Bolton or Oxford? Oxford Promoted

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

29 minutes ago, Barrs Court Red said:

I went there when we had to beat them to not end the day 24th. Last time we played them in the league? 

I was there that day as well.

1-0 to us, can’t remember who scored but it ended a bad run for us. 3 months later we were up to 5th (iirc) after beating the Gas 2 days before Christmas.

 

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Awaits more insults. 

Perhaps you should try addressing the questions asked instead of finding excuses.

[Barrs Court Red]

8 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

I was there that day as well.

1-0 to us, can’t remember who scored but it ended a bad run for us. 3 months later we were up to 5th (iirc) after beating the Gas 2 days before Christmas.

 

Wow I honestly wouldn’t have put those games in the same season! 

[Major Isewater]

Tough sheet Bolton.

[North London Red]

44 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Yeah, 2000. Murray winner.

Their GK got pelted with bottles of piss from the away terrace all afternoon.

Denis Smith was their manager that day, and if memory serves the home fans made their displeasure with his tenure pretty clear. He resigned a couple of days after our win there.

Will be nice to see City at a new ground next season. Think Forest Green in the league cup was probably the last ‘new’ ground we played at (counting competitive games only). 

Edit: forgot about West Ham this season! That would obviously be the most recent ground we played at for the first time 

Edited May 18 by North London Red

[W-S-M Seagull]

50 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Thank you!

I can see why they call you bird brain now @W-S-M Seagull 

You have a thing with calling posters thick don't you? Seen you do it quite a few times. Is everything ok? 

You made reference to 25 years to make it sound better than it is. Don't know why you couldn't have just said 15 of the last 25 years. 

 

[eardun]

3 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

You have a thing with calling posters thick don't you? Seen you do it quite a few times. Is everything ok? 

You made reference to 25 years to make it sound better than it is. Don't know why you couldn't have just said 15 of the last 25 years. 

 

He said 

“for us who have been in the Championship for most of the past 25 years”

which is 100% accurate. 15 out of 25 is most by some margin (60%). 

[Charlie BCFC]

Why does every thread on here turn into a Manning v Pearson debate? 
 

Oxford executed their game plan perfectly and deserved to win, interested to see what they bring next season. The games between us should definitely be interesting 

[grifty]

1 hour ago, formerly known as ivan said:

Two cracking away days for next season added in Portsmouth and Oxford.

Went to the Manor Ground in the mid-nineties when they were in financial trouble. Will look forward to another visit in whatever ground they are playing in.

Didn’t you do a big ‘look at me’ topic about how bad ‘Manningball’ was after the Stoke game and you weren’t going to bother for a couple of years?

That didn’t last long! 

[formerly known as ivan]

Just now, grifty said:

Didn’t you do a big ‘look at me’ topic about how bad ‘Manningball’ was after the Stoke game and you weren’t going to bother for a couple of years?

That didn’t last long! 

Haha, fairs. Manningball is bad but not bad enough to miss a good away day.

My issue is with the owners, which was the main reason for not renewing my season.

[exAtyeoMax]

12 minutes ago, Charlie BCFC said:

Why does every thread on here turn into a Manning v Pearson debate? 
 

Oxford executed their game plan perfectly and deserved to win, interested to see what they bring next season. The games between us should definitely be interesting 

It hasn't! 

[Kid in the Riot]

31 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

You have a thing with calling posters thick don't you? Seen you do it quite a few times. Is everything ok? 

You made reference to 25 years to make it sound better than it is. Don't know why you couldn't have just said 15 of the last 25 years. 

So as you have appeared to have worked out what the word "most" means, are you going to apologise for being wrong?? 

Thought not!

[W-S-M Seagull]

2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

So as you have appeared to have worked out what the word "most" means, are you going to apologise for being wrong?? 

Thought not!

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? 

[Kid in the Riot]

Just now, W-S-M Seagull said:

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

 

[Lewisdabaron]

3 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? 

Even 13 would be “most” were you bottom class at maths in school? Thicko. 

[JBFC II]

4 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? 

There's nothing to agree with, we've spent most of our seasons in the championship this century.

It's not an opinion thing, you're just in the wrong on this one

[Northern Red]

Jesus wept.

[Ronnie Sinclair]

Please go to bed FFS

[Jerseybean]

7 hours ago, Jerseybean said:

Yep I’m supporting Oxford today although I think Bolton will win.

How wrong was I! 

[The Fat Controller]

Just now, Jerseybean said:

How wrong was I! 

Mostly, I'd say. 

[ExiledAjax]

Oxford is a city famous for being a crucible of academic mathematical debate and discovery.

I'm glad that OTIB is contributing to that.

[Jerseybean]

3 hours ago, Kodjias Wrist said:

Just had a peek at the Oxford forum. “Thank God Manning left “ 

Des Buckingham joined the U’s as head coach part way through the season when Liam Manning left for us - and the trajectory the club have been on since is immense.

Since his arrival in November, the former Mumbai City boss has guided his hometown club to a spot in the play-offs on the final day of the season when they moved up two places to finish fifth.

Yet it was their previous match against Bolton - when Buckingham's side suffered a chastening 5-0 defeat at the Toughsheet Community Stadium in March - that proved to be the impetus they needed.

That loss kick-started an overwhelming upturn in form as they won by four or more goals in three consecutive games in April.

With plans for a new stadium on the horizon, the club will be hoping that promotion to the Championship - with the backing of over 30,000 supporters at Wembley - is a reason to be optimistic about what the future will look like for the U's.

They have not played in English football's second tier since the turn of the millennium, when it was then called Division One in 1999.

The club narrowly missed out on promotion behind closed doors in 2020 against Wycombe Wanderers but put their recent heartache behind them.

[W-S-M Seagull]

16 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

There's nothing to agree with, we've spent most of our seasons in the championship this century.

It's not an opinion thing, you're just in the wrong on this one

In your opinion. 

Say we spent 15 of the 25 million we got for Scott. I wouldn't class that as us spending most of it. Maybe you would, I wouldn't. Fair enough. 

Edited May 18 by W-S-M Seagull

[W-S-M Seagull]

16 minutes ago, Lewisdabaron said:

Even 13 would be “most” were you bottom class at maths in school? Thicko. 

I'd rather be a thicko than a person that goes on a Internet forum and insults people. Stay classy! 

[JBFC II]

Just now, W-S-M Seagull said:

In your opinion. 

Say we spent 15 of the 25 million we got for Scott. I wouldn't class that as us spending most of it. Maybe you would, I wouldn't. Fair enough. 

It's not an opinion though?

It's a mathematical fact, there's nothing opinion about it.

If we spent 60% of the money we made on Scott then we would have spent the majority of it.

How do you cope during elections? You must go through agony seeing people's 'opinions' on who has the majority of the votes!

[Malvern Red]

41 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? 

Maybe Bob Dylan can settle the debate 

 

[Hxj]

15 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

It's a mathematical fact, there's nothing opinion about it.

Daring to jump into a pointless debate, I'd like to point out that 'most' has multiple definitions in English.  The context is vital.

Most can mean 'the majority' or it can mean 'almost all'.

'Fred received the most votes.' 'Most Bristolians are City fans'

 

[Lewisdabaron]

27 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I'd rather be a thicko than a person that goes on a Internet forum and insults people. Stay classy! 

At last you admit you were wrong, even though it took an insult for you realise. 

[JBFC II]

9 minutes ago, Hxj said:

Daring to jump into a pointless debate, I'd like to point out that 'most' has multiple definitions in English.  The context is vital.

Most can mean 'the majority' or it can mean 'almost all'.

'Fred received the most votes.' 'Most Bristolians are City fans'

 

Within the context here it's a mathematical fact though, in spite of @W-S-M Seagulland his 'opinions'.

As you say it's all meaningless, it's a shame said poster has derailed this thread because what was posted didn't suit their agenda

[chinapig]

37 minutes ago, Jerseybean said:

 

Des Buckingham joined the U’s as head coach part way through the season when Liam Manning left for us - and the trajectory the club have been on since is immense.

Since his arrival in November, the former Mumbai City boss has guided his hometown club to a spot in the play-offs on the final day of the season when they moved up two places to finish fifth.

Yet it was their previous match against Bolton - when Buckingham's side suffered a chastening 5-0 defeat at the Toughsheet Community Stadium in March - that proved to be the impetus they needed.

That loss kick-started an overwhelming upturn in form as they won by four or more goals in three consecutive games in April.

With plans for a new stadium on the horizon, the club will be hoping that promotion to the Championship - with the backing of over 30,000 supporters at Wembley - is a reason to be optimistic about what the future will look like for the U's.

They have not played in English football's second tier since the turn of the millennium, when it was then called Division One in 1999.

The club narrowly missed out on promotion behind closed doors in 2020 against Wycombe Wanderers but put their recent heartache behind them.

From The Guardian report:

Intriguingly, Liam Manning, Buckingham’s predecessor, did not fancy Murphy one iota and the winger did not start a league match until the pre-Christmas game of musical coaches. He has flourished since.

Perhaps Murphy was too emotional, behaviours-wise.

[Hxj]

4 minutes ago, JBFC II said:

Within the context here it's a mathematical fact though

The trouble is that you are both right and both wrong.  The wonder of the English language is that context is all important, although in this context I'd be happier arguing against your view.

[JBFC II]

20 minutes ago, Hxj said:

The trouble is that you are both right and both wrong.  The wonder of the English language is that context is all important, although in this context I'd be happier arguing against your view.

Fair enough, I struggle to see a context in which 15 seasons in the championship out of 25 doesn’t constitute ‘most’ of our time this decade but I may just be missing something!

[Red Cloud]

1 hour ago, ExiledAjax said:

Oxford is a city famous for being a crucible of academic mathematical debate and discovery.

I'm glad that OTIB is contributing to that.

Oxford was but these days "debate" is the last thing they're interested in

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

In your opinion. 

Say we spent 15 of the 25 million we got for Scott. I wouldn't class that as us spending most of it. Maybe you would, I wouldn't. Fair enough. 

If we spent £12.5m and one penny of the £25m for Scott we would have spent most of it.

 

It would be by the smallest possible amount, but it would be "most".

 

This is literally the type of thing children learn at about 6 years old.

[RedLionLad]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? 

Something doesn't add up here...

[Bar BS3]

2 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? 

If the alternative total can't  possibly more than the amount in question, then how is it anything other than the most..?

To nor agree with a basic mathematical fact only shows complete ignorance on your part.

Some things come down to one's opinions - this isn't one of those things & you are wrong. 

[sugarwray]

1 hour ago, Hxj said:

Daring to jump into a pointless debate, I'd like to point out that 'most' has multiple definitions in English.  The context is vital.

Most can mean 'the majority' or it can mean 'almost all'.

'Fred received the most votes.' 'Most Bristolians are City fans'

 

Most Bristolians are not emotionally committed football fans. Of the minority that are, City fans outnumber Rovers fans. 

[pillred]

5 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

Not sure it was their choice to move. Thought the lease has ended ( due to end) and Kassam is refusing to renew it.

What the hell will they do with it now though, a case of cutting your nose off to spite your face?

[fgrsimon]

6 minutes ago, pillred said:

What the hell will they do with it now though, a case of cutting your nose off to spite your face?

Well the new ground is some way off and still far from certain it will get built, so they're stuck at the Kassam for now.

It would be an ok stadium (it's bigger than you'd imagine) but for one huge thing - it's only got 3 sides so any atmosphere sort of drains away. One of their supporters tells me that a temporary stand could be on the cards for next season. Financially it would have to make sense with much larger away followings but let's hope they make a better job of it than the Gas otherwise they'll be back in L1 before its finished and has planning permission....

[Colemanballs]

7 hours ago, JBFC II said:

Fair enough, I struggle to see a context in which 15 seasons in the championship out of 25 doesn’t constitute ‘most’ of our time this decade but I may just be missing something!

You are. 15 seasons does not constitute 'almost all' of 25 seasons which is the reasonable meaning of 'most' given the context in which KITR used it. 

Looking forward to all the apologies to WSM from all those who got it wrong...

Edited May 19 by Colemanballs

[Bar BS3]

54 minutes ago, Colemanballs said:

You are. 15 seasons does not constitute 'almost all' of 25 seasons which is the reasonable meaning of 'most' given the context in which KITR used it. 

Looking forward to all the apologies to WSM from all those who got it wrong...

"Almost all" & "most" can be 2 very different proportions of whatever total you are discussing.

Most - would be anything over 50% ie: can't be more of the alternative.

Almost all - is more subjective, but you'd probably be expecting 90%+

No idea what the initial comment was specifically - but nobody owes WSM an apology for his stating that "15 out of 25 is not most" - because it is. Fact!

[Colemanballs]

23 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

"Almost all" & "most" can be 2 very different proportions of whatever total you are discussing.

Most - would be anything over 50% ie: can't be more of the alternative.

Almost all - is more subjective, but you'd probably be expecting 90%+

No idea what the initial comment was specifically - but nobody owes WSM an apology for his stating that "15 out of 25 is not most" - because it is. Fact!

You are simply wrong.

"The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%."

Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764

 

[Bar BS3]

7 minutes ago, Colemanballs said:

You are simply wrong.

"The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%."

Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764

 

You have just used someone's opinion to back up your belief, rather than the factual.

Mathematically, 15 IS most of 25.

Definition wise - I think quoting the Oxford definition holds more weight than whoever you have quoted. 

MOST - greatest in amount, quantity, or degree.

15 is 60% of 25. That leaves 40% remaining- so no other alternative can exceed that of 15. Therefore 15 is most of 25.

That's not an opinion, it's a fact.

Someone else's interpretation of how many they would regard as most of 25 is irrelevant, because, like it or not - 15 is & always will be most of 25..!

[BCFC Rich]

15 minutes ago, Colemanballs said:

You are simply wrong.

"The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%."

Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764

 

I would call you ridiculous for going to the lengths of finding this paper, but I then read it - So I'm clearly going to the same lengths!  

 

The paper isn't actually saying what you think, it's arguing that when both 'more than half' and 'most' are used in the same piece of writing, maths, or paper then a clear difference is needed - it then attempts to show what the difference might be/at what point 'more than half' becomes 'most' if both are used. 

 

To try and put that more clearly - it looks at the two expressions from an academic point of view and how they could/can be used in Maths and research papers.

It is similar to the use of 'theory' in science - in general the use of the word 'theory' means a hunch or best guess about something, however in science/ research papers it means pretty much the opposite. It means that every piece of evidence has been taken into account and any future evidence should comply with that theory- it means something has been completed tested, thought out, and is backed up - gravity in science is a theory. 

 

[RollsRoyce]

Maning had. a part to play in that promotion, LJ in Sunderland getting promoted too, and Pearson for Leicester winning the Prem.

Equally Manning a good part to play in MK Dons being relegated, LJ in Fleetwood getting relegated and Pearson in Watford being relegated.

Not sure what anyone is trying to make out here. The record books show, Manning and LJ have never got a club promoted. Neil Warnock is so far ahead of them all. 

McKenna has 2 promotions. 

Manning and LJ will struggle to get any team promoted in the next decade for a multitude of reasons, some related to their ability, some well out of their control. Neither are stand out talents like McKenna.

All IMHO. Many will disagree. 

[Colemanballs]

7 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

You have just used someone's opinion to back up your belief, rather than the factual.

Mathematically, 15 IS most of 25.

Definition wise - I think quoting the Oxford definition holds more weight than whoever you have quoted. 

MOST - greatest in amount, quantity, or degree.

15 is 60% of 25. That leaves 40% remaining- so no other alternative can exceed that of 15. Therefore 15 is most of 25.

That's not an opinion, it's a fact.

Someone else's interpretation of how many they would regard as most of 25 is irrelevant, because, like it or not - 15 is & always will be most of 25..!

This is becoming tedious and will be my last post on the subject. According to the Oxford Dictionary, 'most' can mean 'almost all'. In the context which KITR used it, that is the only reasonable meaning. 

From NTTDS's post re: MOTD:

I would prefer if it was shown as two separate matches. Most of us do know the outcome of the games.

Would changing 'most' to 'more than half' change the meaning?

[Nogbad the Bad]

3 hours ago, Colemanballs said:

You are. 15 seasons does not constitute 'almost all' of 25 seasons which is the reasonable meaning of 'most' given the context in which KITR used it. 

Looking forward to all the apologies to WSM from all those who got it wrong...

I agree with you.

In the context used I too read 'most' as meaning 'almost all'.

15 out of 25 seasons is 60%.

That's not most, far from it.

WSM certainly isn't wrong afaic.

 

[chinapig]

2 hours ago, Colemanballs said:

You are simply wrong.

"The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%."

Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764

 

OTIB can be so erudite at times! You wouldn't get a discussion of linguistics on Gaschat. Except perhaps arguing about the precise meaning of prowd.

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, Colemanballs said:

You are simply wrong.

"The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%."

Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764

 

This term is the new “top-end”

[Bar BS3]

1 hour ago, Colemanballs said:

This is becoming tedious and will be my last post on the subject. According to the Oxford Dictionary, 'most' can mean 'almost all'. In the context which KITR used it, that is the only reasonable meaning. 

From NTTDS's post re: MOTD:

I would prefer if it was shown as two separate matches. Most of us do know the outcome of the games.

Would changing 'most' to 'more than half' change the meaning?

No. Its the same thing. The majority - most.!

Please don't bother replying - you are right - it is tedious.

Enjoy the sunshine

[ExiledAjax]

4 hours ago, Colemanballs said:

You are. 15 seasons does not constitute 'almost all' of 25 seasons which is the reasonable meaning of 'most' given the context in which KITR used it. 

Looking forward to all the apologies to WSM from all those who got it wrong...

At the risk of speaking for him, I think the fact that @Kid in the Riot clarified his intended context, that in his initial post he was using the word to mean "significant majority", is important. He may have been abrupt in that clarification, but it was made quite clearly.

That may not be the primary common meaning, but it is an acceptable meaning of the word "most", and once clarified, can be taken to be what the author intended.

[lenred]

Slightly off the incredibly educational mathematical theme, but I wonder how many ‘caps’ we are going to need to get to the away game. Probably will be the most popular away game next season? 

[ExiledAjax]

5 minutes ago, lenred said:

Slightly off the incredibly educational mathematical theme, but I wonder how many ‘caps’ we are going to need to get to the away game. Probably will be the most popular away game next season? 

Easy from London, small stadium, new ground for many, close to Bristol. Yeh it'll sell out 4 or 5 times over I reckon.

[pillred]

12 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. 

You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? 

Even 13 out of 25 could conceivably be considered the most as it's more than half.

Edited May 19 by pillred

[Nogbad the Bad]

46 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said:

No. Its the same thing. The majority - most.!

Please don't bother replying - you are right - it is tedious.

Enjoy the sunshine

You're wrong.

The majority - a word that wasn't used btw - is not the same as most.

Majority means the greater number, quite different from most which means nearly all.

[JBFC II]

1 hour ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

You're wrong.

The majority - a word that wasn't used btw - is not the same as most.

Majority means the greater number, quite different from most which means nearly all.

Just to be clear then, which division have we spent most of this century in if it isn't the championship?

[italian dave]

Roll on August……

[PHILINFRANCE]

20 hours ago, Sleepy1968 said:

Bolton for me as they were our opposition for my first game

 

Home to Bolton was my first game as well, although it was a little bit before the days of Tom Ritchie.

Not many on here will remember him, most have probably never heard of him, but a former England goalkeeper played for Bolton that day, the late Eddie Hopkinson.

[Northern Red]

Up The City!

[Kid in the Riot]

5 hours ago, Colemanballs said:

This is becoming tedious and will be my last post on the subject. According to the Oxford Dictionary, 'most' can mean 'almost all'. In the context which KITR used it, that is the only reasonable meaning. 

From NTTDS's post re: MOTD:

I would prefer if it was shown as two separate matches. Most of us do know the outcome of the games.

Would changing 'most' to 'more than half' change the meaning?

The context is that this century we have been in either the Championship or L1 - agreed?

So me saying that we have spent "most" of that time in the Championship is a statement of fact, and an entirely appropriate use of the word "most" in the circumstance.

It's really not too deep, or difficult, to understand...

[Northern Red]

 

[Bristol Oil Services]

1 hour ago, italian dave said:

Roll on August……

I hope we win Sat......I hope we arrange a pre pre-season game, for this .... soon

[eardun]

12 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

 

Must admit that I don’t remember Darren Dunning playing for City (on loan). 

[Northern Red]

26 minutes ago, eardun said:

Must admit that I don’t remember Darren Dunning playing for City (on loan). 

Came from Blackburn, I think he was only here for a couple of months.