!

That's the spirit. 

Thankfully, we have professionals running the club not knee-jerk reactionists.

I actually didn't think he did too badly yesterday but I suppose haters gotta hate.

On a related note, I though Zak was excellent yesterday and a section of fans were saying the same about him as they are about Cornick in the not too distant past.

[The Bard]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

They sat Frokjaer on James yesterday….he got away once all game.

from a clever reverse pass from Dickie.  I think James needed to drag Frokjaer out if the centre to create space for Dickie and Vyner, and then ultimately Pring.  We didn’t get crisp passes into Weimann (Williams) or Knight on the half-turn like we did pre-season.

They closed off balls into midfield which is precisely why we ended up hitting long balls

[Super]

It's the lack of creativity without Scott which is a massive worry. If he does leave we definitely need someone in. The midfield yesterday were 2nd best by a distance.

[johnbytheriver]

2 hours ago, RED4LIFE said:

 

I actually didn't think he did too badly yesterday 

Shows you know nothing about football!

[maxjak]

I like the  way James Piercy in his article makes the point that due to Scotty's failure to play against Preston.....it actually increased his value?   There are a lot of PNE type teams in the Championship, and you really need something different or special to crack their type of set up, and  Scott is just that man, his exceptional talent can really make such a difference in our league?  He is almost irreplaceable, unless somehow our scouting network can turn up a better replacement than they have managed with Antione's successor?  

I am desperately hoping that there is some way we can hold on to Scotty for just one more season(Wishful thinking i know?), as he is that one player who can turn a game on it's head at this level..........Preston showed us that there are players out there in Europe that can be found, with their recruitment of Mads Jensen, at a snip of a fee, who i thought looked just the type of player we could do with?   But our lack of loan players, lack of a quality European scout....and,  probably our lack of the wonderful (probably) Alex Scott.............  means that at best it will  be a season loitering  near  the edge of the play offs............i sincerely hope I am wrong, of course!  

[mozo]

6 minutes ago, maxjak said:

I like the  way James Piercy in his article makes the point that due to Scotty's failure to play against Preston.....it actually increased his value?   There are a lot of PNE type teams in the Championship, and you really need something different or special to crack their type of set up, and  Scott is just that man, his exceptional talent can really make such a difference in our league?  He is almost irreplaceable, unless somehow our scouting network can turn up a better replacement than they have managed with Antione's successor?  

I am desperately hoping that there is some way we can hold on to Scotty for just one more season(Wishful thinking i know?), as he is that one player who can turn a game on it's head at this level..........Preston showed us that there are players out there in Europe that can be found, with their recruitment of Mads Jensen, at a snip of a fee, who i thought looked just the type of player we could do with?   But our lack of loan players, lack of a quality European scout....and,  probably our lack of the wonderful (probably) Alex Scott.............  means that at best it will  be a season loitering  near  the edge of the play offs............i sincerely hope I am wrong, of course!  

Realistically, Alex Scott is a generational talent and we won't unearth one like him for a very long time. 

I do fancy one, if not both, of Bell and Conway to be big players for us though and to also be sold for big money. 

We also seem to have some good defenders coming up as well so still an exciting future when Scott moves on.

Edited August 6, 2023 by mozo

[Mr Popodopolous]

14 minutes ago, mozo said:

Realistically, Alex Scott is a generational talent and we won't unearth one like him for a very long time. 

I do fancy one, if not both, of Bell and Conway to be big players for us though and to also be sold for big money. 

We also seem to have some good defenders coming up as well so still an exciting future when Scott moves on.

We need to seek to the them down for a bit longer.

Those two, 2025. Pring 2024 with an option to take to 2025 and Vyner 2024.

No immediate hurry but one to keep an eye on certainly.

[And Its Smith]

1 hour ago, johnbytheriver said:

Shows you know nothing about football!

Such a wankery comment on a forum of opinions 

[Merrick's Marvels]

1 hour ago, The Bard said:

They closed off balls into midfield which is precisely why we ended up hitting long balls

That shouldn't have come as a surprise though - surely we work on what to do when this happens? It seems not. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

That shouldn't have come as a surprise though - surely we work on what to do when this happens? It seems not. 

Without Scott and Naismith and you could argue Atkinson carrying into midfield and v their slightly uncommon shape our options seemed somewhat limited.

[Andy082005]

7 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

He doesn’t add pace to the front line. As I’ve sad on another thread. I don’t judge players early, they need time , but he was really poor yesterday . Bloke in front of me shouted at Tanner for going backwards in the first half but cornick made a terrible run blocking off any pass to him . I just don’t see what nige does with him tbh . 

Cornick - if playing and in this formation - has to be in the middle of the front 3. As you say he doesn’t have the pace or the ability to play wider 

For me he is third choice behind Conway and Wells 

 

[Lew-T]

2 hours ago, The Bard said:

They closed off balls into midfield which is precisely why we ended up hitting long balls

Which is a perfect game plan to us. Because they know we aren’t going to win anything in the air up there.

It was bread and butter yesterday for PNE.

[johnbytheriver]

47 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Such a wankery comment on a forum of opinions 

You did not give an opinion you talked  about hate! 

Edited August 6, 2023 by johnbytheriver
omitted a letter

[And Its Smith]

8 minutes ago, johnbytheriver said:

You did not give an opinion you talked  about hate! 

I gave an opinion about your post 

[johnbytheriver]

Just now, And Its Smith said:

I gave an opinion about your post 

i gave an opinion on cornick i genuinely don't think he is any good. you gave an opnion but then started talking about hate which was a deliberate attempt at agitation.In your last post you used the word wankery more agitation! No need of it. you are the one provoking not me.

[RED4LIFE]

2 hours ago, johnbytheriver said:

Shows you know nothing about football!

Really? 

I played at a semi-pro standard for years and have got FA coaching badges. It's only work that has stopped my doing my UEFA badges.

Besides that, I see football as a team game, not a blame game.

I think you fail to understand that there are 11 other professionals trying to stop our team achieving their aims. 

I find it bizarre that you have stated as fact that a Pro footballer cannot even control the ball. If that was the case there isn't a hope in hell he would've made it as a pro let alone clubs spending good money on signing him. 

Fwiw, Cornick didn't have a great game but neither did the vast majority of our team yesterday and because of that he was starved of service. He can't do well without the ball and players around him giving him outlets.

But hey, if you say I know nothing about football, then who I am I to argue? After all, if I try, you will only bring me down to your level and beat me with experience yeah?

[And Its Smith]

20 minutes ago, johnbytheriver said:

i gave an opinion on cornick i genuinely don't think he is any good. you gave an opnion but then started talking about hate which was a deliberate attempt at agitation.In your last post you used the word wankery more agitation! No need of it. you are the one provoking not me.

Saying that a poster obviously knows nothing about football is certainly provoking 

[RED4LIFE]

1 minute ago, And Its Smith said:

Saying that a poster obviously knows nothing about football is certainly provoking 

I think it says more about the person behind the post rather than the post itself. 

[maxjak]

2 hours ago, mozo said:

Realistically, Alex Scott is a generational talent and we won't unearth one like him for a very long time. 

I do fancy one, if not both, of Bell and Conway to be big players for us though and to also be sold for big money. 

We also seem to have some good defenders coming up as well so still an exciting future when Scott moves on.

Why is it that every time the prospect of a "Big" player coming up through the ranks is mentioned..............the VERY first thing that is alluded to is "To be sold for big money"   I am a pragmatist, and i am fully aware of how certain clubs operate .  But FFS can we not enjoy the talent? Instead of looking at the balance sheet?   If we could have retained just 50% of the blank cheque players that have moved on.........then maybe we wouldn't be stuck in the morass of mid table obscurity!?  And WHY is it an "exciting future" when Scott moves on?  Surely it's pheckin depressing, not spine-tingling ?     You have the precise mindset of what is intrinsically wrong at the root of this football club          Ha!!

Edited August 6, 2023 by maxjak

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, maxjak said:

Why is it that every time the prospect of a "Big" player coming up through the ranks is mentioned..............the VERY first thing that is alluded to is "To be sold for big money"   I am a pragmatist, and i am fully aware of how certain clubs operate .  But FFS can we not enjoy the talent? Instead of looking at the balance sheet?   If we could have retained just 50% of the blank cheque players that have moved on.........then maybe we wouldn't be stuck in the morass of mid table obscurity!?  And WHY is it an exciting future when Scott moves on?  You have the precise mindset of what is intrinsically wrong at the root of this football club          Ha!!

The other question is can we persuade them to extend or indeed at what point can we risk losing on a free?

[mozo]

6 minutes ago, maxjak said:

Why is it that every time the prospect of a "Big" player coming up through the ranks is mentioned..............the VERY first thing that is alluded to is "To be sold for big money"   I am a pragmatist, and i am fully aware of how certain clubs operate .  But FFS can we not enjoy the talent? Instead of looking at the balance sheet?   If we could have retained just 50% of the blank cheque players that have moved on.........then maybe we wouldn't be stuck in the morass of mid table obscurity!?  And WHY is it an exciting future when Scott moves on?  You have the precise mindset of what is intrinsically wrong at the root of this football club          Ha!!

"You have the precise mindset of what is intrinsically wrong at the root of this football club" 

Sweet talking will get you nowhere 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Andy082005 said:

Cornick - if playing and in this formation - has to be in the middle of the front 3. As you say he doesn’t have the pace or the ability to play wider 

For me he is third choice behind Conway and Wells 

 

My long held view (since we move to this form of front three - when Semenyo left) is that one of the wide forwards has to play narrower / closer to the middle man.

e.g.

 

[Andy082005]

25 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

My long held view (since we move to this form of front three - when Semenyo left) is that one of the wide forwards has to play narrower / closer to the middle man.

e.g.

 

Don’t disagree Dave. What’s your thoughts on Weimann playing in that role if he was fit? 

[Davefevs]

20 minutes ago, Andy082005 said:

Don’t disagree Dave. What’s your thoughts on Weimann playing in that role if he was fit? 

Yes, inside forward for sure

[Swede]

Just viewed Alex Scott's first interview at AFCB. I'm very pleased he's got his move but just looking at the presentation from AFCB it just looks totally tinpot. The state of football as it is today when you loose your best player to a club like that. Astonishing.

[Bris Red]

13 minutes ago, Swede said:

Just viewed Alex Scott's first interview at AFCB. I'm very pleased he's got his move but just looking at the presentation from AFCB it just looks totally tinpot. The state of football as it is today when you loose your best player to a club like that. Astonishing.

He will have playing in front of gates of barely 11 k to look forward too aswell in a tin pot little stadium..

All irrelevant nowadays anyway, all about the £. As you said astonishing but here we are.

Edited August 21, 2023 by Bris Red

[Red-Robbo]

12 hours ago, Bris Red said:

He will have playing in front of gates of barely 11 k to look forward too aswell in a tin pot little stadium..

All irrelevant nowadays anyway, all about the £. As you said astonishing but here we are.

 

Bournemouth have been exploring moving from Dene Court from well before their rise to PL but to say the borough council has been unhelpful is the understatement of the century.  Given that the Bournemouth, Christchurch, Poole connurbation has a population of more than 400K it is an area that would well be able to support a PL club, but as it stands, it's a typical example of a club that's been expanded too fast for its infrastructure to cope.  

[Mr Popodopolous]

13 minutes ago, Fred89 said:

And yet another club that has demonstrated how unacceptable it is we have had one promotion attempt to the Prem in 30 years and that came after 9seasons in League 1 under Wilson and Tinnion! We are a feeder club for Fulham and Bournemouth and anyone with working eyes that doesn’t see it is delusional 

They broke FFP rules to go up, then Parachute Payments and PL cash and I suppose some good decisions among all the cash helped to underpin.

If Parachute Payments didn't exist and the current financial rules did they would have sunk somewhat, same with a number of others but Bournemouth a prime candidate.

Fulham rose in a pre FFP world, Al Fayed etc. Khan appears to be even richer. PL cash, Parachute Payments and being West London all helps.

Edited August 22, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Mr Popodopolous]

52 minutes ago, Fred89 said:

What about Wigan, Blackpool, Luton , Brentford, Cardiff,Swansea, Burnley I’m sure I’m missing a few it’s ridiculous and let’s not beat around the bush it is predominantly down to selling our best players when we have momentum going in the last year of their contract all the way back to Scott Murray in 02-03 , Lita in 04-05 we would have shipped Brooker off if he didn’t have dodgy Knees ! When ever we get a team going the main man is taken out smaller clubs than us simply don’t allow it!

After 17/18 we lost Bryan, Flint , Reid we didn’t have to lose Bobby Reid I think if we kept him that next season we would have made the playoffs ambition 

I don't want to bog down this thread with finances but I suspect following your path in 2018-19, we could have failed FFP and been subject to sanctions, monitoring or both. The rules changed by 2018-19.

We may have kept ,stayed down, lost some.on a free and been utterly hamstrung financially 

Brentford sold a shed load of players, also had a clever model. Blackpool clearly recruited well and hit the crest of a wave, Wigan spent their way up to some extent, see also Reading- these two pre FFP.

Swansea had a clever model and better infrastructure than us at that time, Luton lost their star player to us on a free, Burnley unlike us actually capitalised on their Cup run in 2008-09 and won the playoffs off the back of it. Bolstered in their 2nd, 3rd and 4th promotion by PL and Parachute money as well.

Cardiff spent, wwre bolstered by Parachute money in subsequent years. They just got up in 2017-18 like Fulham in the final year of Parachute Payments. They lasted up to 4 years then albeit reducing over time.

If we made a strategic error a big one it was not spending bigger in Janaury 2008.

Not selling Reid, his contract was up in 2019. Had we lost him on a free the only way that would have been worthwhile financially would have been promotion.

Of course the flipside is may have spent less had we kept and in all honesty we would have had to. May not have been a terrible thing but you are only looking at it from one side of the argument.

I suppose we could have kept similar spending plans had we kept Reid and indeed moved Kelly sale into 2019-20.

Edited August 22, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Swede]

44 minutes ago, Fred89 said:

What about Wigan, Blackpool, Luton , Brentford, Cardiff,Swansea, Burnley I’m sure I’m missing a few it’s ridiculous and let’s not beat around the bush it is predominantly down to selling our best players when we have momentum going in the last year of their contract all the way back to Scott Murray in 02-03 , Lita in 04-05 we would have shipped Brooker off if he didn’t have dodgy Knees ! When ever we get a team going the main man is taken out smaller clubs than us simply don’t allow it!

After 17/18 we lost Bryan, Flint , Reid we didn’t have to lose Bobby Reid I think if we kept him that next season we would have made the playoffs ambition 

In all fairness Bobby Reid had criticism from quite a number on here [not me by the way, I've always rated him], when he hit twenty goals that was his ticket to the Premier League. He wanted to go. It wasn't a case of keeping him.

[alexukhc]

Imagine calling Bournemouth tinpot yet they offer premier league football, ground may not hold many but wouldn’t you rather play Man City midweek than Rotherham? Most people here said Semenyo can’t score yet scored against Liverpool at the weekend… we def have the facilities, the ground ready but we are yet to reach those heights, we lost to Birmingham and by all accounts we are going down, who’s the real tinpot team here?

[Bristol Rob]

17 minutes ago, Swede said:

In all fairness Bobby Reid had criticism from quite a number on here [not me by the way, I've always rated him], when he hit twenty goals that was his ticket to the Premier League. He wanted to go. It wasn't a case of keeping him.

This.

The season before he became a forward, loads of people were suggesting he was a waste of a wage, been on the fringes for what felt like donkeys years, never finding a starting spot easy to come by and it would free up space for someone who might play.

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, Fred89 said:

Well imo they kept their best players and had another tilt the following year as something built ! Blackpool signed Charlie Adam from Rangers after he kept them up in the Championship could have sold him that January as they were not in the Playoffs at that time they came in late to the top 6 the year they went up , they gambled, why could we not keep Scott until January see where we were ? Wheres the gamble the ambition? We can see our midfield needs him but we sell completely destroyed what we built in terms of style of play 

I was pro keeping Scott if at all possible tbh, maybe although given he seems to be reportedly out for some months who knows. Would we have risked his attitude turning had the move been turned down too? He is a great pro but never say never in football.

Naismith coming back will help with some control but we definitely need a ball carrying, creative type. How exactly you replace Scott directly is it possible on our budget?

[Swede]

You have to factor into it the player and his agent as well. That has just as big bearing on matters. Paradoxically, the longer we are away from the Premier League the more this will happen.

An example would be WBA or a Norwich. Before the season starts they could easily have a fantastic season and get promotion because they've been there recently. That is a good argument for keeping talented players.

The fact that the last time we were in the top tier there were only 5 TV channels and flairs were the norm tells anybody that it would take a monumental change in fortunes to get there. We must be one of only a handful of clubs in the Championship never to play in the Premier League. Is that down to a lack of ambition from the club/ manager or coach or just bad luck?

 Up until the ground redevelopment we were one of the few clubs without hospitality boxes so we are slowly turning the tide it seems but I do wonder whether its a cautious lack of ambition at times that is holding us back.

[tin]

57 minutes ago, Swede said:

You have to factor into it the player and his agent as well. That has just as big bearing on matters. Paradoxically, the longer we are away from the Premier League the more this will happen.

An example would be WBA or a Norwich. Before the season starts they could easily have a fantastic season and get promotion because they've been there recently. That is a good argument for keeping talented players.

The fact that the last time we were in the top tier there were only 5 TV channels and flairs were the norm tells anybody that it would take a monumental change in fortunes to get there. We must be one of only a handful of clubs in the Championship never to play in the Premier League. Is that down to a lack of ambition from the club/ manager or coach or just bad luck?

 Up until the ground redevelopment we were one of the few clubs without hospitality boxes so we are slowly turning the tide it seems but I do wonder whether its a cautious lack of ambition at times that is holding us back.

It’s down to two decades of unambitious  ownership IMHO. Look back to 07/08, top at Christmas in a pre-FFP era and crying out for a goalscorer and he didn’t gamble. Cotts’ double-winning team of 15/16 had the nucleus of a competitive squad, deals were agreed for Maguire and Gray only for him to pull the plug while Cotts was on holiday. And now, eight years on, we’re free of FFP and have some cash to spent yet he still keeps a tight reign on the purse strings. I could understand that if it was a consistent strategy over 20+ years, but LJ’s spending spree flies in the face of that. The buck stops with SL.

[The Journalist]

4 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

Bournemouth have been exploring moving from Dene Court from well before their rise to PL but to say the borough council has been unhelpful is the understatement of the century.  Given that the Bournemouth, Christchurch, Poole connurbation has a population of more than 400K it is an area that would well be able to support a PL club, but as it stands, it's a typical example of a club that's been expanded too fast for its infrastructure to cope.  

Essentially the polar opposite of us, a club whose infrastructure has expanded too fast for its team to cope. 

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

13 minutes ago, tin said:

It’s down to two decades of unambitious  ownership IMHO. Look back to 07/08, top at Christmas in a pre-FFP era and crying out for a goalscorer and he didn’t gamble. Cotts’ double-winning team of 15/16 had the nucleus of a competitive squad, deals were agreed for Maguire and Gray only for him to pull the plug while Cotts was on holiday. And now, eight years on, we’re free of FFP and have some cash to spent yet he still keeps a tight reign on the purse strings. I could understand that if it was a consistent strategy over 20+ years, but LJ’s spending spree flies in the face of that. The buck stops with SL.

I understood that Gray turned us down.

[Davefevs]

39 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I understood that Gray turned us down.

Not initially.

Only after Pelling interfered and Brentford got Burnley interested.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, tin said:

It’s down to two decades of unambitious  ownership IMHO. Look back to 07/08, top at Christmas in a pre-FFP era and crying out for a goalscorer and he didn’t gamble. Cotts’ double-winning team of 15/16 had the nucleus of a competitive squad, deals were agreed for Maguire and Gray only for him to pull the plug while Cotts was on holiday. And now, eight years on, we’re free of FFP and have some cash to spent yet he still keeps a tight reign on the purse strings. I could understand that if it was a consistent strategy over 20+ years, but LJ’s spending spree flies in the face of that. The buck stops with SL.

I agree on the first, the second Cotts had he been a big more patient for one season, a bit more balanced in his approach then I hope he would have reaped the benefits of the increased income from 2016-17 onwards. That one I'm conflicted on but he got less than he deserved.

Agree about a lack of consistent strategy.

Edited August 22, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous