Joe Williams - out of the squad please

[Shauntaylor85]

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

[Fuber]

To be honest, thought Knight was woeful today. 

Neither covered themselves in glory whatsoever.

Need James back.

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

We’ve won and you post negative. Just try to enjoy it 

[REDOXO]

Knight has been lost for much of the season, but Williams and Sykes are the whipping boys. 
 

Sigh.  

[BigTone]

3 minutes ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

Please please please can we offload Mehmeti first ?

[David Brent]

2 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

We’ve won and you post negative. Just try to enjoy it 

I did wonder what the first thread was going to be this week 

[Red Army 75]

Out of the team, not squad. Bad patch of form 

[formerly known as ivan]

25 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

We’ve won and you post negative. Just try to enjoy it 

We won and they posted some facts!

Weak link finally showed, despite it being obvious for about a year or so now.

The fact we were playing Twine out of position to accommodate Williams was even more crazy!

[And Its Smith]

24 minutes ago, formerly known as ivan said:

We won and they posted some facts!

Weak link finally showed, despite it being obvious for about a year or so now.

The fact we were playing Twine out of position to accommodate Williams was even more crazy!

Mostly opinion to be fair 

[Lack of Action Man]

1 hour ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

Correct.

[Malago]

To me Knight looks jaded, to say the least.  I’d start Joe with Max Bird next Sunday with Twine pushed forward , and give Knight a rest.

[formerly known as ivan]

22 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Mostly opinion to be fair 

Result is fact

[RED4LIFE]

1 hour ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

I cant be the only one bored of you picking faults in every single post surely?

Last week Manning had to go. We win, so now it's Williams turn instead.

Give it a rest please. You're doing what Ian Gay/Bristol Boy was before he left/was banned from the forum. So very tiresome.

[KegCity]

Agreed, was woeful today and not a coincidence that we scored two once he was off the pitch.

We have to start the next game with the side that started the second half.

[bcfc01]

1 hour ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

Moved on from sacking Manning then. Fwiw I would have him in the team over Knight.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Williams out of the squad is a bit drastic.

For me, Bird and Knight..they also have the Derby synergy and chemistry which has potential to help. Williams first reserve or competition for Knight.

Vs some tough sides maybe we can play all 3, wide players and the lone striker...shouldn't play Twine wide however.

[Corsham Alf]

I do agree he was woeful today and we improved when he went off.

i struggle to understand what JW contributes to the side. Certainly not, goals, assists and surging runs in the opposing half.

 

I can almost count on one hand the number of good games he’s had since joining.

Very injury prone to. 

Needs a long spell on the sidelines for me. 

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

I thought Williams was perfectly fine first half.

1 hour ago, Fuber said:

To be honest, thought Knight was woeful today. 

Neither covered themselves in glory whatsoever.

Need James back.

Really?  He led our press / block, set up chances (inc Armstrong’s goal) and gave us load of midfield overloads by his constant movement, which allowed us to play through Oxford first half.

He had a funny 5 minutes second half where he gave it away 3 times on the trot, but he certainly made sure he couldn’t get accused this week of half-hearted running back, a couple of lung busting recovery runs in last 20 mins.

[GrahamC]

Williams was no better (or worse) than several others.

I’m convinced the OP just posts this stuff to be controversial.

Anyway the substitution improved us, we won & Williams will definitely be a part of the squad for the next game, whatever some joker says on here.

[RED4LIFE]

22 minutes ago, Corsham Alf said:

I do agree he was woeful today and we improved when he went off.

i struggle to understand what JW contributes to the side. Certainly not, goals, assists and surging runs in the opposing half.

 

I can almost count on one hand the number of good games he’s had since joining.

Very injury prone to. 

Needs a long spell on the sidelines for me. 

I suppose it's all about opinions, but, last season, from January onwards I thought he was excellent. (Queue the moaners saying he was playing for a contract, whilst forgetting his injury was extended to long term by a poor diagnosis/treatment by City physios and therefore lost a big portion of his prime playing years.....)

I honestly thought, now he is genuinely fit, we've got that horrible bastard that every good side needs and opponents hate. He niggles, he moans, he breaks up play and slows it down when needed. We've been crying out for a player like him for years.

Admittedly, he hasn't been anywhere near his best so far this season but to throw him on the scrapheap after a handful of games is premature at best.

I, personally, think he will be an asset to us over the course of the season. Maybe not always a starter, but, always in Mannings plans.

[Fuber]

14 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I thought Williams was perfectly fine first half.

Really?  He led our press / block, set up chances (inc Armstrong’s goal) and gave us load of midfield overloads by his constant movement, which allowed us to play through Oxford first half.

He had a funny 5 minutes second half where he gave it away 3 times on the trot, but he certainly made sure he couldn’t get accused this week of half-hearted running back, a couple of lung busting recovery runs in last 20 mins.

Passing in general was poor I thought, too easy for Oxford to pressure him and a couple of attempts to buy fouls were ill thought out and very weak imo.

One inarticulate towards Lansdown second half when we had them on the backfoot, I was incredulous, but maybe being bias off the back of that with him then misplacing the three easy passes immediately after that you mention.

Ran a lot, like standard, but thought he let himself down one time too often.

Wouldn't mind seeing McCorie alongside Bird for a bit of steel and dropping Knight and Williams to the bench for a game. Lacked some bite in midfield as well as height.

Edited September 21 by Fuber

[Silvio Dante]

I think the thing for me here was that Williams got a pretty silly Yellow Card early on. As a result, when Dembele drifted into the centre when Oxford had possession he didn’t feel he could risk a tackle (most notably on the goal but also on other occasions) - combination of a player with good feet who draws fouls and being in a jeopardy position.

Out of the squad? nah. But undoubtedly the right and obvious change as Joe played within himself post the yellow due to the above.

[Fuber]

2 hours ago, REDOXO said:

Knight has been lost for much of the season, but Williams and Sykes are the whipping boys. 
 

Sigh.  

Think all three deserve the critique tbh.

[Bazooka Joe]

1 hour ago, Malago said:

To me Knight looks jaded, to say the least.  I’d start Joe with Max Bird next Sunday with Twine pushed forward , and give Knight a rest.

Suspect the burden of captaincy might be weighing heavily on his shoulders.

Might be wise for Manning to relieve him of this responsibility (even temporarily) so that he can get back to playing better.

Worth a try.

[BobBobBobbin]

16 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I thought Williams was perfectly fine first half.

Really?  He led our press / block, set up chances (inc Armstrong’s goal) and gave us load of midfield overloads by his constant movement, which allowed us to play through Oxford first half.

He had a funny 5 minutes second half where he gave it away 3 times on the trot, but he certainly made sure he couldn’t get accused this week of half-hearted running back, a couple of lung busting recovery runs in last 20 mins.

yep, Knight was good and Williams was fine. Deciphering the press is a weak point in the majority of fans in this country, so it rarely gets plaudits when done well; especially the act of leading it. (Pato never got any credit for that side of his game, for instance).

I guess the issue is that a Williams, Bird and Knight triumvirate doesn't offer enough positives if we are then shoehorning Twine into the equation. I'd have no problem with seeing any of the three in a two behind a balanced 3-1. I wouldn't even mind Knight in the 10, provided Twine wasn't selected too. Bird and Knight are the better technical players for sure, but there will be times this season where we will need Williams in there (and perhaps, McGuane).

 

 

7 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

I think the thing for me here was that Williams got a pretty silly Yellow Card early on. As a result, when Dembele drifted into the centre when Oxford had possession he didn’t feel he could risk a tackle (most notably on the goal but also on other occasions) - combination of a player with good feet who draws fouls and being in a jeopardy position.

Out of the squad? nah. But undoubtedly the right and obvious change as Joe played within himself post the yellow due to the above.

precisely!

[RED4LIFE]

2 minutes ago, Bazooka Joe said:

Suspect the burden of captaincy might be weighing heavily on his shoulders.

Might be wise for Manning to relieve him of this responsibility (even temporarily) so that he can get back to playing better.

Worth a try.

No way. Taking the captaincy away from him would send a terrible message and wouldn't help Knight in the slightest.

Give him support and keep telling him he's got the role on merit and he gave it because he believes in him. Raise him uo, don't knock him down.

[Northern Red]

Don't feed it lads. Just be thankful we won or he'd have started half a dozen more threads by now.

[MC RISK77]

I mean I thought he was poor and right to be hooked off, but out of the squad is beyond dramatic 

[RED4LIFE]

1 minute ago, Northern Red said:

Don't feed it lads. Just be thankful we won or he'd have started half a dozen more threads by now.

Never a truer word spoken 

[BobBobBobbin]

Just now, Northern Red said:

Don't feed it lads. Just be thankful we won or he'd have started half a dozen more threads by now.

To be fair, there's a discussion to be had about Williams and the wider midfield. Ignoring the obvious hyperbole of the OP there's plenty of good content in these type of threads imo. Just gotta dig a bit deeper for it... 

[BLRed]

No coincidence we improved once he came off.

[PortInTheMorning]

2 hours ago, BigTone said:

Please please please can we offload Mehmeti first ?

He really annoys me too...

But just to play Devil's Advocate:

When Mehmeti has started we have won 2 and drawn 1 lost 0

When Mehmeti hasn't started we have won 0 drawn 1 lost 2

Having said all that - I think a lot of it has to do with the fact we were lopsided when Twine was on the left due to him constantly drifting into the 10...essentially playing without someone on the left - so maybe any winger would have done...

I hate arguing with myself - I always lose 

[Silvio Dante]

3 minutes ago, PortInTheMorning said:

He really annoys me too...

But just to play Devil's Advocate:

When Mehmeti has started we have won 2 and drawn 1 lost 0

When Mehmeti hasn't started we have won 0 drawn 1 lost 2

Having said all that - I think a lot of it has to do with the fact we were lopsided when Twine was on the left due to him constantly drifting into the 10...essentially playing without someone on the left - so maybe any winger would have done...

I hate arguing with myself - I always lose 

He’s Schrodingers footballer. Hes simultaneously shite and has a positive impact on the team.

[RED4LIFE]

4 minutes ago, PortInTheMorning said:

I hate arguing with myself - I always lose 

Yep, me too.

Beats arguing with the missus though as I lose those too but at a much higher volume 

[BigTone]

5 minutes ago, PortInTheMorning said:

He really annoys me too...

But just to play Devil's Advocate:

When Mehmeti has started we have won 2 and drawn 1 lost 0

When Mehmeti hasn't started we have won 0 drawn 1 lost 2

Having said all that - I think a lot of it has to do with the fact we were lopsided when Twine was on the left due to him constantly drifting into the 10...essentially playing without someone on the left - so maybe any winger would have done...

I hate arguing with myself - I always lose 

I just think he's shite

[BigTone]

2 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

He’s Schrodingers footballer. Hes simultaneously shite and has a positively shite impact on the team.

corrected that for you

[RED4LIFE]

2 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

He’s Schrodingers footballer. Hes simultaneously shite and has a positive impact on the team.

Surely he would have to get into the box more often before that paradox could be judged?

[PortInTheMorning]

4 minutes ago, BigTone said:

I just think he's shite

 

I just hate the fact that he looks like he's chewing on a wasp every time he misses a shot

[Nomad]

1 hour ago, formerly known as ivan said:

Result is fact

The result papers over the cracks. Pretty woeful performance on the whole. Were some good individual performances,  especially Yu.

[steviestevieneville]

2 hours ago, Fuber said:

To be honest, thought Knight was woeful today. 

Neither covered themselves in glory whatsoever.

Need James back.

We’ve definitely lost a lot of control in midfield . Was always a poor decision to get rid of Matty. Might help if he played bird there though. I do find it astounding he’s kept playing him in a dual 10 . I hope he’s learnt lessons from today , however I think long term he’s another overthinking vanity project from the Lansdowns . I’d loved to be proved wrong , I really would 

[Robbored]

28 minutes ago, Nomad said:

The result papers over the cracks. Pretty woeful performance on the whole. Were some good individual performances,  especially Yu.

A game of two halves and a win is a win

City created a couple of decent opportunities first half but down to some poor defensive play were one down at the break.

Replacing the reckless on a yellow Williams was obvious at ht with Hirawaka making his AG debut and he began to impressive almost immediately and was involved in the first goal and the play that led to the penalty.He made quite an impact.

We were all delighted to get three points regardless of the performance. 

I left AG happy with the 3 points but no ‘buzz’ - something I’ve not experienced in quite some time.

[Northern Red]

50 minutes ago, Nomad said:

The result papers over the cracks. Pretty woeful performance on the whole. Were some good individual performances,  especially Yu.

It really wasn't.

[Numero Uno]

Just now, Northern Red said:

It really wasn't.

No, it's almost like people play a game of who can say the worst thing about the performance. It was a performance of two parts - on the ball and off it but you don't create what we did if you are "woeful". Save that for Mark Harris................

What is interesting is we have played seven matches in total and have dominated possession seven times (albeit one game was 50.1%)..........it's definitely changing whether we think it's for better or worse. In previous seasons it would have been 1-6 or 0-7 on that stat.

[Jimbo76]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

I thought Williams was perfectly fine first half.

Really?  He led our press / block, set up chances (inc Armstrong’s goal) and gave us load of midfield overloads by his constant movement, which allowed us to play through Oxford first half.

He had a funny 5 minutes second half where he gave it away 3 times on the trot, but he certainly made sure he couldn’t get accused this week of half-hearted running back, a couple of lung busting recovery runs in last 20 mins.

Agree.  I'm really surprised by comments relating to Knight on here. I thought he was much more like his old self today.  I actually thought he showed energy and made himself available a lot more than Bird who I though was rarely an option for defenders looking to pass the ball out from the back. 

All about opinions I guess.  

[And Its Smith]

2 hours ago, formerly known as ivan said:

Result is fact

Your wisdom is inspiring 

[redkev]

4 hours ago, REDOXO said:

Knight has been lost for much of the season, but Williams and Sykes are the whipping boys. 
 

Sigh.  

Yep knight not been good this season at all , but I think he will come good 

[formerly known as ivan]

36 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Your wisdom is inspiring 

Not as much as your blind faith

[Shauntaylor85]

4 hours ago, formerly known as ivan said:

We won and they posted some facts!

Weak link finally showed, despite it being obvious for about a year or so now.

The fact we were playing Twine out of position to accommodate Williams was even more crazy!

A win shouldn’t mask the issues. 

[Shauntaylor85]

3 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Williams was no better (or worse) than several others.

I’m convinced the OP just posts this stuff to be controversial.

Anyway the substitution improved us, we won & Williams will definitely be a part of the squad for the next game, whatever some joker says on here.

Not at all, I just don’t rate him at all. Think he’s a poor player at this level. My opinion. 

[Fuber]

2 hours ago, Northern Red said:

It really wasn't.

Woeful first half.
Even if Armstrong buried the header, they hit the bar and missed a square, defensively all over the place again.

1 hour ago, Jimbo76 said:

Agree.  I'm really surprised by comments relating to Knight on here. I thought he was much more like his old self today.  I actually thought he showed energy and made himself available a lot more than Bird who I though was rarely an option for defenders looking to pass the ball out from the back. 

All about opinions I guess.  

He had to once Williams went off - and BIrd was played too high to be an option for 50 minutes until Manning told him to sit deeper alongside Jason.

2 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

No, it's almost like people play a game of who can say the worst thing about the performance. It was a performance of two parts.

Nothing wrong with critique as long as when prompted people are balanced in what was done well. The issue being, however -

Tanner, Hirakawa, Roberts, Twine - only ones that come out of that with credit imo. Added to which Oxford were, lets face it, poor. And they still troubled us multiple times.

Nothing confidence inspiring (from my view) unless we can build on this and improve against Swansea. Needs to lead to progress after the last two away games - clean sheet ideally, irrespective of result.

[054123]

Bang average at best in a bang average team. 
 

When all is said and done in May, I’d happily wager that not one top 6 team would take him.

 

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

14 hours ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan and was astounded we missed the opportunities to release him. Someone who is clearly happy with a cushty long term deal, I’m sorry but he cannot start again. Nor can any three CM on the books if Twine is fit for the 10 and Yu available. Astonishing that Manning isn’t smelling the coffee here when we can all see it. 

It might be much simpler and take up a lot less negative OP's for the rest of us if you to just post a single list of who want to remain at BCFC rather endless ones about who you don't want.

It really won't take you long- I imagine the list would be very short.

[Numero Uno]

8 hours ago, Fuber said:

Woeful first half.
Even if Armstrong buried the header, they hit the bar and missed a square, defensively all over the place again.

He had to once Williams went off - and BIrd was played too high to be an option for 50 minutes until Manning told him to sit deeper alongside Jason.

Nothing wrong with critique as long as when prompted people are balanced in what was done well. The issue being, however -

Tanner, Hirakawa, Roberts, Twine - only ones that come out of that with credit imo. Added to which Oxford were, lets face it, poor. And they still troubled us multiple times.

Nothing confidence inspiring (from my view) unless we can build on this and improve against Swansea. Needs to lead to progress after the last two away games - clean sheet ideally, irrespective of result.

Roberts gets credit? Defensively he was our weakest player in the back four and that took some doing. With the ball he was decent. Proves what many comments on here already indicate, some people only watch us when we have the ball. Neither of the lads that actually stuck the ball in the net come out with credit? Ok.

Perhaps you could also explain how our two “sitting deeper” midfield players were played behind a number of times second half by Oxford. Dembele was having the time of his life in those spaces that you would imagine they might be occupying as deeper sitting midfield players. If anything we were WORSE defensively after half time.

No doubt in my mind that Twine is a luxury player. He won’t tackle and, again, defensively he offers us nothing. There’s room for that if the overall balance is right. Liam has a number of things to think about and tweak to make us a top end outfit at this level. We weren’t woeful at any point yesterday in possession of the ball though, only when they had it…..including a couple of your “only ones in credit” boys.

[Slack Bladder]

There is absolutely no doubt the team looked more balanced in that second half.

In my opinion Bird is a must, so there is one midfield place up for grabs for which I think either Knight or Williams could fill, but not both.

[Davefevs]

40 minutes ago, Slack Bladder said:

There is absolutely no doubt the team looked more balanced in that second half.

In my opinion Bird is a must, so there is one midfield place up for grabs for which I think either Knight or Williams could fill, but not both.

It ought to be a genuine 3-man rotation. That doesn’t mean equal minutes, but it certainly means not flogging any one player too. Plus McGuane too. 

[old_eastender]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

It ought to be a genuine 3-man rotation. That doesn’t mean equal minutes, but it certainly means not flogging any one player too. Plus McGuane too. 

 100% agree with the many saying Twine has to play as the central no.10, that leaves 2 roles in CM and Bird has to be one of them. I'd like to see McGuane given the chance as the sitting CM and perhaps try Knight LHS (which I believe is where he play for Eire) instead of 'no end product' Mehmeti.

[Red-Robbo]

1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

Roberts gets credit? Defensively he was our weakest player in the back four and that took some doing. 

I'd give that "award" to McNally. Wasn't impressed by him at all. 

[Dave L]

17 hours ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

I’ve never been a fan 

Hmmmm. I had been wondering

[megansdad]

Odd to pick on Williams who played some excellent passes yesterday. problem was not with the individual but with the set up. Knight seemed to be playing 10 solely for his ability to press rapidly. What changed was when Twine came right and had Yu as a great attacking option. Bird and Knight were then in their best positions, where Williams can also certainly play and perform. Workload will dictate that rotation will be needed. Despite the heavy workload though it was Knight who popped up on the right wing to deliver the perfect ball for Armstrong, after the space had been created by Yu. Structure was much better 2nd half and that was more important than individuals within it.

[Maltshoveller]

17 hours ago, formerly known as ivan said:

We won and they posted some facts!

Weak link finally showed, despite it being obvious for about a year or so now.

The fact we were playing Twine out of position to accommodate Williams was even more crazy!

Didnt post facts

Posted an opinion

Seems so many on here dont know the difference between the two

[formerly known as ivan]

7 minutes ago, Maltshoveller said:

Didnt post facts

Posted an opinion

Seems so many on here dont know the difference between the two

Result was fact

[Maltshoveller]

1 minute ago, formerly known as ivan said:

Result was fact

Nothing about the result in the opening post

[Fuber]

4 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

Roberts gets credit? Defensively he was our weakest player in the back four and that took some doing. With the ball he was decent. Proves what many comments on here already indicate, some people only watch us when we have the ball. Neither of the lads that actually stuck the ball in the net come out with credit? Ok.

Perhaps you could also explain how our two “sitting deeper” midfield players were played behind a number of times second half by Oxford. Dembele was having the time of his life in those spaces that you would imagine they might be occupying as deeper sitting midfield players. If anything we were WORSE defensively after half time.

No doubt in my mind that Twine is a luxury player. He won’t tackle and, again, defensively he offers us nothing. There’s room for that if the overall balance is right. Liam has a number of things to think about and tweak to make us a top end outfit at this level. We weren’t woeful at any point yesterday in possession of the ball though, only when they had it…..including a couple of your “only ones in credit” boys.

Will try and address things in turn; Again - matter of opinions - its fine to disagree, I can see the points being made and why theyve been made, depends on how you view the context of what we're looking for in the team which may differ.

Roberts had Anis in front of him second half and was never going to be match fit goinng into today - only reason I gave him benefit of the doubt - but thats a matter of opinion, obviously. I'd rather focus on him in possession as its the more important factor if you're playing a possession system. Armstrong doesnt get credit as for me, his finishing was utterly woeful yesterday, should have buried either headed chance or at least got them on target - again, matter of opinion. Knight I've covered already in thread above.

Re sitting deeper - I don't understand why Manning didnt get one of Knight or Williams (not after he got himself stupidly booked obviously) to sit on him (Dembele) and man-mark when out of possession.  The issue is its then down to personnel - as without Williams I don't rate any of our midfield defensively marking nor in tackle, I think we're going to see more of an opposition dropping into pockets for this exact reason.

I actually though Twine was much better in the press than either Anis or Bird and didnt really put a foot wrong for the most part - he was willing to take responsbility second half, and when Yu came on he was the only player reading the interchange, most key passes in the game (7). Defensively - he's not meant to offer us much defensively besides the press, Weimann was similar, the trade off being Twine doesn thave the stamina to match (who does) but he reads the game well. The problem is the balance - as both Knight and Bird arent exactly ball winners, so when Williams isnt there its easier to play through unless you mark options and close passing lanes - something we did very well under NP and last season out of possession in contrast but loks almost as if we havent trained in it at all since the summer.

I've mentioned on another thread - it depends on how we want to play it but I'd like to see McCorie, once fit, in the midfield in place of Williams. Have him man-mark Cooper against Swansea and bully him off the ball. Start Yu against Tymon (who is horrific at defending his inside) so they'll have to double up - and it'll create openings.

[Swede]

I thought Knight improved second half. The early yellow Williams picked up (again) definitely had an influence on their goal and affected his play from there on (as the venerable Silvio Dante stated) We were more front footed & positive 2nd half so its no wonder the majority of the players on the pitch looked better.

[Numero Uno]

12 minutes ago, Fuber said:

Will try and address things in turn; Again - matter of opinions - its fine to disagree, I can see the points being made and why theyve been made, depends on how you view the context of what we're looking for in the team which may differ.

Roberts had Anis in front of him second half and was never going to be match fit goinng into today - only reason I gave him benefit of the doubt - but thats a matter of opinion, obviously. I'd rather focus on him in possession as its the more important factor if you're playing a possession system. Armstrong doesnt get credit as for me, his finishing was utterly woeful yesterday, should have buried either headed chance or at least got them on target - again, matter of opinion. Knight I've covered already in thread above.

Re sitting deeper - I don't understand why Manning didnt get one of Knight or Williams (not after he got himself stupidly booked obviously) to sit on him (Dembele) and man-mark when out of possession.  The issue is its then down to personnel - as without Williams I don't rate any of our midfield defensively marking nor in tackle, I think we're going to see more of an opposition dropping into pockets for this exact reason.

I actually though Twine was much better in the press than either Anis or Bird and didnt really put a foot wrong for the most part - he was willing to take responsbility second half, and when Yu came on he was the only player reading the interchange, most key passes in the game (7). Defensively - he's not meant to offer us much defensively besides the press, Weimann was similar, the trade off being Twine doesn thave the stamina to match (who does) but he reads the game well. The problem is the balance - as both Knight and Bird arent exactly ball winners, so when Williams isnt there its easier to play through unless you mark options and close passing lanes - something we did very well under NP and last season out of possession in contrast but loks almost as if we havent trained in it at all since the summer.

I've mentioned on another thread - it depends on how we want to play it but I'd like to see McCorie, once fit, in the midfield in place of Williams. Have him man-mark Cooper against Swansea and bully him off the ball. Start Yu against Tymon (who is horrific at defending his inside) so they'll have to double up - and it'll create openings.

I don’t mind Twine being limited defensively if we make up for that elsewhere. Better sides than Oxford have and will cause us problems until we do tighten up. If you need to score at least twice every week to get something out of a game then things aren’t quite right.

With Armstrong you’ve got to take the rough with the smooth. We create more chances when he’s up top, our games so far prove it.

[Reprored]

For me Bird was the weaker in the tackle first half and seemed to back off a number of times, I didn’t think Williams was the worst performer but the early booking may of swayed the decision to bring him off. Formation suited all second half so any of the midfield combo may have worked, could be a case of future rotation

[Davefevs]

14 minutes ago, Fuber said:

Re sitting deeper - I don't understand why Manning didnt get one of Knight or Williams (not after he got himself stupidly booked obviously) to sit on him (Dembele) and man-mark when out of possession.  The issue is its then down to personnel - as without Williams I don't rate any of our midfield defensively marking nor in tackle, I think we're going to see more of an opposition dropping into pockets for this exact reason.

Because that breaks the in-possession stuff.  You can’t just expect someone to man-mark out of possession, but still be involved in-possession.  This would just create another case of gaps in transition defence…and we have those in abundance.

You pretty much have to be prepared to make it a 10v10, sacrifice a player and just follow him around, ignoring getting involved when we have the ball.  Follow him into their dressing room if required!!

A good structure and transition into that structure ought to be able to absorb Dembele.  Tanner isn’t a “roamer”, so for all his good work, he allowed Dembele to drift infield onto others.  He ought to track him better, without needing to disrupt the whole team.   A little to go with the general s for him.

[Shauntaylor85]

3 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

I'd give that "award" to McNally. Wasn't impressed by him at all. 

Dickie is head and shoulders our best CB. He reads the game superbly and bring a calmness and assurance. We need him fit asap. McNally looks dodgy but in fairness he isn’t fully fit. If we can get Rob fit and to same level, him and Dickie must start. 

Edited Sunday at 12:17 by Shauntaylor85

[formerly known as ivan]

1 hour ago, Maltshoveller said:

Nothing about the result in the opening post

It’s was about Williams being crap, backed up by the fact we won without him on the pitch.

Good enough for me.

[REDOXO]

21 hours ago, Fuber said:

Think all three deserve the critique tbh.

I think they do and one or two more. But two get it one definitely doesn’t and others are ignored. 
 

Over the years we have had multiple whipping boys. Burnell, Smith, Vyner more recently. Sykes and Williams are both doing what they were/are told. It took a winger and a change in tactics to change the game yesterday and the inclusion of Roberts over Pring who looks like he’s carrying a knock to me.