Liam Manning first 5 games- hopes and expectations?

[Mr Popodopolous]

Maybe it is too early I dunno.

The first 5 games are..

QPR Away

Middlesbrough Home

Southampton Away

Norwich Home

Huddersfield Away

[Malago]

If Pearson were in charge I’d expect us to beat QPR and Hudds and pick up a point from one of the other 3 games, so 7 points would be acceptable imo.

[Mr Popodopolous]

We got 8 from those last year. However I am inclined to agree albeit Norwich have been in some terrible form of late.

[ExiledAjax]

He needs 1.7 PPG if the squad is to match "top 6" expectations.

So that's 8.5 points, rounded up to 9...which you've not put as an option!!!

So I vote 5-8.

Edited November 10, 2023 by ExiledAjax

[W-S-M Seagull]

At the bare minimum and equal ppg as Pearson had. 

Although with injured players returning maybe that expectation should be slightly higher?

But then it's also worth remembering that under Pearson we have played 6 of the top 7.

Edited November 10, 2023 by W-S-M Seagull

[Mr Popodopolous]

That was oddly remiss of me EA, should I have put 0-5 and 6-10 then Over 10?

Edited November 10, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Silvio Dante]

I haven’t voted but just to note that I think what he needs in view of the circumstances are at the very least a decent performance and not to lose at QPR, and the same against Middlesbrough. More than any appointment I can recall, the start for Liam is vital. 
 

Im not sure I see it as he needs x points from those 5 games. But I do think the first two games are huge.

1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

That was oddly remiss of me EA, should I have put 0-5 and 6-10 then 10+?

Technically 0-5, 6-10 and >10 as on that distribution you’ve given 10 as an option twice

#pedantic

[LondonBristolian]

Frustrated though I am by the manager change, I'm not going to judge Manning purely on a points total but obviously it would be a big help for settling us all if he got points on the board. I think, from the perspective of keeping supporters onside and avoiding people getting skittish, he could do with 4 points from QPR and Boro and at least 2 or 3 points from Saints, Norwich and Huddersfield so I'm putting 5 - 8. 

What I want to see is whether he can keep the positives from Pearson - the work ethic, the difficulty in breaking us down, the comfort on the ball - and improve on the areas where we weren't quite there - which, for me, were decision making at both ends of the pitch plus our ability to create chances.

[Lew-T]

21 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

and improve on the areas where we weren't quite there - which, for me, were decision making at both ends of the pitch plus our ability to create chances.

That’s what I’m looking for too.

I’m hoping Manning can add something to Mehmeti’s game to make him flourish. There is something there.

And get Bell back to his best!

[bcfc01]

9 I think, so unable to vote..

[robinforlife2]

6 I think would be the minimum we should expect from those games. There's only one of those 5 I think we would struggle to get a result from, and that's Southampton away. 3 draws and a win, the minimum expectation from the other four. 

[Roger Red Hat]

16 points.

[Spud21]

1 minute ago, robinforlife2 said:

6 I think would be the minimum we should expect from those games. There's only one of those 5 I think we would struggle to get a result from, and that's Southampton away. 3 draws and a win, the minimum expectation from the other four. 

Are boro not on a rather good run at the moment? Won 5 of their last 6 or something? And we are hardly good at home so easily a game we could take nothing from. 

However I don't think 5/6 points is an unreasonable expectation. I will be happy with a few decent performances for the minute. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

6 minutes ago, Spud21 said:

Are boro not on a rather good run at the moment? Won 5 of their last 6 or something? And we are hardly good at home so easily a game we could take nothing from. 

However I don't think 5/6 points is an unreasonable expectation. I will be happy with a few decent performances for the minute. 

Lost to Stoke, drew with Plymouth. Had a terrible start but form has been good since. Perhaps a point there.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Nomad]

9 for me. 3 wins.

[johnbytheriver]

I hope we do well,but i have low expectations

 

[Spud21]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Lost to Stoke, drew with Plymouth. Had a terrible start but form has been good  since.

Ah new they lost to stoke, draw with Plymouth is not a bad result depending on the Plymouth that turned up, yea they have picked up and are now performing somewhere near where they would expected to be. 

[winsaw]

Based on what the management of the club have stated they expect then we need to be taking 9-10 points from these games , I was expecting the Pearson team to take 7 points so we need to take more than that ore there was no point in the change, I voted for 10 as 9 wasn't an option 

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, Spud21 said:

Ah new they lost to stoke, draw with Plymouth is not a bad result depending on the Plymouth that turned up, yea they have picked up and are now performing somewhere near where they would expected to be. 

Next to us in the table...albeit our first 7 games were much better.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[RollsRoyce]

10 plus easily. They have an international break after this weekend, so they will head into the subsequent games without being deconditioned and having had lots of on-the-grass training. We have a top 6 squad, so will need 10 points from 5 games to reach that target. 

[RobinTuga]

3 minutes ago, Spud21 said:

Are boro not on a rather good run at the moment? Won 5 of their last 6 or something? And we are hardly good at home so easily a game we could take nothing from. 

However I don't think 5/6 points is an unreasonable expectation. I will be happy with a few decent performances for the minute. 

Last two they lost to Stoke and drew with Argyle but prior to that they were on a 6 game win streak. Before the Stoke game their last defeat was in mid-September against Blackburn. Would be happy picking up any points on that one.

Think QPR and Huddersfield are the must wins here for sure and I'd argue in their current form Norwich should be as well, no wins in the last 6 and 5 losses (and we'll see if Wagner makes it until then).

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, RobinTuga said:

Last two they lost to Stoke and drew with Argyle but prior to that they were on a 6 game win streak. Before the Stoke game their last defeat was in mid-September against Blackburn. Would be happy picking up any points on that one.

Think QPR and Huddersfield are the must wins here for sure and I'd argue in their current form Norwich should be as well, no wins in the last 6 and 5 losses (and we'll see if Wagner makes it until then).

 

A point v Middlesbrough would be perfectly acceptable IMO. Maybe we lose.

[W-S-M Seagull]

3 minutes ago, RollsRoyce said:

10 plus easily. They have an international break after this weekend, so they will head into the subsequent games without being deconditioned and having had lots of on-the-grass training. We have a top 6 squad, so will need 10 points from 5 games to reach that target. 

Its almost as if Jon Lansdown wrote this.

[Spud21]

2 minutes ago, RobinTuga said:

Last two they lost to Stoke and drew with Argyle but prior to that they were on a 6 game win streak. Before the Stoke game their last defeat was in mid-September against Blackburn. Would be happy picking up any points on that one.

Think QPR and Huddersfield are the must wins here for sure and I'd argue in their current form Norwich should be as well, no wins in the last 6 and 5 losses (and we'll see if Wagner makes it until then).

 

Yea I am probably on the same page in thinking QPR and Hudds are the 2 thst we should be targeting wins from, yea I don't think Norwich will be in the same place as now in terms of manager so they are somewhat of an unknown. 

[Street red]

5 minutes ago, RollsRoyce said:

10 plus easily. They have an international break after this weekend, so they will head into the subsequent games without being deconditioned and having had lots of on-the-grass training. We have a top 6 squad, so will need 10 points from 5 games to reach that target. 

Hello Jon 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Hi one for a mod.

Is it possible to add in 9 to my poll retrospectively? I botched one part of it.

[Davefevs]

I’m not playing….one game at a time.

(sorry, boring)

[Engvall’s Splinter]

42 minutes ago, Lew-T said:

That’s what I’m looking for too.

I’m hoping Manning can add something to Mehmeti’s game to make him flourish. There is something there.

And get Bell back to his best!

As we know with most youngsters, consistency and form can go up and down. Sam Bell has had a few off games. Pearson would’ve got him back to his best. 
 

Im in the, “Manning needs to encouraging performances and circa 9pts” camp. 

Edited November 10, 2023 by Engvall’s Splinter

[The Original OTIB]

1 hour ago, ExiledAjax said:

He needs 1.7 PPG if the squad is to match "top 6" expectations.

So that's 8.5 points, rounded up to 9...which you've not put as an option!!!

So I vote 5-8.

Nearer 1.75 I'd say this year on games left, per other thread.

[ciderwood]

Can't compare to NP our team is different so are the others who knows Answer is nobody ! All we can hope for is a steady improvement and the fans to give him a fair crack

[ExiledAjax]

31 minutes ago, The Original OTIB said:

Nearer 1.75 I'd say this year on games left, per other thread.

If you're talking about finishing in the top 6 then I agree it's looking like a high bar this season and 21+(31*1.7) is 74 (rounded up), which would often be enough, but could well fall short this season.

Personally though I'd say if he achieves "standard comfortable" top 6 performance and returns - basically 1.7 per game - then for me that meets the expectations that have been set and buys him a ticket for 2024/25. But that's just my personal interpretation of the expectations.

And this is limiting the discussion to points only, which isn't really how he should be judged of course, but it's the language the Club have used so let's entertain it for conversation's sake!

Edited November 10, 2023 by ExiledAjax

[BCFC Rich]

1 hour ago, Lew-T said:

That’s what I’m looking for too.

I’m hoping Manning can add something to Mehmeti’s game to make him flourish. There is something there.

And get Bell back to his best!

Interestingly sounds like he was planning to try and get him on loan for Oxford in January. - https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/liam-manning-transfer-bristol-city-8896998

[formerly known as ivan]

Anything less than 9 points would be disappointing for a team looking for promotion this season. Wins vs QPR, Norwich and Middlesbrough and loss to Southampton.

[elhombrecito]

As much as still wish NP was manager, and by default that means I don't approve of Manning's appointment, I don't think he "needs" anything really, as it would be very unfair on a new manager to come in and get judged on points only over such a short space of time.

[ralphindevon]

Depends how many days off they get during the international break

I've put 8, hoping for 9 plus but would take 8

Edited November 10, 2023 by ralphindevon

[ORANGE500]

1 hour ago, johnbytheriver said:

I hope we do well,but i have low expectations

 

Why?

[GlastonburyRed]

3 minutes ago, ORANGE500 said:

Why?

Cause we are Bristol City FC.

[Bris Red]

Really there shouldn't be any 'pressure' on manner as such in the first few games but it's naive to think pressure won't mount considerably quickly if we don't get off to a good start. That has nothing to do with Manning and everything to do with the situation the owners have put him in IMO.

I think for everyones sake 5-8 points would be a decent return and anything more would be a bonus, really hoping we do as i cannot stand this club and going down to Ashton Gate when the atmosphere is toxic..

Edited November 10, 2023 by Bris Red

[joe jordans teeth]

I bloody love the optimism on here coyr 

[joe jordans teeth]

48 minutes ago, ralphindevon said:

Depends how many days off they get during the international break

I've put 8, hoping for 9 plus but would take 8

As have I what would be about right under pearson,if we end up with the 0-4 points something has gone horribly wrong 

[Red-Robbo]

2 hours ago, Spreadsheet Boy said:

I’m not playing….one game at a time.

(sorry, boring)

And too early to tell. 

Imagine doing it to Nigel Pearson. 12 points from his first 15 games.

 

[cidercity1987]

After tomorrow we will have played the top three (LLL) and the bottom three (WWW I hope) so ultimately at best Pearson lost his job simply due to the timing of fixtures.

Then after the break we play a load of generally midtable teams until Christmas which will make or break our season and I expect Manning to win more than he loses to go someway to justifying the change

[Fordy62]

This is weird isn’t it? I’m not sure we’ve ever been in this position before or are likely to be again. 

A new manager has come in when the reality is we didn’t need one. The team were playing fine. They were playing for the manager and we were all reasonably happy. It’s always the case that we’ve been playing on the poor side when a new manager comes in, so there really isn’t a new manager bounce for us to hope for as there normally is.  So realistically what am I to want? I don’t know. Do I realistically think LM can come in and step us up a gear or two? I’m not sure that’s possible… I just hope he does well but I am very very worried… and if you’re wondering why… just see Birmingham*
 

 

*NB I realise that there are a 101 reasons why we’re not comparable with B’ham, mainly because Manning appears to be there on merit, but the changing managers when you don’t need to us such a massive gamble. 
 

edit: to answer the question, I’m going to say I’ll be really disappointed with fewer than 7. 

Edited November 10, 2023 by Fordy62

[RedReg]

9 points or give the job back to a qualified manager

[Red white and red]

We are a team aiming for promotion according to the ‘Chairman’. Any promotion team would need to be winning 4 of these games. Any less than 12 points would be a failure. Jon Lansdown does not understand that we are a mid-table side at best. Odious man. 

[Fordy62]

I can’t help but feel JL has set up a poisoned chalice for LM here. And I wonder if to save face the Lansdowns May attempt to buy themselves out of it in the January window. We’ll see. 

[Edgy Red]

I liked Nige and thought he did a number of positive things during his time in charge but i have to be honest and admit that i wasn't as devastated by his departure as the majority of our fanbase were.

I'm hoping Manning can get us playing a more fluid posession based game. Nige certainly made us organised but i was never convinced by us from an attacking perspective.

I appreciate that its difficult to find the perfect balance between defence and attack but ultimately i'd like to be entertained when i watch us play.

Manning deserves time to implement his style on the squad and i'm excited to see what he can do.

[Kibs]

1 hour ago, Fordy62 said:

This is weird isn’t it? I’m not sure we’ve ever been in this position before or are likely to be again. 

A new manager has come in when the reality is we didn’t need one. The team were playing fine. They were playing for the manager and we were all reasonably happy. It’s always the case that we’ve been playing on the poor side when a new manager comes in, so there really isn’t a new manager bounce for us to hope for as there normally is.  So realistically what am I to want? I don’t know. Do I realistically think LM can come in and step us up a gear or two? I’m not sure that’s possible… I just hope he does well but I am very very worried… and if you’re wondering why… just see Birmingham*
 

 

*NB I realise that there are a 101 reasons why we’re not comparable with B’ham, mainly because Manning appears to be there on merit, but the changing managers when you don’t need to us such a massive gamble. 
 

edit: to answer the question, I’m going to say I’ll be really disappointed with fewer than 7. 

I think we were “doing fine” in the grand scheme of things, but It had been a pretty poor run up to his sacking (mitigating circumstances granted).

Even the more recent wins had not been good performances. For me, the second half against Ipswich and perhaps the Stoke game are the only decent “performances” in the last 7 or 8 games - and we lost both!

I think Pearson had us pretty much exactly where we should be with the resources he had available, and I really struggle to see how anyone is going to improve that without a fair bit of investment.…..so I suppose my expectations of Manning are pretty low, and I’m a bit worried he’s on a hiding to nothing!!!

 

[The Original OTIB]

28 minutes ago, Fordy62 said:

I can’t help but feel JL has set up a poisoned chalice for LM here. And I wonder if to save face the Lansdowns May attempt to buy themselves out of it in the January window. We’ll see. 

There's the rub. 

[REDOXO]

Pearson was fired because we were not challenging (5 points off the play offs with a dozen first teamers injured) 

Manning was brought in to “correct” that. If Manning doesn’t get a really good start everyone at the club is going to get twitchy. Manning needs a minimum of nine for JL excuses to look in anyway credible so I’m hoping for ten and above. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Pearson was fired because we were not challenging (5 points off the play offs with a dozen first teamers injured) 

Manning was brought in to “correct” that. If Manning doesn’t get a really good start everyone at the club is going to get twitchy. Manning needs a minimum of nine for JL excuses to look in anyway credible so I’m hoping for ten and above. 

Yes totally agree on this. The hierarchy have a bit resting on this appointment, if it does wrong or we go sharply backwards..their credibility could plummet.

I was thinking 8 but 9 also seems reasonable.

[Bobtherobin]

Im expecting front-foot, fast-paced exciting football that is played on 'the grass' and takes us into the top 6. 

[The Original OTIB]

16 minutes ago, Ryan said:

Im expecting front-foot, fast-paced exciting football that is played on 'the grass' and takes us into the top 6. 

Indeed, and the erstwhile invisible and mute men at the top doing Ashton/Swiss Tony runs dow the touchline, fists a pumping and high fiving all and sundry. The odd interview as well, as the glory story unfolds.

Edited November 10, 2023 by The Original OTIB

[The Original OTIB]

4 hours ago, ExiledAjax said:

If you're talking about finishing in the top 6 then I agree it's looking like a high bar this season and 21+(31*1.7) is 74 (rounded up), which would often be enough, but could well fall short this season.

Personally though I'd say if he achieves "standard comfortable" top 6 performance and returns - basically 1.7 per game - then for me that meets the expectations that have been set and buys him a ticket for 2024/25. But that's just my personal interpretation of the expectations.

And this is limiting the discussion to points only, which isn't really how he should be judged of course, but it's the language the Club have used so let's entertain it for conversation's sake!

The remit has come from on high. Until they change their mind again, of course.

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 hours ago, ciderwood said:

Can't compare to NP our team is different so are the others who knows Answer is nobody ! All we can hope for is a steady improvement and the fans to give him a fair crack

LM will he inheriting a solid base, hopefully coming through the worst of the injuries.

He my have a different style but if we are slow, at point does acceptable transition morph into concern at stalling or regression, for you?

[Ian M]

5 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Hi one for a mod.

Is it possible to add in 9 to my poll retrospectively? I botched one part of it.

I edited 10 and above to say 9 and above. And then voted for that. Top 6 squad, international break giving our new coach time to get his ideas across, returning players before the 5 games are up, I reckon W3 D1 L1

[Mr Popodopolous]

20 minutes ago, Ian M said:

I edited 10 and above to say 9 and above. And then voted for that. Top 6 squad, international break giving our new coach time to get his ideas across, returning players before the 5 games are up, I reckon W3 D1 L1

Cheers for that Ian- and yes 9 or above, let's be ambitious.

Let's be positive.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Kibs]

We need to find a way to score more goals if we’re to accumulate a good return of points. Been a real struggle lately. 

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 hour ago, Ian M said:

I edited 10 and above to say 9 and above. And then voted for that. Top 6 squad, international break giving our new coach time to get his ideas across, returning players before the 5 games are up, I reckon W3 D1 L1

My concern is that it seems the players are not going to be given any time off over the international break and they will instead work on the tactical stuff etc. 

That's fine but after the resumption of the league it's then a relentless schedule until the next international break in March. Lots of Saturday-midweek games. They may well have had 9 days off at the last break but now they will be going Oct-March without a break and no guarantee of them being given one at the next international break either.

But this is an instruction from above so if our small squad begins to pick up injuries in that long period, they have to take responsibility for that.

Edited November 10, 2023 by W-S-M Seagull

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

My concern is that it seems the players are not going to be given any time off over the international break and they will instead work on the tactical stuff etc. 

 

Knight, Sykes, Conway, Bell all gonna be missing.  Has Mehmeti been called up, I haven’t seen?

Plus the injured players - King, Wells, Williams, McCrorie, Roberts, is gonna make tactical detailing pretty difficult  you’d imagine.

[Alessandro]

1 hour ago, Spreadsheet Boy said:

Knight, Sykes, Conway, Bell all gonna be missing.  Has Mehmeti been called up, I haven’t seen?

Plus the injured players - King, Wells, Williams, McCrorie, Roberts, is gonna make tactical detailing pretty difficult  you’d imagine.

Forget working on tactics during the international break….just hope he’s done his research and doesn’t give the remaining players any time off……

[tin]

9 hours ago, REDOXO said:

Pearson was fired because we were not challenging (5 points off the play offs with a dozen first teamers injured) 

Manning was brought in to “correct” that. If Manning doesn’t get a really good start everyone at the club is going to get twitchy. Manning needs a minimum of nine for JL excuses to look in anyway credible so I’m hoping for ten and above. 

Exactly this. 

The club lead us to believe he has more of a fit squad than Nige had, and this squad “is the best in my time here” according to JL.

The board expect promotion and we need to up our PPG to do that, so I expect to beat QPR, Huddersfield and Norwich, and gain a point from the other two games. A minimum of 10 from 15. 

[formerly known as ivan]

14 hours ago, Bris Red said:

Really there shouldn't be any 'pressure' on manner as such in the first few games but it's naive to think pressure won't mount considerably quickly if we don't get off to a good start. That has nothing to do with Manning and everything to do with the situation the owners have put him in IMO.

I think for everyones sake 5-8 points would be a decent return and anything more would be a bonus, really hoping we do as i cannot stand this club and going down to Ashton Gate when the atmosphere is toxic..

There is lots of pressure on Manning but not because of the fans. It comes from the comments our board have made over the last couple of weeks. Manning has a squad capable of promotion according to them, and was the man identified by them to take us to the next level. Any level of expectation has been set well and truly by the board.

Edited November 11, 2023 by formerly known as ivan

[Davefevs]

11 minutes ago, formerly known as ivan said:

There is lots of pressure on Manning but not because of the fans. It comes from the comments our board have made over the last couple of weeks. Manning has a squad capable of promotion according to them, and was the man identified by them to take us to the next level. Any level of expectation has been set well and truly by the board.

Agee, agree, agree.

I do think there is pressure on Manning because you don’t often get to take over a team like Bristol City in a healthy position.  It’s a bit like Rooney, coming in to Brum in a top half position, with the fans happy with Eustace.  It’s a different pressure coming into a struggling side where the mantra is often “make them hard to beat”, “sort the defence out”, etc.  with City / Manning it’s more try to turn more of those draws into wins, score a few more goals, play a bit more attractive football which is very different isn’t it.

I do laugh when I hear a certain podcast contributor prattle on along the line of criticising Nige for not improving us / results by focusing on wins, ie he’s not improved us because he’s only won 15 games each season.

20/21 W15 D6 L25 P51 GD -22 (part Holden)

21/22 W15 D10 L21 P55 GD -15

22/23 W15 D14 L17 P59 GD -1

It’s clear he has, and very selective to pick on a single thing to form your agenda.  You can certainly argue whether progress was quick enough.

And if we do pick up under Manning this season, it’s perfectly fine to praise Manning and also praise Nige for handing over the club in a good position.  We don’t have to make it so “good v evil”.

[Mr Popodopolous]

4 points 4 games.

A point will scrape us to par, albeit from the equivalent fixtures last year we are 3 points and-3 in GD worse off.

[petehinton]

1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

4 points 4 games.

A point will scrape us to par, albeit from the equivalent fixtures last year we are 3 points and-3 in GD worse off.

4 points, 4 games, 4 goals scored, 5 conceded - all of which in the second half. 
 

About as ‘meh’ as can be

[bearded_red]

If a coach being ‘on the grass’ produces football this ******* dull, give me back the bloke with the bad back who sat in his office at the training ground.

[Pezo]

8 minutes ago, petehinton said:

4 points, 4 games, 4 goals scored, 5 conceded - all of which in the second half. 
 

About as ‘meh’ as can be

About as some destroying as can be.

What ever Manning is doing at half time clearly is having a negative affect on everything.

[petehinton]

8 minutes ago, bearded_red said:

If a coach being ‘on the grass’ produces football this ******* dull, give me back the bloke with the bad back who sat in his office at the training ground.

Said at the time, their rhetoric of ‘young, progressive, on the grass coach’ that they doubled down on made no sense to them. They kept harping on about it in every PR push, but they seem to forget that fans literally couldn’t care less about that. It’s not as if we’re there training with them. 

[exAtyeoMax]

3 minutes ago, petehinton said:

Said at the time, their rhetoric of ‘young, progressive, on the grass coach’ that they doubled down on made no sense to them. They kept harping on about it in every PR push, but they seem to forget that fans literally couldn’t care less about that. It’s not as if we’re there training with them. 

exactly! I would expect our technical director/CEO/DoF to know though…