Still getting away with it.

[Port Said Red]

1 hour ago, StefanDimz said:

Where's this claim comes from? Do you personally know something the rest of us don't? How do you know he'a a 'yes' man?

Get with the programme! If he thinks the same way and wants the same things he's a yes man, if he says or does something different it's because the club is a shambles and the backroom staff are like the cast of an Agatha Christie play.

[downendcity]

1 hour ago, transfer reader said:

What evidence do you have that Manning is a yes man?

When Steve asked if he wanted the job Manning replied "yes".

Q.E.D.

[downendcity]

11 minutes ago, downendcity said:

When Steve asked if he wanted the job Manning replied "yes".

Q.E.D.

Just noticed @Street red posted the same previously.

Note to self: read the thread before posting!

[BrizzleRed]

1 minute ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

It's not so black and white. If you genuinely think it's a case of "job done" please explain fully.

I strongly suspect that helping us get back onto a steady financial footing, whilst keeping us in the Championship was Lansdown’s main aim for NP.  

Seems like we’ve made big strides on that front, so he was then binned at the earliest opportunity.

He clearly isn’t a Lansdown type manager, so that’s the only reason I can find for him initially being employed and would also explain the timing and real reason for his sacking.

[reddoc]

10 minutes ago, transfer reader said:

What evidence do you have that Mamming is a yes man then?

Are you struggling with this? I know nothing about this guy, but like many on here I've witnessed Lansdown struggling with strong personalities over the years, his knee jerk reaction being to bring in a manager he can control. Therefore I wait to be pleasantly surprised. But I doubt I will be.

[Cidre Monita]

1 hour ago, And Its Smith said:

Just go on his Wikipedia page and see his playing career. Easier than asking us! 

My sincere apologies for having the audacity to ask you guys a question. I should of course referred to that well know reliable info site before bothering anyone. Anyway just checked as per your suggestion and found out what an impressive playing CV he has. Amongst others he has played for the following:- Long Melford, Leiston, Selfoss and Wroxham. We are truly blessed….

[Davefevs]

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

(I don’t)

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

11 minutes ago, reddoc said:

Are you struggling with this? I know nothing about this guy, but like many on here I've witnessed Lansdown struggling with strong personalities over the years, his knee jerk reaction being to bring in a manager he can control. Therefore I wait to be pleasantly surprised. But I doubt I will be.

If you know nothing about him, then it's wrong for you to assert that he is a yes man.

It's a simple as that.

Any claim made requires evidence to back it up.

[Kid in the Riot]

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

(I don’t)

Absolutely not. He came across as confident and very much his own man.

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

(I don’t)

Apologies if you answered something like this earlier in the thread, but what did you think of his response to your question?

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

5 minutes ago, Cidre Monita said:

My sincere apologies for having the audacity to ask you guys a question. I should of course referred to that well know reliable info site before bothering anyone. Anyway just checked as per your suggestion and found out what an impressive playing CV he has. Amongst others he has played for the following:- Long Melford, Leiston, Selfoss and Wroxham. We are truly blessed….

Arsene Wenger played for Mutzig, Mulhouse and ASPV Strasbourg 

Didn't seem to harm him much that he didn't have a stellar playing career did it?

What about Mourinho who played for giants such as Sesimbra and Comercio e Industria?

 

I'm not suggesting Manning will be on the level of either of those, but the playing career of someone is frankly irrelevant to how good they might be as a coach or a manager.

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

1 minute ago, BrizzleRed said:

I strongly suspect that helping us get back onto a steady financial footing, whilst keeping us in the Championship was Lansdown’s main aim for NP.  

Seems like we’ve made big strides on that front, so he was then binned at the earliest opportunity.

He clearly isn’t a Lansdown type manager, so that’s the only reason I can find for him initially being employed and would also explain the timing and real reason for his sacking.

I agree with the first highlighted statement. And ,tbf, SL succeeded in his aim so maybe not so clueless as his critics believe.

The second bit re his sacking is more murky and I don't agree that it was definitely "the real reason". IMO- there is more about NP's health issues that will emerge . He can't have been sacked on recent results alone. However he held the record for some of the worst records including only just beating Sunderland to not have the longest record of no home wins.

I remember ( just now) walking out through  the Dolman with my sons singing " we won at home (etc)" - it was genuinely uplifting. In hindsight we just won a home match which really shouldn't be a cup final feeling. 

Nigel didn't give me any real moments thatI'll treasure or remember.

Johnson snr did

Cotterill did and is the best ever

Johnson Jnr gave me the best night of my football life v Man U. Who'd have thought at the age of almost 50, I'd invade the pitch like I did to hug Rob Newman on the final match of the season v Brentford ( 3-1 or 4-1??)

The only thing I'll ever remember about an NP game is winning at home after a million years.

[BrizzleRed]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

(I don’t)

He certainly appears confident in his own ability, without seeming arrogant and doesn’t come across as passive, so certainly positive signs.

Hopefully he’s his own man and just knows the right things to say at an interview to get the job.

It’ll certainly be interesting to see how things develop if he’s willing to stand up and fight his corner.

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes

But no if it's ok with everyone else.

[Davefevs]

7 minutes ago, transfer reader said:

Apologies if you answered something like this earlier in the thread, but what did you think of his response to your question?

I wanted to ask a question that wasn’t about systems and could be answered by the cliche - forward-thinking, high-pressing, and I wanted to find out what he thought about what was already here.

I thought it was a good answer, didn’t feel like he had a script prepared.

I liked some of his answers to James Piercy, not afraid to clarify the question.  I think it is clear that he will repetitively use certain phrases (Club interview, written press interview, and BBCRB interview), but I think these are where we will see his core principles…and subsequently we can invaluable performance against these.

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I wanted to ask a question that wasn’t about systems and could be answered by the cliche - forward-thinking, high-pressing, and I wanted to find out what he thought about what was already here.

I thought it was a good answer, didn’t feel like he had a script prepared.

I liked some of his answers to James Piercy, not afraid to clarify the question.  I think it is clear that he will repetitively use certain phrases (Club interview, written press interview, and BBCRB interview), but I think these are where we will see his core principles…and subsequently we can invaluable performance against these.

I half listened to the interview when I was on a scooter down to work, but phased in and out of paying attention to it

 

Came across well in the bits where I was listening, will give it another listen in the morning when I'm more awake

[Cidre Monita]

11 minutes ago, transfer reader said:

Arsene Wenger played for Mutzig, Mulhouse and ASPV Strasbourg 

Didn't seem to harm him much that he didn't have a stellar playing career did it?

What about Mourinho who played for giants such as Sesimbra and Comercio e Industria?

 

I'm not suggesting Manning will be on the level of either of those, but the playing career of someone is frankly irrelevant to how good they might be as a coach or a manager.

To be fair those are 2 extreme examples but it’s certainly the case that some great players have been crap managers and vice versa. 
it just worries me that this guy also has a very unimpressive coaching/managerial career thus far. His success effectively equates to a couple of good months at Oxford. 

[red colin]

22 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

(I don’t)

No he seems like he knows what he wants and usually those types  are not yes men.

[BrizzleRed]

5 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

I agree with the first highlighted statement. And ,tbf, SL succeeded in his aim so maybe not so clueless as his critics believe.

The second bit re his sacking is more murky and I don't agree that it was definitely "the real reason". IMO- there is more about NP's health issues that will emerge . He can't have been sacked on recent results alone. However he held the record for some of the worst records including only just beating Sunderland to not have the longest record of no home wins.

I remember ( just now) walking out through  the Dolman with my sons singing " we won at home (etc)" - it was genuinely uplifting. In hindsight we just won a home match which really shouldn't be a cup final feeling. 

Nigel didn't give me any real moments thatI'll treasure or remember.

Johnson snr did

Cotterill did and is the best ever

Johnson Jnr gave me the best night of my football life v Man U. Who'd have thought at the age of almost 50, I'd invade the pitch like I did to hug Rob Newman on the final match of the season v Brentford ( 3-1 or 4-1??)

The only thing I'll ever remember about an NP game is winning at home after a million years.

Some interesting points, though I’d have to say, if it was due to his health, why couldn’t they have agreed a severance and pay up the remainder of his contract?  They will have to do that anyway and at least it would have avoided the bitterness at his dismissal.

Yes, the football has been dull, but to me, it’s been survival tactics, mainly due to an unbalanced squad for much of his time here, so I didn’t expect much more.

Looking at results, team spirit and general attitude of supporters, the timing of him going was all wrong.  It’s a subject that’s been done to death now, but looking at it as a fan, he really should have been given enough time to at least show what he could do with closer to his full squad.

In the end though, it’s clear Lansdown wasn’t offering him an extended contract, so it just boils down to who’s at fault for that.

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

1 minute ago, Cidre Monita said:

To be fair those are 2 extreme examples but it’s certainly the case that some great players have been crap managers and vice versa. 
it just worries me that this guy also has a very unimpressive coaching/managerial career thus far. His success effectively equates to a couple of good months at Oxford. 

And a good spell at MK Dons, and a good spell at the Belgian club he managed.

A high 40s% win rate everywhere he has managed.

[And Its Smith]

28 minutes ago, Cidre Monita said:

My sincere apologies for having the audacity to ask you guys a question. I should of course referred to that well know reliable info site before bothering anyone. Anyway just checked as per your suggestion and found out what an impressive playing CV he has. Amongst others he has played for the following:- Long Melford, Leiston, Selfoss and Wroxham. We are truly blessed….

Gives a ****. He ain’t playing for us is he 

[reddoc]

21 minutes ago, transfer reader said:

If you know nothing about him, then it's wrong for you to assert that he is a yes man.

It's a simple as that.

Any claim made requires evidence to back it up.

Don't think you'll find anything I've said suggests he's a ' yes man' . I was referring to Lansdown's preference for them. However I note Davfevs and KITR liked your post so abiding by the rules of OTIB, I'll have to accept I'm wrong 

[Davefevs]

9 minutes ago, Cidre Monita said:

To be fair those are 2 extreme examples but it’s certainly the case that some great players have been crap managers and vice versa. 
it just worries me that this guy also has a very unimpressive coaching/managerial career thus far. His success effectively equates to a couple of good months at Oxford. 

My theory is that most of these unsuccessful as a player / successful as a manager types tend to have had good mentors.

Wenger had Platini’s father for example.

Manning mentioned Brian Klug (ex-Ipswich player when I was young), Graham Westley (West Ham) and Claudio Reyna (NY, ex Man City).

[BCFC31]

Not sure where the notion comes from that manning is a yes man. Doesn't cone across that way he is totally different to lee Johnson in the way he comes across. he is alot clearer and talks sence and isn't full of stupid one liners and technical jargon. I don't agree with what the board has done to pearson either it was unfair but we have to move forward now...

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

21 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I wanted to ask a question that wasn’t about systems and could be answered by the cliche - forward-thinking, high-pressing, and I wanted to find out what he thought about what was already here.

I thought it was a good answer, didn’t feel like he had a script prepared.

I liked some of his answers to James Piercy, not afraid to clarify the question.  I think it is clear that he will repetitively use certain phrases (Club interview, written press interview, and BBCRB interview), but I think these are where we will see his core principles…and subsequently we can invaluable performance against these.

I'm sure I saw Jon wince/flinch when the interviewer mentioned a question from Dave Fevs

[maxjak]

2 hours ago, Curr Avon said:

Nigehead Revisited? Larry Olivier, Jeremy Irons, Anthony Andrews. I can see it now, this means Waugh.....

Evelyn or Keith??

[Rocking Red Cyril]

53 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

(I don’t)

One press conference is not a lot to go on. He said the right things. I really wish him all the best and hope he does well. But the fall out from Niges sacking is not going away quickly I feel 

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 minutes ago, Rocking Red Cyril said:

One press conference is not a lot to go on. He said the right things. I really wish him all the best and hope he does well. But the fall out from Niges sacking is not going away quickly I feel 

The only way it will dissipate IMO and quickly is if Manning gets off to a flyer then a drop off maybe inevitable but keeps us around play-off contending.

Otherwise I agree, the fallout from it will linger for a while.

[Bazooka Joe]

21 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said:

I'm sure I saw Jon wince/flinch when the interviewer mentioned a question from Dave Fevs

That apparently happens whenever he soils his pants.

Here's to the future.

Nappy Days.

[Bazooka Joe]

I thought this thread was about Tin Can the betrayer.

Anyway, with regard to whether Manning is a yes man. Let's see if he stands up to the Lansdowns if/when push comes to shove.

My guess is he'll wilt and succumb, but my hope is that he'll tell them to do one.

 

[Redrascal2]

1 hour ago, reddoc said:

Fairly obvious that it's neither. But I think historically it's clear that he's more comfortable with a sycophant in charge.

 So you have deduced that Manning is a yes man and  now a sycophant as well. And he has been with us for how long. 

 

1 hour ago, reddoc said:

Are you struggling with this? I know nothing about this guy, but like many on here I've witnessed Lansdown struggling with strong personalities over the years, his knee jerk reaction being to bring in a manager he can control. Therefore I wait to be pleasantly surprised. But I doubt I will be.

Well I am one of those struggling with this. You know very little about Manning like most of us. He has been at the club for about 6 hours but you know he is a yes man. What incredible insights you have on someone you know nothing about.

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, reddoc said:

Don't think you'll find anything I've said suggests he's a ' yes man' . I was referring to Lansdown's preference for them. However I note Davfevs and KITR liked your post so abiding by the rules of OTIB, I'll have to accept I'm wrong 

Eh?

I was just liking a post saying there is no evidence to suggest he’s a yes man.  I didn’t look at what was being quoted (your post).

You can challenge / disagree with anything I post, anytime you like.  I have no problems with that at all.

On your point on SL, which I didn’t read, I tend to agree…although I’m not sure he cares whether he has yes men or not, he just does what he likes.  I guess if you’re not a yes man, you get moved on.

 

[W-S-M Seagull]

3 hours ago, Davefevs said:

A question for anyone has watched his live press conference - 

do you think he comes across as a yes man?

 

 

 

 

 

 

(I don’t)

I don't think yes man is the right word to describe either him or LJ. 

LJ maybe blew smoke up the owners arses more than Manning has done so far. 

I think both LJ and Manning are the golden boys, the choosen ones. 

LJ wasn't so much of a yes man because he constantly demanded players and was given them because he was the golden boy. The owners were certain that they had made the right decision to hire him so we're prepared to back him. 

I think Manning will also recieve backing that NP wasn't given. 

This isn't a slight on Manning, it's a criticism of the owners. 

Pearson was more of a yes man bizarrely in the sense that he just got on with the job. But of course we don't know what happened in private. 

My worry is that we may once again have to get used to losing streaks and if things aren't going well, a high turnover of players as the board gives Manning all the tools he needs to succeed. 

Edited November 8, 2023 by W-S-M Seagull

[RedLionLad]

3 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Absolutely not. He came across as confident and very much his own man.

A bit like Jesse Marsch did at Leeds

[Davefevs]

26 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I don't think yes man is the right word to describe either him or LJ. 

LJ maybe blew smoke up the owners arses more than Manning has done so far. 

I think both LJ and Manning are the golden boys, the choosen ones. 

LJ wasn't so much of a yes man because he constantly demanded players and was given them because he was the golden boy. The owners were certain that they had made the right decision to hire him so we're prepared to back him. 

I think Manning will also recieve backing that NP wasn't given. 

This isn't a slight on Manning, it's a criticism of the owners. 

Pearson was more of a yes man bizarrely in the sense that he just got on with the job. But of course we don't know what happened in private. 

My worry is that we may once again have to get used to losing streaks and if things aren't going well, a high turnover of players as the board gives Manning all the tools he needs to succeed. 

I think Manning’s fundamentals / principles are far more ingrained than LJs.

I always felt LJ showed insecurity, I haven’t seen that in Manning interviews so far (not just todays).

But I will be looking forward to hearing his first interview after a loss / bad performance - hopefully it’ll be a while!  Equally I will be interested to hear his winning interviews too.  LJ tended to want to make them about him.

In terms of what I heard today, I heard much of Nige in his principles.

He will earn his stripes with the players for his training sessions, his tactical briefs and debriefs, his selection decisions / policy and his man-management.  All the bits we don’t see in the main.

We will get a feel from player interviews and player performance.

It is a risk, it is fine to be worried, but it is also fine to just take a step back and “wait and see”.  We don’t need to takes sides and crystallise our opinion less than 12 hours in. Imho 

[W-S-M Seagull]

44 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It is a risk, it is fine to be worried, but it is also fine to just take a step back and “wait and see”. We don’t need to takes sides and crystallise our opinion less than 12 hours in. Imho 

As a football fan, I don't think I've ever been in this strange position. Maybe a little bit after Wilson left to be replaced by Tinnion? 

I have no problem with people feeling excited about this appointment, I hope one day I can feel excited too. But one of my worries is the fan base is now divided and it just feels like it didn't need to be this way. I've recieved some unkind words said towards me simply because I'm not yet on board with this appointment. I want to be but its going to take time. 

If Manning loses a couple in a row then it's going to be toxic. We had all that in the LJ years. 

I suppose my big worry is that Nige left a squad that is primed to progress. This is a fantastic opportunity. Manning may turn out to be a future England manager, who knows. My concern is in Lansdown and Tinnions ability to appoint the right guy to take the team forward. 

We've spent years watching LJ manage us and then spent years watching the recovery from all of that and it's been painful Dave. Spent thousands watching us through all of that.

I like how others are optimistic but I'm worried about going back to all those days having finally got the squad into such a good place. 

My gut feeling isn't good about this and my gut feeling has served me well in life. Something just doesn't feel right to me but I am hoping that is just that because all of this is different to what we have been used to under the stability of Nige. 

Under Nige I was able to buy in because he's been there and done it. We then saw all the improvements he made during his time here. 

With LM, he doesn't even know if his way will bring success so I find it hard to currently buy into that. I admire that he has the belief that his way will bring success but then so many people before him also believed their way would bring success...

I think maybe I would have liked him to have addressed this in his press conference. 

Edited November 8, 2023 by W-S-M Seagull

[NSFF]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

As a football fan, I don't think I've ever been in this strange position. Maybe a little bit after Wilson left to be replaced by Tinnion? 

I have no problem with people feeling excited about this appointment, I hope one day I can feel excited too. But one of my worries is the fan base is now divided and it just feels like it didn't need to be this way. I've recieved some unkind words said towards me simply because I'm not yet on board with this appointment. I want to be but its going to take time. 

If Manning loses a couple in a row then it's going to be toxic. We had all that in the LJ years. 

I suppose my big worry is that Nige left a squad that is primed to progress. This is a fantastic opportunity. Manning may turn out to be a future England manager, who knows. My concern is in Lansdown and Tinnions ability to appoint the right guy to take the team forward. 

We've spent years watching LJ manage us and then spent years watching the recovery from all of that and it's been painful Dave. Spent thousands watching us through all of that.

I like how others are optimistic but I'm worried about going back to all those days having finally got the squad into such a good place. 

My gut feeling isn't good about this and my gut feeling has served me well in life. Something just doesn't feel right to me but I am hoping that is just that because all of this is different to what we have been used to under the stability of Nige. 

Under Nige I was able to buy in because he's been there and done it. We then saw all the improvements he made during his time here. 

With LM, he doesn't even know if his way will bring success so I find it hard to currently buy into that. I admire that he has the belief that his way will bring success but then so many people before him also believed their way would bring success...

I think maybe I would have liked him to have addressed this in his press conference. 

Think the above sums it up perfectly, on another note if you weren’t a Bristol City fan and sat at home watching this what would your thoughts be then ? When Birmingham sacked Eustace for Rooney didn’t a little bit of you inside think hope he fails there as that Eustace was doing a decent job ? 
Reading the other posts here I’m not for a minute saying Pearson was the messiah some of the football was dire at times but seeing his plan in building a team bringing the youth through having very little investment meant like most I brought into it more.

His sacking wasn’t a shock once your contract gets into the last 6 months and no talks about a new one are forthcoming then the writings on the wall really just like most it didn’t sit well with me thought my club was better than that 

 

[Son of Fred]

8 hours ago, Red DNA said:

…and we also appointed Nige - so where’s your logic?

Nigel being a departure from the norm....

The Lansdownes won't make that mistake again,, hopefully because they'll be gone.

[Son of Fred]

16 minutes ago, NSFF said:

thought my club was better than that 

You did???

That's fine - you'll learn!

And as regards not liking some of the football served up,don't forget,Nigel was working on a root & branch rebuild throughout the club.

You can't bake a cake without breaking eggs.

[NSFF]

11 minutes ago, Son of Fred said:

You did???

That's fine - you'll learn!

And as regards not liking some of the football served up,don't forget,Nigel was working on a root & branch rebuild throughout the club.

You can't bake a cake without breaking eggs.

Totally agree just thought we’d turned the corner when appointing Pearson now it’s back to who the Binman recommends 

[Son of Fred]

4 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Pearson was more of a yes man bizarrely in the sense that he just got on with the job.

Great point - although the majority of bosses become blind to that if you dare to ask questions..

[Port Said Red]

8 hours ago, Cidre Monita said:

To be fair those are 2 extreme examples but it’s certainly the case that some great players have been crap managers and vice versa. 
it just worries me that this guy also has a very unimpressive coaching/managerial career thus far. His success effectively equates to a couple of good months at Oxford. 

In any walk of life the skill set required for someone to manage or lead a team is hugely different to those required to be a part of that team, luckily for me, as it kept me in work for 20 years training staff in the skills necessary to take those steps up the ladder.

I also spent the last dozen or so years training people to use Payroll and Finance software, two areas where I had little or no experience at all. But I knew what those people needed to know from talking to them and studying up in those fields. I had been trained to train people, which was my skill set and was confident that the techniques I had been shown allowed to me train almost anything, given enough preparation time.

[Silvio Dante]

9 hours ago, transfer reader said:

Arsene Wenger played for Mutzig, Mulhouse and ASPV Strasbourg 

Didn't seem to harm him much that he didn't have a stellar playing career did it?

What about Mourinho who played for giants such as Sesimbra and Comercio e Industria?

 

I'm not suggesting Manning will be on the level of either of those, but the playing career of someone is frankly irrelevant to how good they might be as a coach or a manager.

As a generic point I agree with this. Players who aren’t as gifted naturally have to work harder, and that often gives an insight into how they and others need to improve. It’s getting the “small percentages” to go all LJ for a moment. I’ve seen the “unknowingly incompetent to knowingly competent”model more times than I care to mention and there is something in it, although it’s not an “absolute”
 

The contrary to this is that the worse the player, the less likely they are to have experienced a high level and understand the mentality needed.

For Manning, my concern is how far down that “competency” model he is. I’ve been consistent that I don’t inherently dislike the appointment but think there are (reasonable) questions about the MK Dons proximity. Against that, if his trajectory had continued he may be out of reach so I get striking while the irons hot. It’s a gamble, no doubt, but not one that is LMs fault and he has my full support (the board and Tinnion not so). I don’t think he is necessarily a “yes” man from what I’ve seen and for JL and BT it may be a case of being careful what you wish for 

Edited November 8, 2023 by Silvio Dante

[reddoc]

7 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Eh?

I was just liking a post saying there is no evidence to suggest he’s a yes man.  I didn’t look at what was being quoted (your post).

You can challenge / disagree with anything I post, anytime you like.  I have no problems with that at all.

On your point on SL, which I didn’t read, I tend to agree…although I’m not sure he cares whether he has yes men or not, he just does what he likes.  I guess if you’re not a yes man, you get moved on.

 

Haha, sorry Dave, wasn't a dig, just made me laugh when two of otibs more respected posters appeared to disagree with me simultaneously. I know nothing about Manning , probably due to his relatively unimpressive CV, and therefore suspect that Mr Lansdown believes he'll be easier to influence than Nige was. We'll find out soon enough.

[Davefevs]

6 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

As a football fan, I don't think I've ever been in this strange position. Maybe a little bit after Wilson left to be replaced by Tinnion? 

I have no problem with people feeling excited about this appointment, I hope one day I can feel excited too. But one of my worries is the fan base is now divided and it just feels like it didn't need to be this way. I've recieved some unkind words said towards me simply because I'm not yet on board with this appointment. I want to be but its going to take time. 

If Manning loses a couple in a row then it's going to be toxic. We had all that in the LJ years. 

I suppose my big worry is that Nige left a squad that is primed to progress. This is a fantastic opportunity. Manning may turn out to be a future England manager, who knows. My concern is in Lansdown and Tinnions ability to appoint the right guy to take the team forward. 

We've spent years watching LJ manage us and then spent years watching the recovery from all of that and it's been painful Dave. Spent thousands watching us through all of that.

I like how others are optimistic but I'm worried about going back to all those days having finally got the squad into such a good place. 

My gut feeling isn't good about this and my gut feeling has served me well in life. Something just doesn't feel right to me but I am hoping that is just that because all of this is different to what we have been used to under the stability of Nige. 

Under Nige I was able to buy in because he's been there and done it. We then saw all the improvements he made during his time here. 

With LM, he doesn't even know if his way will bring success so I find it hard to currently buy into that. I admire that he has the belief that his way will bring success but then so many people before him also believed their way would bring success...

I think maybe I would have liked him to have addressed this in his press conference. 

Good post Gull.

Its interesting that you bring up Wilson / Tinnion (and @NSFF brings up Eustace / Rooney), because at that time I wasn’t heavily invested in City as a fan, you could probably call me a follower.  It was my fallen out of love with football years.

My view, as a kind of outsider was - he’s had 4 seasons at a big third tier club, given a decent backing, and he’s failed to achieve the aim of getting us up.  Near misses admittedly, but he failed.

Compare that to Cotts, who was well-backed, but delivered in one season, not just promotion, but Champs and Cup winners.  That shouldn’t be underestimated, it was a over-achievement,

But had I known then what appears to be the case now, that Tins undermined Wilson to get the job himself, then I might’ve held a very different view.

But the difference with Manning and with Rooney is they didn’t do the undermining.  So I can’t direct any anger at LM.

Pearson’s sacking (and his 3 staff) was handled atrociously, the PR machine put into full operation after their dreadful initial statements, to create a plausible back story.  And by PR machine, I’m not talking about posters on here, I’m talking about all the texts and DMs I received from people who’ve never had anything remotely ITK to share suddenly getting wind of stuff.

I digress.

Absolutely fine to have a gut feel too.  I don’t have one really.

1 hour ago, Silvio Dante said:

As a generic point I agree with this. Players who aren’t as gifted naturally have to work harder, and that often gives an insight into how they and others need to improve. It’s getting the “small percentages” to go all LJ for a moment. I’ve seen the “unknowingly incompetent to knowingly competent”model more times than I care to mention and there is something in it, although it’s not an “absolute”
 

The contrary to this is that the worse the player, the less likely they are to have experienced a high level and understand the mentality needed.

For Manning, my concern is how far down that “competency” model he is. I’ve been consistent that I don’t inherently dislike the appointment but think there are (reasonable) questions about the MK Dons proximity. Against that, if his trajectory had continued he may be out of reach so I get striking while the irons hot. It’s a gamble, no doubt, but not one that is LMs fault and he has my full support (the board and Tinnion not so). I don’t think he is necessarily a “yes” man from what I’ve seen and for JL and BT it may be a case of being careful what you wish for 

The hope, and it is hope, is that he’s well down it, having learned in Elite set-ups (CFG and West Ham) with elite players.  He’s only been able to put it into practice as the one in charge of teams at Lg1 and Tier2 Belgium, but he has coached elite players.

To be rude and hugely unfair, I think this is a better grounding than your dad’s team’s kit basket!  Hope you get what I’m trying to get across?  Although without straying too much, going to the best school doesn’t mean you’re not a c u next Tuesday!

I am placing a positive spin on it.  I said a few times over the past 10 days - give me any prospective manager and I could spin my view either way if I wanted.

I’ve fallen down on the + side, but that is a very temporary position.  Maybe @W-S-M Seagull, I do have a gut feel!  I really will be judging by what I see in matches, pre and post match press conferences, and not forgetting player press conferences too, they are a good insight too.  I will try to be objective and true to my methods of evaluating too.  I’ve already created my end-of Pearson and end-of Fleming data points to be able to compare Manning specifically, e.g. has pressing improved under him, do we create more chances from build-ups, etc, etc.  Fleming’s 667 passes last week against 10-men for 60c mins, makes him look like Russell Martin on steroids, so I’ve got my raw data prepared!

[Davefevs]

18 minutes ago, reddoc said:

Haha, sorry Dave, wasn't a dig, just made me laugh when two of otibs more respected posters appeared to disagree with me simultaneously. I know nothing about Manning , probably due to his relatively unimpressive CV, and therefore suspect that Mr Lansdown believes he'll be easier to influence than Nige was. We'll find out soon enough.

It was a half apology from me to admit I should’ve read what was being quoted in the response.  No apology needed from you.

[Ashtongreight]

2 hours ago, Port Said Red said:

In any walk of life the skill set required for someone to manage or lead a team is hugely different to those required to be a part of that team, luckily for me, as it kept me in work for 20 years training staff in the skills necessary to take those steps up the ladder.

I also spent the last dozen or so years training people to use Payroll and Finance software, two areas where I had little or no experience at all. But I knew what those people needed to know from talking to them and studying up in those fields. I had been trained to train people, which was my skill set and was confident that the techniques I had been shown allowed to me train almost anything, given enough preparation time.

So my question is, why didn’t you apply to take over from Nige?

[Spud21]

14 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Good post Gull.

Its interesting that you bring up Wilson / Tinnion (and @NSFF brings up Eustace / Rooney), because at that time I wasn’t heavily invested in City as a fan, you could probably call me a follower.  It was my fallen out of love with football years.

My view, as a kind of outsider was - he’s had 4 seasons at a big third tier club, given a decent backing, and he’s failed to achieve the aim of getting us up.  Near misses admittedly, but he failed.

Compare that to Cotts, who was well-backed, but delivered in one season, not just promotion, but Champs and Cup winners.  That shouldn’t be underestimated, it was a over-achievement,

But had I known then what appears to be the case now, that Tins undermined Wilson to get the job himself, then I might’ve held a very different view.

But the difference with Manning and with Rooney is they didn’t do the undermining.  So I can’t direct any anger at LM.

Pearson’s sacking (and his 3 staff) was handled atrociously, the PR machine put into full operation after their dreadful initial statements, to create a plausible back story.  And by PR machine, I’m not talking about posters on here, I’m talking about all the texts and DMs I received from people who’ve never had anything remotely ITK to share suddenly getting wind of stuff.

I digress.

Absolutely fine to have a gut feel too.  I don’t have one really.

The hope, and it is hope, is that he’s well down it, having learned in Elite set-ups (CFG and West Ham) with elite players.  He’s only been able to put it into practice as the one in charge of teams at Lg1 and Tier2 Belgium, but he has coached elite players.

To be rude and hugely unfair, I think this is a better grounding than your dad’s team’s kit basket!  Hope you get what I’m trying to get across?  Although without straying too much, going to the best school doesn’t mean you’re not a c u next Tuesday!

I am placing a positive spin on it.  I said a few times over the past 10 days - give me any prospective manager and I could spin my view either way if I wanted.

I’ve fallen down on the + side, but that is a very temporary position.  Maybe @W-S-M Seagull, I do have a gut feel!  I really will be judging by what I see in matches, pre and post match press conferences, and not forgetting player press conferences too, they are a good insight too.  I will try to be objective and true to my methods of evaluating too.  I’ve already created my end-of Pearson and end-of Fleming data points to be able to compare Manning specifically, e.g. has pressing improved under him, do we create more chances from build-ups, etc, etc.  Fleming’s 667 passes last week against 10-men for 60c mins, makes him look like Russell Martin on steroids, so I’ve got my raw data prepared!

As someone who was "literally" there and by thst I mean in the same place as SL, JL and BT on I think the day it was either announced or damn near close to it (fans forum game was at AG on that day, between us and Rovers) , we asked BT before (I think, was a long while ago) the game if it was going to be him and although he didn't directly it was obvious. 

That is absolutely not how I remember it, now did Tinnion use his position to "weasle" into the job maybe, I can't say I have any inside knowledge on that, but why would he need to undermine Wilson the man rocked up to a playoff final with our best player sat on his arse, absolutely everyone I knew wanted him gone to a man, from the minute we left the Millennium stadium. 

That doesn't mean that appointing Tinnion was the right move, could have been a case of right man wrong time, as there needed to be a massive culture change from the players being on the piss all the time (we used to see, Phillips, Peacock, Coles et all every week out in town all the time) and appointing a rookie into that was not a decision that made sense, needed a GJ type to come in at that point. 

I cannot fathom any similarities between the two periods, when Wilson left he was not popular, the culture at the club was an absolute disgrace and we appointed someone with no managerial expirience who was very much even though on the periphery a part of that culture. 

[Port Said Red]

39 minutes ago, Ashtongreight said:

So my question is, why didn’t you apply to take over from Nige?

Well apart from my lack of interest in doing anything that approaches a day's work these days... and also the fact that Nige wasn't a coach/trainer, I would say the amount of time it would take would see me in my grave before I was ready.

It would actually be quite an interesting case study from a technical point of view. As part of my remit in early roles I would also train people to train using a tried and trusted method which consisted of breaking down everyday tasks into bite size pieces and then building those back up into complete tasks.

By watching chefs, waiters, and other people with skills learning to train those skills, I actually some unusual skills myself often in areas I had no history. The knife skills I learned watching chefs has come in very handy now I do a lot of home cooking.

 

 

[reddoc]

11 hours ago, Redrascal2 said:

 So you have deduced that Manning is a yes man and  now a sycophant as well. And he has been with us for how long. 

 

Well I am one of those struggling with this. You know very little about Manning like most of us. He has been at the club for about 6 hours but you know he is a yes man. What incredible insights you have on someone you know nothing about.

Ok, one last time. I've made it clear throughout this thread that I know nothing about Manning other than what I've read on here, and therefore despite being underwhelmed by the appointment, have nothing that I'd care to judge him on. Good luck to the guy. All my posts have referred to Lansdown and the kind of manager he prefers to work with. That's it. 

[tin]

14 hours ago, Cidre Monita said:

LM said on the local news that he’s been coaching for 18 years, so effectively since he was 20. Did he never play professional football? Got to be honest I’ve never heard of him. It sounds like we have appointed him off of the back of a couple of good months at Oxford. I’m interested to know what the Lansdowns do next if this doesn’t work out. I think we will go down the foreign route followed by a Nigel Pearson type to get us out of trouble. 

I hope the Lansdowns, and Tinnion, all resign if we fail to make the top six. They’ve been very open about that being the goal and in some ways I feel for Manning working under that pressure, and for Nige who had to deal with that. 

This is not “the best squad we’ve had in my time here”, nor do “we have a top-10 budget” as spuriously claimed by JL last week. But these are the goals set for Manning and if he doesn’t achieve them, the board needs to be accountable. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Spud21 said:

As someone who was "literally" there and by thst I mean in the same place as SL, JL and BT on I think the day it was either announced or damn near close to it (fans forum game was at AG on that day, between us and Rovers) , we asked BT before (I think, was a long while ago) the game if it was going to be him and although he didn't directly it was obvious. 

That is absolutely not how I remember it, now did Tinnion use his position to "weasle" into the job maybe, I can't say I have any inside knowledge on that, but why would he need to undermine Wilson the man rocked up to a playoff final with our best player sat on his arse, absolutely everyone I knew wanted him gone to a man, from the minute we left the Millennium stadium. 

That doesn't mean that appointing Tinnion was the right move, could have been a case of right man wrong time, as there needed to be a massive culture change from the players being on the piss all the time (we used to see, Phillips, Peacock, Coles et all every week out in town all the time) and appointing a rookie into that was not a decision that made sense, needed a GJ type to come in at that point. 

I cannot fathom any similarities between the two periods, when Wilson left he was not popular, the culture at the club was an absolute disgrace and we appointed someone with no managerial expirience who was very much even though on the periphery a part of that culture. 

As per my post, I wasn’t there and only reflecting on the current view of the history….which as we know isn’t always the same as what happened at the time!

[Sheltons Army]

57 minutes ago, tin said:

I hope the Lansdowns, and Tinnion, all resign if we fail to make the top six. They’ve been very open about that being the goal and in some ways I feel for Manning working under that pressure, and for Nige who had to deal with that. 

This is not “the best squad we’ve had in my time here”, nor do “we have a top-10 budget” as spuriously claimed by JL last week. But these are the goals set for Manning and if he doesn’t achieve them, the board needs to be accountable. 

I’m up there with any as angry at NPs dismissal , particularly the cowardly way it was done 

And Manning - It fits the modern Current  trend of a young up and coming almost professor type coach , I knew little about him and like most have been catching up on him and his CV - I’m not sure what to think and you could take evidence from his career that is positive or negative - I do think it’s a roll of a dice and of course I hope he succeeds.

I can see the theory of going with someone they think is a good progressive coach.

It doesn’t , and won’t , change my view on the Lansdowns , or Tinnion , or what they’ve done

But

I think it’s unfair on Manning to demand a top six finish

All I shall look for , as with any manager or head coach is - Is there evidence he is building something and improving us with a clear plan

As someone with no experience at this level and a Footballing support network within the Club , certainly the top end , virtually non existent , its a big ask and I wish him genuinely good luck

[red panda]

2 hours ago, tin said:

I hope the Lansdowns, and Tinnion, all resign if we fail to make the top six. They’ve been very open about that being the goal and in some ways I feel for Manning working under that pressure, and for Nige who had to deal with that. 

This is not “the best squad we’ve had in my time here”, nor do “we have a top-10 budget” as spuriously claimed by JL last week. But these are the goals set for Manning and if he doesn’t achieve them, the board needs to be accountable. 

Err ... I'm not quite sure an owner can simply "resign", and we might have something of a cashflow problem if they did.

[Superjack]

1 hour ago, red panda said:

Err ... I'm not quite sure an owner can simply "resign", and we might have something of a cashflow problem if they did.

Well, he virtually has already. 

He just hasn't left yet. More's the pity.

[tin]

1 hour ago, red panda said:

Err ... I'm not quite sure an owner can simply "resign", and we might have something of a cashflow problem if they did.

I couldn’t care less. They have long overstayed their welcome and need to go regardless. There’s no turning around my feelings towards them. Snakes and liars, the lot of them.

[reddoh]

18 hours ago, Superjack said:

Well, he virtually has already. 

He just hasn't left yet. More's the pity.

He's not sure where light switch is