TGH & Roberts

[Better Red]

Great result tonight. Conways first goal was top class.

First 75 mins shocking.

I thought TGH looked poor overall tonight. Against a poor side he did not show any type of upgrade on Tanner.

OK maybe not a RB but thought he lost the ball and his 1 on 1 contest to many times.

Also his chasing back looked slow and to much effort at times.

For me £1m is way to much and we should be looking else where.

Vyner would do a better job for me than either RB but has been so good in the middle.

Roberts been on a few times now and again positioning looked questionable and does not really offer going forward as I thought he would. Not someone who can put pressure on Pring.

Shame as I thought we had some options at full back but looks like it’s Pring and Tanner (unless Vyner moves across) with little pressure on each of them for a starting role.
 

Hopefully we won’t burn them out.

[nickolas]

Both not playing where they should be. Not impressed by Roberts at all. Looks slow. 
TGH i think looks good on the ball but hes much a right back as Cornick is a professional footballer!

[Betty Swallocks]

TGH hasn’t been signed to play RB long term. 
He looks a tidy footballer, looking forward to seeing him play in his more favoured position. 

[tin]

Roberts — he’s a CB or LB  by trade and his cameos so far have been in the left midfield. I don’t think that’s a fair yardstick to judge him by, but I’d like to see him played in his best position before forming my opinion. 

Gardner-Hickman — he was poor tonight, but I think he looks weak and is easily outmuscled. Like Roberts, too early to tell and I’d like to see him in midfield. 

[alexukhc]

TGH wasn’t great but noticed his passing is very good when I’ve seen him

[Rocking Red Cyril]

Tgh is a better midfielder and Roberts a defender. 

[DownendRed97]

TGH much better on the ball than Tanner, but certainly a much weaker defender. Put through a lovely ball to King from which he set up the winner so certainly contributed to our victory in the end. Hope he gets a go further forward soon.

[Northern Red]

It was only a few weeks ago that Roberts was being considered by some as unlucky not to be starting ahead of Pring. Got caught out for the goal tonight but he's a good player and a handy option to have.

TGH isn't a RB by trade and won't be playing there unless he has to, but has looked useful in midfield.

[James54De]

Roberts looked very good in preseason. Feel for him that his opportunity has been extremely limited. It’ll come. 
 

TGH, I thought, looked quite tidy tonight. Seems like I’m quite lonely in that opinion. Obviously not a right back. Can certainly pick a pass. I’d like to see him in the middle for a full game.

On the whole, two young players with pretty difficult starts. 

[BS3City]

When's McCrorie back? Isn't he the preferred fullback choice?

Will free up TGH to compete for a midfield berth.

[W-S-M Seagull]

Roberts needed to do better for their goal. But then you have to consider he had just come on.

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

It was only a few weeks ago that Roberts was being considered by some as unlucky not to be starting ahead of Pring. Got caught out for the goal tonight but he's a good player and a handy option to have.

TGH isn't a RB by trade and won't be playing there unless he has to, but has looked useful in midfield.

Him and Kingy needed to communicate better by the looks of it.

As others have said too, his passing is decent, good range.  He looks like he needs to improve his fitness, he hasn’t played much, had no run of games.

 

Re Roberts, he’s very good technically, suffering from lack of minutes / sharpness too.

 

No rush to judge either, but I think they will be / are just fine and will be good signings.

[And Its Smith]

32 minutes ago, Better Red said:

Great result tonight. Conways first goal was top class.

First 75 mins shocking.

I thought TGH looked poor overall tonight. Against a poor side he did not show any type of upgrade on Tanner.

OK maybe not a RB but thought he lost the ball and his 1 on 1 contest to many times.

Also his chasing back looked slow and to much effort at times.

For me £1m is way to much and we should be looking else where.

Vyner would do a better job for me than either RB but has been so good in the middle.

Roberts been on a few times now and again positioning looked questionable and does not really offer going forward as I thought he would. Not someone who can put pressure on Pring.

Shame as I thought we had some options at full back but looks like it’s Pring and Tanner (unless Vyner moves across) with little pressure on each of them for a starting role.
 

Hopefully we won’t burn them out.

Sounds like you are writing two players off after a handful of games again. Hopefully they end up as good as Semenyo as I think you did the same with him! 

[Davefevs]

5 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Sounds like you are writing two players off after a handful of games again. Hopefully they end up as good as Semenyo as I think you did the same with him! 

 

I hope he keeps up his fine record….more, more!

[DOZZYBCFC]

30 minutes ago, alexukhc said:

TGH wasn’t great but noticed his passing is very good when I’ve seen him

He did a good pass just before another good pass to King for the assist for Tommy’s second. I agree the rest of the game he seemed slow and not tight enough to his man…mind you most of the squad seemed off the pace for most of the game.

[Port Said Red]

10 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Sounds like you are writing two players off after a handful of games again. Hopefully they end up as good as Semenyo as I think you did the same with him! 

Quite right, they are both players of quality, but they are being asked to fill in holes in our squad right now. Roberts showed that in one of the home games where he came on after 70 minutes and ended up playing in 3 different positions. It showed his versatility, but hardly helps him to settle. 

I think TGH has more to show us from dead ball situations too.

[Cityboy1954]

1 hour ago, Better Red said:

Great result tonight. Conways first goal was top class.

First 75 mins shocking.

I thought TGH looked poor overall tonight. Against a poor side he did not show any type of upgrade on Tanner.

OK maybe not a RB but thought he lost the ball and his 1 on 1 contest to many times.

Also his chasing back looked slow and to much effort at times.

For me £1m is way to much and we should be looking else where.

Vyner would do a better job for me than either RB but has been so good in the middle.

Roberts been on a few times now and again positioning looked questionable and does not really offer going forward as I thought he would. Not someone who can put pressure on Pring.

Shame as I thought we had some options at full back but looks like it’s Pring and Tanner (unless Vyner moves across) with little pressure on each of them for a starting role.
 

Hopefully we won’t burn them out.

Mc crorrie bought for fullback but hes gonna be out for a while .

[95red]

7 hours ago, Better Red said:

Great result tonight. Conways first goal was top class.

First 75 mins shocking.

I thought TGH looked poor overall tonight. Against a poor side he did not show any type of upgrade on Tanner.

OK maybe not a RB but thought he lost the ball and his 1 on 1 contest to many times.

Also his chasing back looked slow and to much effort at times.

For me £1m is way to much and we should be looking else where.

Vyner would do a better job for me than either RB but has been so good in the middle.

Roberts been on a few times now and again positioning looked questionable and does not really offer going forward as I thought he would. Not someone who can put pressure on Pring.

Shame as I thought we had some options at full back but looks like it’s Pring and Tanner (unless Vyner moves across) with little pressure on each of them for a starting role.
 

Hopefully we won’t burn them out.

Do you not remember  vyner as a  rb   losing his marker most games ,no thanks he's a cb .Playing  rb he'd  be gone by now .

[old_eastender]

TGH got out muscled and lost possession numerous times tonight, not good whatever position he plays. Tanner a much better RB defensively at least. 

Given space TGH probably better as a midfielder but needs to toughen up.

[steviestevieneville]

7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Him and Kingy needed to communicate better by the looks of it.

As others have said too, his passing is decent, good range.  He looks like he needs to improve his fitness, he hasn’t played much, had no run of games.

 

Re Roberts, he’s very good technically, suffering from lack of minutes / sharpness too.

 

No rush to judge either, but I think they will be / are just fine and will be good signings.

Agree both will be good signings & wont judge either of them . It’s a big step up for roberts especially. TGH as I’ve said before isn’t a right back imo & it could well be a lack of fitness as he was getting beaten by pace easily last night. The cameo in midfield against Plymouth I thought he did well. Give the lads time , they’ll improve. 

[Packman]

Thought TGH looked very good in midfield against a strong Leicester team, he really gave them something to think about. 

Think he will be a good signing in the long run.

[marcofisher]

I agree with the above saying that TGH is a midfielder and not a full back. Seemed to get caught out of position a number of times and does not have the outright pace to get back in position. 
 

His passing range, work rate and technical ability was there to see though, and I think he would shine in a midfield berth. 
 

If we had another fit full back I could easily have seen him in for Williams who I thought really struggled last night.

[mozo]

9 hours ago, Northern Red said:

It was only a few weeks ago that Roberts was being considered by some as unlucky not to be starting ahead of Pring. Got caught out for the goal tonight but he's a good player and a handy option to have.

TGH isn't a RB by trade and won't be playing there unless he has to, but has looked useful in midfield.

Well let's not forget that Roberts looked top quality in pre-season, and Pring hasn't played to the best of his ability in many games this season, so I think you can see why people add those two things together. Pring was also rubbish today so I'm not sure Roberts' performance tells us anything?

[johnbytheriver]

They will both be good in the long run. Difficult to play against Rotherham's neanderthal  style football. Our passing game improved in the 2nd half at one time we had 70 per cent

possession .Roberts has not had much game time hard to get going in those circumstances.Give these guys a break.

[Johnny Musicworks]

Roberts just like Anis is suffering from lack of game time and few opportunities. Until either of them start a few matches then it’s hard to fairly judge. 

[Open End Numb Legs]

Thinking back to last night, it was a scrappy game that belonged in non league football. It reminded me of an FA Cup match where a prem team visits a L2 side and gets dragged down into a long ball battle.

It is no surprise that some players found it hard to adjust. It isn't the sort of training they would be used to, so on that basis it is probably best not to judge anyone on that game alone.

[Shauntaylor85]

1 hour ago, Packman said:

Thought TGH looked very good in midfield against a strong Leicester team, he really gave them something to think about. 

Think he will be a good signing in the long run.

He will be better suited to the three with James and Knight. Sensational pass to King at the end, cannot wait for McCrorie to be fit, think he could be a gem! 

[mozo]

12 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Thinking back to last night, it was a scrappy game that belonged in non league football. It reminded me of an FA Cup match where a prem team visits a L2 side and gets dragged down into a long ball battle.

It is no surprise that some players found it hard to adjust. It isn't the sort of training they would be used to, so on that basis it is probably best not to judge anyone on that game alone.

Yeah I messaged my mate at half time that it was Vanarama.

[Northern Red]

1 hour ago, mozo said:

Well let's not forget that Roberts looked top quality in pre-season, and Pring hasn't played to the best of his ability in many games this season, so I think you can see why people add those two things together. Pring was also rubbish today so I'm not sure Roberts' performance tells us anything?

I'm not saying that opinion was wrong, far from it. More that the OP is being very kneejerk, as ever.

[mozo]

1 minute ago, Northern Red said:

I'm not saying that opinion was wrong, far from it. More that the OP is being very kneejerk, as ever.

Ohhhh...

I'm definitely not making any judgements about TGH yet. I've seen flashes of good and flashes of bad which is typical of a player in his situation. Nige seems very enthusiastic about him.

[Port Said Red]

3 hours ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Thinking back to last night, it was a scrappy game that belonged in non league football. It reminded me of an FA Cup match where a prem team visits a L2 side and gets dragged down into a long ball battle.

It is no surprise that some players found it hard to adjust. It isn't the sort of training they would be used to, so on that basis it is probably best not to judge anyone on that game alone.

Bloody hell mate, do you have a microphone hidden in my house? That's almost word for word what I said to my wife when she asked me what the game was like. 

I don't know what it is about Rotherham, but it always feels like that against them every time. @Davefevs will probably have a greater depth on how they stopped us playing, but the one thing I noticed was that Pring could hardly get over the halfway line because of the way they kept overloading that right side.

[Alessandro]

13 hours ago, Betty Swallocks said:

TGH hasn’t been signed to play RB long term. 
He looks a tidy footballer, looking forward to seeing him play in his more favoured position. 

Exactly this - people have probably got used to a more defensive RB in Tanner and TGH is much more dynamic going forward, which of course will leave him exposed at the back, especially with Sykes perhaps too used to a conservative RB behind him, so not covering as well as he should.

As you say I think TGH's best position is not RB and seeing his technicality on the ball, engine and range of passing (see the highlights for 2 excellent cross field passes in the second half) - think there is much more to come and we'll see in CM soon IMO.

 

[Sir Geoff]

Of more concern to me is Pring's last couple of performances. imo he has looked unusually weak and lacking in a bit of confidence on the ball.

[Open End Numb Legs]

26 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

Bloody hell mate, do you have a microphone hidden in my house? That's almost word for word what I said to my wife when she asked me what the game was like. 

 

Yeh, a bit of a giveaway quoting you word for word.

By the way, I like the idea of the holiday you are planning and the washing machine sounds on the way out. Could you get the dog to bark less? Thanks! 

[Wellspokenman]

14 hours ago, Port Said Red said:

Quite right, they are both players of quality, but they are being asked to fill in holes in our squad right now. Roberts showed that in one of the home games where he came on after 70 minutes and ended up playing in 3 different positions. It showed his versatility, but hardly helps him to settle. 

I think TGH has more to show us from dead ball situations too.

I hope so, as our dead ball plays are just woeful !

One area of the game that you would think could easily but improved upon.

[Davefevs]

4 hours ago, Port Said Red said:

Bloody hell mate, do you have a microphone hidden in my house? That's almost word for word what I said to my wife when she asked me what the game was like. 

I don't know what it is about Rotherham, but it always feels like that against them every time. @Davefevs will probably have a greater depth on how they stopped us playing, but the one thing I noticed was that Pring could hardly get over the halfway line because of the way they kept overloading that right side.

Not an easy game to be analytical about watching on Skytv when you can only see a third of the pitch at anyone time.  FWIW my main thoughts were:

• if you can play out from deep at the back and beat the press, your opponent will stop pressing you high, and you can get up the pitch - we didn’t do that early game
• if you can keep the ball, even if only going sideways, your opponent will eventually switch off and you can then start to try to get up the pitch - we didn’t do that early game
• if you can stop their keeper from kicking halfway into his half and maybe from within his own box, you’ll find yourselves naturally further up the pitch to challenge from the ball and if you win, your possession starts 20 yards further up - we didn’t do that early game, let Johansen dribble out of his box and then launch it.  We got caught offside gave away free-kicks that allowed him to launch it deep

When we started to do the above we looked a more competent team, e.g. second half.

Players like Hugill, ot doesn’t matter if he doesn’t win the long ball, he’s there mainly to disrupt.  Nothing worse for Tiehi, Rathbone and Cafu to anticipate a loose ball off of a contested Hugill challenge with the CB, but see a good clean header go over their heads and have to run backwards, probably against an opponents who beyond them.

So, in summary, we couldn’t impose our game early on, and you effectively had two teams slinging long balls at each other, with one team more set up to do so (Rotherham).

What was good was that we defended pretty resolutely.  Sometimes you have to.

3 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

Of more concern to me is Pring's last couple of performances. imo he has looked unusually weak and lacking in a bit of confidence on the ball.

I’m not saying this is the only reason, but I think Sam Bell as LF isn’t protecting him that well, so he’s being left 1v1 a lot.  Green is pretty quick too.

Having said that it wouldn’t surprise me if he’s not 100% / nursing himself through games.  That’s not unusual, lots of players will playing carry knocks, but I agree.  He doesn’t look like the Pring of last season, although I still think he’s playing fine.

In good possession phases I think Bell needs to “clear the way for him” more, but he’s a bit of a  touchline “hugger” and that denies Pring space to drive forward.

Off of long balls last night Bell did come more central (so that’s good), but generally he’s happy to stay out wide.

[Better Red]

19 hours ago, Davefevs said:

 

I hope he keeps up his fine record….more, more!

Not writing anyone of yet.

I just said what I saw last night and in last few games.

TGH did not look like a £1m player last night. He looked like he struggled to make a tackle and track bacK. I would say those two are a given when spending £1m quid. That’s the big point I am making he is ‘£1m quid not a free transfer’

He can def find a pass and looks good on the ball and clearly something there but that side of the game is very important in ‘this team’

Bakinson was kicked out pretty quickly for not doing the same but his was his effort rather than ability to do it. TGH is not his attitude or effort.

 

Also for the last time said Seymenyo not a Striker. Said he will never score 10 goals a season -  2+ years later I am still right but let’s not let the facts get in the way.
Don’t forget to keep messaging when he scores it’s been very quiet for such a long time.

 

 

 

[GeoTheCiderHead]

I only started watching the game on Sky Sports from 25 minutes onwards and as someone who is definitely more glass half empty than glass half full, I actually thought that TGH was half decent. Some nice touches and some clever passes particularly in the second half. I’m assuming he had most of his negative moments during the first 25 minutes that I didn’t watch? Couldn’t work out what I thought of HR’s performance - didn’t do anything worthy of note good or bad.