Negativity

[Back of the Dolman]

2 hours ago, ashton_fan said:

I remember the season we got promoted under John Ward we had a similar start and the team were booed off after drawing at home with Bournemouth, he was very upset at the time. Things haven't really changed that much!

They have for Bournemouth 

[Back of the Dolman]

41 minutes ago, Topper 123 said:

Why lansdowns they’ve provided the monies and they don’t do the signings - it’s a bit like going to the bank to take a loan for a car , you buy the car and it breaks down ,you can’t go back to the bank and moan the cars a banger YOU USED THEIR MONEY TO BUY IT , you chose that car ,the fault is in the buyer ,don’t blame lansdowns 

The man speaks sense 

Well if you’re saying it’s Mannings fault if the players signed don’t work then surely you can send that fault up the chain to who selected Manning for the role if it doesn’t work 

[lenred]

24 minutes ago, Olé said:

You don't win prizes for dominating games in safe areas like a low quality Russell Martin tribute act.

Quote of the day! 

[cheese]

21 hours ago, Mikjizzle said:

Long time lurker but I've been compelled to finally post. I'm sure similar posts have been done before so apologies if going over old ground. 

Anyway I've been astonished by the negativity on here by the majority of posters.

Firstly,  I liked Pearson and thought he built some really good foundations and I was annoyed when he got sacked. I also think the communication from the club around it all was poor. But after talking to someone I know who works in first team football (at championship level), I was reassured that a more forward thinking manager made sense to keep up with the direction football is heading. This person had also worked with Pearson and liked him but he told me he thought Pearson had taken as far as he could and thinks City need a technical coach to push us on to the next level and overachieve against teams with a higher wage bill. 

I can't understand what the hatred is for Manning and the way we play. As much as I liked Pearson, the football was generally terrible and we lumped it around most of the time - occasionally we played entertaining counter attacking football but we were unbelievably inconsistent. I think the players did care and they battled, which resonated with everyone (although I think the same is true of players under Manning but he is perhaps asking them to be more conservative/efficient at times with their energy). I'm not convinced Pearson was the man to push us on to the next level as much as what he did at the club was important. 

The football under Manning to me has come on leaps and bounds. I've never seen a Bristol City team dominate teams on the ball in the Championship like we do under Manning this season & we create more clear chances this season then we have for years. I appreciate that some people think it's boring but you can't argue that playing that way doesn't work at Championship level. Nearly all of the teams that have success in football at the moment tend to dominate possession in general and/or play a high press. So, I don't understand why people are against this trend or can't see that we have improved in these areas. 

I've seen a lot of comments about people wanting 90 minutes performances but that's not realistic under any manager for Bristol City in a competitive league. A 90 minute performance to me will likely include periods of the game where you are under pressure - it's about withstanding that pressure and turning the momentum back into your favour. I've also recently seen comments about our squad being too big, which doesn't make sense to me - we have seen how injuries have impacted us in the last few seasons and for the first time we probably have enough depth to deal with it. 

It feels like people cannot see past some of the comments that were made after Pearson got sacked but those aren't Manning's fault. There also seems to be a weird hangover from Lee Johnson with people thinking any other young technical type coach is exactly the same as LJ and can't be successful just because they use coaching language in interviews and haven't got vast amounts of experience in management - but loads of young coaches with similar experience to Manning are hugely successful. It also genuinely feels like people want Manning to fail because of these factors. 

Not sure what the purpose of my post is other than to get it off my chest and to encourage people to consider how much we have developed this season in terms of possession, chances created and patterns of play. I think we are still trying to find a balance between attack and defence.  

Ultimately, it's a results business and we need better results, which I hope will come if we keep doing what we are doing - and I think the signs are encouraging, apart from a couple of matches, where we were punished. But it's still early in the season and I think worth noting that I still wouldn't say we have a top 6 squad (regardless of some flippant comments from Tinnion). So, I don't understand where the negativity comes from or why there is a lack of acknowledgement for how much the team has developed, even if you are annoyed about the results, the club and the way Pearson was treated.

I'm desperate for City to have a good season and compete for promotion and I'm fed up of mid table mediocrity. I think based on current trends in football and the way we are looking to develop Manning gives us a reasonable chance of that. And if not Manning then someone else similar on paper. Carlos Corberan is a similar obsessive, technical coach and he's overachieving with West Brom- same can be said for McKenna last season, so it can be done. 

I'm aware that this post may be met with me being accused of being some sort of Bristol Sport bot/employee but so be it. 

You're not alone - as I've said on another thread, Blackburn away apart, I've enjoyed watching us this season and am looking forward to Cardiff.  We just need to score when we're on top.

[bcfcredandwhite]

46 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said:

What’s the point of being a mid table club and accepting it, pointless waste of time and money supporting a club that will neither excite or disappoint.  Football is not like like that, or at least it didn’t used to be, it used to be a place where dreams could be realised, where hope was always present, but years of mediocrity is bound to wear most fans down to the point of apathy or worse, walking away.

It’s not that I don’t want us to win, or challenge for promotion - I do of course. 
I just don’t get stressed out every time we DONT win. 
I used to but I don’t now. 
I’ve been a supporter since the 1970s and believe me what we are seeing now is a lot better than much I’ve seen over the last 50 years. 
Fans walking away? Despite the apparent frustration and anger vented on this site, attendances are up, so SOMETHING must be going right. 

[hinsleburg]

17 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

In respect of xG- we definitely aren't scoring enough goals firstly. Laat night was quite dull IMO, felt like a bit too much passing around.

Well the site I use..and my understanding of XG so needs to be factored in..

*0.3 or above for a win ie 0.9 v 0.6.

*A converted Penalty is worth 0.8.

Draw your own conclusions.

Adjusted for non Penalties we could have 12-14 Points.

With Penalties 13.

10.9 Goals For without, 11.7 with.

8.4 Goals Against without, 10 with.

I'm not a big stats guy but think it's really interesting looking at that the biggest margin in our favour is the game where we had the ball less.

Likewise, Southampton last season was our best performance and once again the amount we had the ball was less than usual. In both those games we got the ball forward much quicker and more efficiently and all our possession was in the right area of the pitch.

Take Swansea, I'd love to know how much of our possession was in the final 3rd and then compare that to the Derby game where we had the most possession. I'd wager time spent in the final 3rd wouldn't differ much and that in itself is a problem. It shouldn't be how much of the ball we have but what we do when we have it.

Drop the tippy tappy shit, get the ball forward quickly, press high and play in their half. See what happens to the atmosphere and negativity then

[Silvio Dante]

3 minutes ago, hinsleburg said:

I'm not a big stats guy but think it's really interesting looking at that the biggest margin in our favour is the game where we had the ball less.

Likewise, Southampton last season was our best performance and once again the amount we had the ball was less than usual. In both those games we got the ball forward much quicker and more efficiently and all our possession was in the right area of the pitch.

Take Swansea, I'd love to know how much of our possession was in the final 3rd and then compare that to the Derby game where we had the most possession. I'd wager time spent in the final 3rd wouldn't differ much and that in itself is a problem. It shouldn't be how much of the ball we have but what we do when we have it.

Drop the tippy tappy shit, get the ball forward quickly, press high and play in their half. See what happens to the atmosphere and negativity then

It’s almost as if, to use one of Liams phrases, the opposition are “controlling the game without the football” against us…

[spudski]

1 hour ago, formerly known as ivan said:

If you’ve bought into what Tinnion, Manning and the club are doing then fair play to you. People will always have different views.

The bit I would question is the part about football coming on leaps and bounds. For me, we are witnessing the most boring period of football in recent memory. So much so I don't bother going and more often than not turn off when on tv.

If you find this football entertaining I can only imagine what you do for fun in your own time.

There's a lot to be said for that.

Football has become like a game of chess in many ways.

Dominating the ball, creating a structured defence.

Movement set in stone, so to speak.

I can watch a build up of play now, and literally know where the ball is going to be passed to, and the ' shapes' being made.

When done well, and at speed, it can be a joy to watch, but it's a rarity and only imo, done well by the very top players and teams.

Go down to the average Championship level, and it's slow and methodical.

When pressed into doing it quicker, the wheels come off. Passes go astray, and it becomes a mess.

I don't get excited by it...as you know we aren't technically quick enough to do it well.

Passes under hit, over hit, to the wrong foot. Control poor. Positioning and movement too slow, not on the same wavelength etc etc.

The only time it becomes exciting is when it is done well ( not very often at this level) , but when it breaks down and mistakes are made, and a break happens on the counter. 

Some say they get excited when Mehmeti gets the ball. As he try's something. I don't get excited by him...I sigh and just feel frustration. It's like watching a kid in the playground with his head down, and then a dad ( defender ) easily sticking a leg out and stopping him.

What frustrates me even more, is that Manning rates him and Twine and thinks they are our answer to creating something magical. 

 

Edited October 4 by spudski

[Davefevs]

13 minutes ago, hinsleburg said:

I'm not a big stats guy but think it's really interesting looking at that the biggest margin in our favour is the game where we had the ball less.

Likewise, Southampton last season was our best performance and once again the amount we had the ball was less than usual. In both those games we got the ball forward much quicker and more efficiently and all our possession was in the right area of the pitch.

Take Swansea, I'd love to know how much of our possession was in the final 3rd and then compare that to the Derby game where we had the most possession. I'd wager time spent in the final 3rd wouldn't differ much and that in itself is a problem. It shouldn't be how much of the ball we have but what we do when we have it.

Drop the tippy tappy shit, get the ball forward quickly, press high and play in their half. See what happens to the atmosphere and negativity then

Pic we are slightly better than average (blue line) of converting possession into passes into the box.

Pic each match

We had our 3rd best passes into box with our lowest possession (Swansea)

 

[Maesknoll Red]

42 minutes ago, bcfcredandwhite said:

It’s not that I don’t want us to win, or challenge for promotion - I do of course. 
I just don’t get stressed out every time we DONT win. 
I used to but I don’t now. 
I’ve been a supporter since the 1970s and believe me what we are seeing now is a lot better than much I’ve seen over the last 50 years. 
Fans walking away? Despite the apparent frustration and anger vented on this site, attendances are up, so SOMETHING must be going right. 

I’ve witnessed the ups and downs since the mid 60’s (although I have very little recollection of the 60’s as I was a young child), the last few years have been pretty dull and uninspiring, the usual pre-season hype, hope and buzz soon fades into mid table dullness, with a very occasional blip of hope as we get towards the playoffs, before slipping back.  

Likewise an odd spell of nervousness as we slip below mid-table and the dreaded relegation word rears its head for a week or two, until once again, either our results or those of others see us back in that stake, dull, mid-table zone.

Yes, numbers are up currently, how long do fans pay good money to be bored and frustrated, I’d be interested to see the stats on season ticket renewal v new holders.

I can definitely remember many season where the football was more exiting than it has been the last 3 or 4 years.

[robin_unreliant]

1 hour ago, ashton_fan said:

Personally I really enjoyed the opening three home games, the most entertaining matches I've seen at AG for ages. I understand why people got fed up last season when the players didn't fully understand the new system but we've got past that stage now. There's always going to be an occasional bad game like the 2nd half against Wednesday.

I do agree that we started this season quite promisingly. The football was entertaining and it seemed that we were on the road to being a side that could dominate possession and do something positive with the ball. So what went wrong?

Dickie injury? Opposition coaches analysing Manning's game plan and countering it? Players losing confidence after failing to take chances? Whatever it is, I don't see much evidence that LM knows how to sort it.

[Mikjizzle]

37 minutes ago, hinsleburg said:

I'm not a big stats guy but think it's really interesting looking at that the biggest margin in our favour is the game where we had the ball less.

Likewise, Southampton last season was our best performance and once again the amount we had the ball was less than usual. In both those games we got the ball forward much quicker and more efficiently and all our possession was in the right area of the pitch.

Take Swansea, I'd love to know how much of our possession was in the final 3rd and then compare that to the Derby game where we had the most possession. I'd wager time spent in the final 3rd wouldn't differ much and that in itself is a problem. It shouldn't be how much of the ball we have but what we do when we have it.

Drop the tippy tappy shit, get the ball forward quickly, press high and play in their half. See what happens to the atmosphere and negativity then

Surely you want to have a team that can do both - so you can adapt to different opposition and phases of the game? I think City have been fairly decent as a transition counter attacking team for a while now (under Pearson and Manning). But Manning is transforming us into or trying to make us be able to control games and dominate the ball as well, which is another string to our bow in my opinion. If you can do both well then it's ideal. 

I think that is one of the reasons we struggled at home under Pearson, we had a side that were good at counter attack football, which gave us good away performances- but how do you utilise that when a team sits in their own half at Ashton Gate - you need to find another way. 

[spudski]

5 minutes ago, Mikjizzle said:

Surely you want to have a team that can do both - so you can adapt to different opposition and phases of the game? I think City have been fairly decent as a transition counter attacking team for a while now (under Pearson and Manning). But Manning is transforming us into or trying to make us be able to control games and dominate the ball as well, which is another string to our bow in my opinion. If you can do both well then it's ideal. 

I think that is one of the reasons we struggled at home under Pearson, we had a side that were good at counter attack football, which gave us good away performances- but how do you utilise that when a team sits in their own half at Ashton Gate - you need to find another way. 

You've only got to look at the graph above to see team passes into the box and possession stats. 

You can have all the possession you like, with the aim of creating a chance in the box.

However...if the ball into the box or those receiving aren't good at it, then it's a complete waste of time.

Right now...our possession is better...but it hasn't led to better quality where it counts.

[Mikjizzle]

2 minutes ago, spudski said:

You've only got to look at the graph above to see team passes into the box and possession stats. 

You can have all the possession you like, with the aim of creating a chance in the box.

However...if the ball into the box or those receiving aren't good at it, then it's a complete waste of time.

Right now...our possession is better...but it hasn't led to better quality where it counts.

it has led to a lot more chances created though than the last few seasons though.. admittedly not many against Sheff W 

[spudski]

6 minutes ago, Mikjizzle said:

it has led to a lot more chances created though than the last few seasons though.. admittedly not many against Sheff W 

Like I said...creating chances is all well and good, but you need people of quality to finish those chances. 

We have many players who are weak at finishing.

We have two forwards who are very young and inexperienced and aren't renowned for finishing. 

Mehmeti who is considered poor at finishing and crossing. 

 

[hinsleburg]

1 hour ago, Mikjizzle said:

Surely you want to have a team that can do both - so you can adapt to different opposition and phases of the game? I think City have been fairly decent as a transition counter attacking team for a while now (under Pearson and Manning). But Manning is transforming us into or trying to make us be able to control games and dominate the ball as well, which is another string to our bow in my opinion. If you can do both well then it's ideal. 

I think that is one of the reasons we struggled at home under Pearson, we had a side that were good at counter attack football, which gave us good away performances- but how do you utilise that when a team sits in their own half at Ashton Gate - you need to find another way. 

I kind of think you're right where you want a side that can adapt to multiple scenarios, right now though we're not doing either well and therein lies the issue. You need a core philosophy and playing style which is your Plan A, you then need a Plan B to combat certain opposition or players. Right now Plan A isn't working and there seemingly isn't a Plan B we want to utilise consistently... More concerning, Manning seems to think Plan A actually is working and is publicly very happy which is completely alienating himself from the fans

I also agree that Pearson's style meant our Home form was more inconsistent as we were unable to break sides down consistently. However, that's still an issue now with whatever style this is supposed to be. I'm not against controlling the ball, but if we're controlling it with Vyner and Mcnally we may as well go home now, like I said, get the ball forward, press high and play in their half. It doesn't have to be counter or possession and as jokingly alluded to by another poster, you can control the game without the ball.

Despite their result Tuesday Cardiff are absolutely there for the taking Sunday and we should be all over them and in their faces from the first minute. But do you really think that's going to happen or are we going to try and win the game 1-0 with 65% and 3 shots all game...? Would love to be proved wrong but I'm already looking forward to the Half Time Pint more than the first half

[Mikjizzle]

1 hour ago, hinsleburg said:

I kind of think you're right where you want a side that can adapt to multiple scenarios, right now though we're not doing either well and therein lies the issue. You need a core philosophy and playing style which is your Plan A, you then need a Plan B to combat certain opposition or players. Right now Plan A isn't working and there seemingly isn't a Plan B we want to utilise consistently... More concerning, Manning seems to think Plan A actually is working and is publicly very happy which is completely alienating himself from the fans

I also agree that Pearson's style meant our Home form was more inconsistent as we were unable to break sides down consistently. However, that's still an issue now with whatever style this is supposed to be. I'm not against controlling the ball, but if we're controlling it with Vyner and Mcnally we may as well go home now, like I said, get the ball forward, press high and play in their half. It doesn't have to be counter or possession and as jokingly alluded to by another poster, you can control the game without the ball.

Despite their result Tuesday Cardiff are absolutely there for the taking Sunday and we should be all over them and in their faces from the first minute. But do you really think that's going to happen or are we going to try and win the game 1-0 with 65% and 3 shots all game...? Would love to be proved wrong but I'm already looking forward to the Half Time Pint more than the first half

yeah well that's where we differ. I think we do both well. We played the transition really well against Swansea second half (plan B). And we have had some really good games in possession at home this season (Plan A). I just think we need to be a bit more consistent and more clinical but the signs are very promising to me - although if the results don't follow soon I will be disappointed. 

I think people are also being a bit dismissive of how hard it is to break teams down if they sit deep and do it well - that naturally means you will have a lot of the ball. I also think we do play a high press? We pressed Sheff W high from what I could see. 

[hinsleburg]

1 minute ago, Mikjizzle said:

yeah well that's where we differ. I think we do both well. We played the transition really well against Swansea second half (plan B). And we have had some really good games in possession at home this season (Plan A). I just think we need to be a bit more consistent and more clinical but the signs are very promising to me - although if the results don't follow soon I will be disappointed. 

I think people are also being a bit dismissive of how hard it is to break teams down if they sit deep and do it well - that naturally means you will have a lot of the ball. I also think we do play a high press? We pressed Sheff W high from what I could see. 

Sorry, but where has Plan A been executed well and successfully at home because I must have missed that and you've not given any examples? First 20 minutes V Millwall is the only time I can think where we've dominated possession and scored... 

I wouldn't say we've had any good games at home in possession this season, for the most part it's been shite.

There is the occasional green shoot, but it's constantly one step forward, two steps back 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, hinsleburg said:

I kind of think you're right where you want a side that can adapt to multiple scenarios, right now though we're not doing either well and therein lies the issue. You need a core philosophy and playing style which is your Plan A, you then need a Plan B to combat certain opposition or players. Right now Plan A isn't working and there seemingly isn't a Plan B we want to utilise consistently... More concerning, Manning seems to think Plan A actually is working and is publicly very happy which is completely alienating himself from the fans

I also agree that Pearson's style meant our Home form was more inconsistent as we were unable to break sides down consistently. However, that's still an issue now with whatever style this is supposed to be. I'm not against controlling the ball, but if we're controlling it with Vyner and Mcnally we may as well go home now, like I said, get the ball forward, press high and play in their half. It doesn't have to be counter or possession and as jokingly alluded to by another poster, you can control the game without the ball.

Despite their result Tuesday Cardiff are absolutely there for the taking Sunday and we should be all over them and in their faces from the first minute. But do you really think that's going to happen or are we going to try and win the game 1-0 with 65% and 3 shots all game...? Would love to be proved wrong but I'm already looking forward to the Half Time Pint more than the first half

For info, we are the 23rd best (2nd worst) at recovering the ball in the opposition final third.  You could of course argue that is because we have more possession, therefore opposition have less possession and therefore less opportunity.

Another graph for you!

And that is why after that first gameweek I was not hugely struck with the fact that we had the highest number of recoveries in the opposition final third…because Hull were Kamikaze playing out!  I wanted to see a bigger sample.

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Surely though if you have more Possession, it can lead to an opportunity to rest in Possession and therefore press better and with more intensity out of it.

Possession football is fine but without some tempo plus for the Pressing without the ball Intensity, it can become a bit sterile and pointless.

[Mikjizzle]

4 minutes ago, hinsleburg said:

Sorry, but where has Plan A been executed well and successfully at home because I must have missed that and you've not given any examples? First 20 minutes V Millwall is the only time I can think where we've dominated possession and scored... 

I wouldn't say we've had any good games at home in possession this season, for the most part it's been shite.

There is the occasional green shoot, but it's constantly one step forward, two steps back 

Obviously we think differently about that or I wouldn't have done my original post. Sheff W, Oxford & Coventry I thought we were really good (I wasn't at Millwall game). Should have beaten Coventry. I thought we were impressive against Sheff W first half but couldn't break through - I was also quite impressed with how organised they were though.

People seem to dismiss the Oxford victory because of who they are but they are still going pretty strong. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

12 minutes ago, hinsleburg said:

Sorry, but where has Plan A been executed well and successfully at home because I must have missed that and you've not given any examples? First 20 minutes V Millwall is the only time I can think where we've dominated possession and scored... 

I wouldn't say we've had any good games at home in possession this season, for the most part it's been shite.

There is the occasional green shoot, but it's constantly one step forward, two steps back 

I don't think it's been as bad as all that. Coventry will come good, we played quite well there- Oxford they will concede s lot of goals and or chances on the road but we were the better side.. albeit it was a must win game for a host of reasons.

Away Form is a bigger concern for me, excessively fragile at one end, less than clinical at the other- Home Form seems acceptable IMO.

[cheese]

4 hours ago, hinsleburg said:

I'm not a big stats guy but think it's really interesting looking at that the biggest margin in our favour is the game where we had the ball less.

Likewise, Southampton last season was our best performance and once again the amount we had the ball was less than usual. In both those games we got the ball forward much quicker and more efficiently and all our possession was in the right area of the pitch.

Take Swansea, I'd love to know how much of our possession was in the final 3rd and then compare that to the Derby game where we had the most possession. I'd wager time spent in the final 3rd wouldn't differ much and that in itself is a problem. It shouldn't be how much of the ball we have but what we do when we have it.

Drop the tippy tappy shit, get the ball forward quickly, press high and play in their half. See what happens to the atmosphere and negativity then

The number of passes we made in each half of the pitch against Sheff Wed were the same - 211

[Gol]

On 03/10/2024 at 15:58, Mikjizzle said:

I thought they were very organised and we were trying to shift them across the pitch & out of shape by moving the ball side ways because we couldn't see a way through. We probably could have done with Bird on earlier to get the ball forward faster and into Twine's feet. We have created a lot of chances in other games recently. But Sheff W are the most organised team I've seen us play so far this season and I think they grew in confidence by not slipping up in the first half.  

Sheffield Wednesday came into the game losing all 3 previous away games, they had conceded more goals than us and had the worst record at conceding from set pieces this season (we have the 2nd worse fyi).

whilst we played well the first have (with the exception of all those bloody short corners (which is a failure of Mannings not to instruct the team to take advantage of an opposition weakness). 2nd half they modified their tactics and manning did not alter his which led to a truly turgid half of football.  manning did his usual like for like subs on the 60 min mark. His comments about why he brought Nhski on instead of Fally

to your original post the job after Pearson sacking was always going to be difficult and polarising due to the way the way the sacking was handled and what was said about us having a top 6 squad.

many fans saw Pearson (a manager with a promotion to the prem on his CV) as slowly building a team where the core came from the academy. There was a clear plan for fans to buy into.
 

some people say the football was boring, not all of it was boring, the football with  WSM upfront was good as it was the couple of months before we sold Semenyo.
 

It’s also worth noting Pearson had to play with freebies and youth team players.   We made circa £40m off 3 such players (Scott Semenyo and Conway)there was also Bell, Vyner O’Leary and Pring who are still main players in this squad.

By the end of his reign we had one of the best defences in the league and needed a bit of the money he generated in sales to improve the attack.

He wasn’t given it, Manning was and whilst we may be having more shots we aren't scoring more and in doing this has made our solid defence one of the leakiest in the division.  
 

So our coach who was meant to improve our players has not done much going forward but massively regressed us defensively.

Finally the pathway from the academy to the first team which Pearson cultivated has disappeared as well.

genuine question  can you name one player who was with us under both Pearson and Manning who has shown noticeable improvement since Manning came in? Because I genuinely cannot
 

I would not have sacked Pearson but it was done and if we wanted to go down the head coach to improve players route I can get behind that. Manning has now had a year we have seen no new players from the academy and the existing players have not noticeably improved in fact some have regressed noticeably. Tactically he is inflexible and his subs are predictable .

Also it is not just fans on this forum that are negative about him its all over social media and in the ground as per Wednesday night.
 

 

[Numero Uno]

5 hours ago, cheese said:

The number of passes we made in each half of the pitch against Sheff Wed were the same - 211

How many times are we getting the ball into the opposition penalty area? We managed it against Oxford and won the game. 211 passes in their half yet Wednesday’s keeper made one save all night. That’s the only stat that counts.

[Ska Junkie]

On 03/10/2024 at 18:32, Severn Beach Pigeon said:

Sorry mate, your joke was only funny the first thousand times it was used on here.

Others seem to like it you miserable bugger and you're no 'mate' of mine  as you seem to have no sense of humour whatsoever.

Put me on ignore ffs rather than be a 'look at me' merchant.

Prat!

[cheese]

2 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

How many times are we getting the ball into the opposition penalty area? We managed it against Oxford and won the game. 211 passes in their half yet Wednesday’s keeper made one save all night. That’s the only stat that counts.

We had 27 touches in the opposition box.

[Leveller]

On 03/10/2024 at 12:29, Roe said:

You don't understand why people are frustrated at sitting in the bottom half, watching dull 0-0 draws and 12 months of mediocrity after such backing?

Really?

 

On 03/10/2024 at 14:40, Natchfever said:

Absolutely.

At the time Manning hadnt had a chance to show his worth.

Now he has and I consider him worthless based on what I have seen with the players at his disposal.

We are a passive fan base in the main, but fair play to those who directed displeasure towards the coach last night.

 

 

On 03/10/2024 at 12:30, One Team said:

At least a well explained post, albeit I disagree with you, especially on the football being improved. 

The negativity isn’t just about last night in isolation IMO, it’s been ongoing for months and has been magnified following Manning’s backing and this seasons approach. In my experience the views here are reasonably well balanced and I see and hear far more vociferous views elsewhere. 

Nice to have a decent thought through post though. 

All these comments about the backing Manning has had, the fortune we’ve spent and the players at his disposal are a bit bizarre.

Basically we’ve sold players for £40m that NP had in his squad (Scott, Semenyo, Conway) and replaced them with players costing under £10m (Twine, Armstrong Mayulu). So Manning is working with players worth £30m less than those NP had available.

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

5 hours ago, Ska Junkie said:

Others seem to like it you miserable bugger and you're no 'mate' of mine  as you seem to have no sense of humour whatsoever.

Put me on ignore ffs rather than be a 'look at me' merchant.

Prat!

Someone's pissy 

I wasn't being "look at me", just expressed an opinion that the joke was extremely tired and overused and has been for years.

No offense taken though, have a good weekend.

 

[Davefevs]

31 minutes ago, Leveller said:

 

 

All these comments about the backing Manning has had, the fortune we’ve spent and the players at his disposal are a bit bizarre.

Basically we’ve sold players for £40m that NP had in his squad (Scott, Semenyo, Conway) and replaced them with players costing under £10m (Twine, Armstrong Mayulu). So Manning is working with players worth £30m less than those NP had available.

Interesting way of looking at it Lev…and valid argument too.

I’d add that the amount he had them all together was pretty small though.  Pretty much first half of 22/23 was it, Conway wasn’t around 21/22 when WSM was going.  Semenyo went in January.  Scott start of 23/24 and Conway start of 24/25.

[Mikjizzle]

6 hours ago, Gol said:

Sheffield Wednesday came into the game losing all 3 previous away games, they had conceded more goals than us and had the worst record at conceding from set pieces this season (we have the 2nd worse fyi).

whilst we played well the first have (with the exception of all those bloody short corners (which is a failure of Mannings not to instruct the team to take advantage of an opposition weakness). 2nd half they modified their tactics and manning did not alter his which led to a truly turgid half of football.  manning did his usual like for like subs on the 60 min mark. His comments about why he brought Nhski on instead of Fally

to your original post the job after Pearson sacking was always going to be difficult and polarising due to the way the way the sacking was handled and what was said about us having a top 6 squad.

many fans saw Pearson (a manager with a promotion to the prem on his CV) as slowly building a team where the core came from the academy. There was a clear plan for fans to buy into.
 

some people say the football was boring, not all of it was boring, the football with  WSM upfront was good as it was the couple of months before we sold Semenyo.
 

It’s also worth noting Pearson had to play with freebies and youth team players.   We made circa £40m off 3 such players (Scott Semenyo and Conway)there was also Bell, Vyner O’Leary and Pring who are still main players in this squad.

By the end of his reign we had one of the best defences in the league and needed a bit of the money he generated in sales to improve the attack.

He wasn’t given it, Manning was and whilst we may be having more shots we aren't scoring more and in doing this has made our solid defence one of the leakiest in the division.  
 

So our coach who was meant to improve our players has not done much going forward but massively regressed us defensively.

Finally the pathway from the academy to the first team which Pearson cultivated has disappeared as well.

genuine question  can you name one player who was with us under both Pearson and Manning who has shown noticeable improvement since Manning came in? Because I genuinely cannot
 

I would not have sacked Pearson but it was done and if we wanted to go down the head coach to improve players route I can get behind that. Manning has now had a year we have seen no new players from the academy and the existing players have not noticeably improved in fact some have regressed noticeably. Tactically he is inflexible and his subs are predictable .

Also it is not just fans on this forum that are negative about him its all over social media and in the ground as per Wednesday night.
 

 

Tanner, Knight and Mehmetti have improved I’d say. Tanner by quite a lot. 
 

not sure how relevant the point about academy is as seems the current batch of u21s aren’t all that. Think some of the 18/19 year olds could be good but a way off from championship football right now. I would rather have first team depth - the majority of our academy players traditionally haven’t broken into being first team regulars until early to mid 20’s.
 

completely disagree that we have massively regressed at the back. We had 2 terrible games but beyond that our defensive record is still pretty good under manning. I think we are finding our feet this season in terms of balance between attack and defence but it’s a risk that’s worth it. 

i would quite like to see him change more stuff in game. When you listen to him he’s all about players problem solving in game. So he’s wanting to coach the players to deal with the tactical changes that happen from opponents in game and make the right adjustments- whether that works, I don’t know but I don’t think it’s a lack of awareness or stubbornness. I think he thinks he’s given the players all the information required to make in game decisions to deal with different phases and tactics that unfold.
 

It’s certainly drastically different to what Pearson was and my view is that the pay off could be big but takes time - the signs and progression are very promising to my eye. 
 

That probably makes me seem more pro manning than I actually am. I’m glass half full and I want it to work and on paper it makes sense right now. But the reason I posted is because I’m amazed by how negative people are about manning compared to Pearson. 

[Roe]

3 hours ago, Leveller said:

 

 

All these comments about the backing Manning has had, the fortune we’ve spent and the players at his disposal are a bit bizarre.

Basically we’ve sold players for £40m that NP had in his squad (Scott, Semenyo, Conway) and replaced them with players costing under £10m (Twine, Armstrong Mayulu). So Manning is working with players worth £30m less than those NP had available.

Yeah this is a fair point but I wasn't really meaning backing just as in money spent or quality available.

I think he's been backed in plenty of other ways aside from this including not having to play any academy players, not having to massively cut the budget and coming in at the best starting point of any manager we've had in the last 30 years

[glynriley]

6 hours ago, Mikjizzle said:

 

i would quite like to see him change more stuff in game. When you listen to him he’s all about players problem solving in game. So he’s wanting to coach the players to deal with the tactical changes that happen from opponents in game and make the right adjustments- whether that works, I don’t know but I don’t think it’s a lack of awareness or stubbornness. I think he thinks he’s given the players all the information required to make in game decisions to deal with different phases and tactics that unfold.
 

Seems like a cop out to me. I’m not sure how he expects 20 odd year olds, some with little experience of the championship, to be making those kinds of decisions when they are concentrating on their own game. 
 

If the opposing manager is making wholesale changes then fair enough, but subtle adjustments are what the bloke on the sidelines should be spotting and dealing with. Abdicating responsibility is not a good look. 

[Davefevs]

7 hours ago, Mikjizzle said:

Tanner, Knight and Mehmetti have improved I’d say. Tanner by quite a lot. 
 

not sure how relevant the point about academy is as seems the current batch of u21s aren’t all that. Think some of the 18/19 year olds could be good but a way off from championship football right now. I would rather have first team depth - the majority of our academy players traditionally haven’t broken into being first team regulars until early to mid 20’s.
 

completely disagree that we have massively regressed at the back. We had 2 terrible games but beyond that our defensive record is still pretty good under manning. I think we are finding our feet this season in terms of balance between attack and defence but it’s a risk that’s worth it. 

i would quite like to see him change more stuff in game. When you listen to him he’s all about players problem solving in game. So he’s wanting to coach the players to deal with the tactical changes that happen from opponents in game and make the right adjustments- whether that works, I don’t know but I don’t think it’s a lack of awareness or stubbornness. I think he thinks he’s given the players all the information required to make in game decisions to deal with different phases and tactics that unfold.
 

It’s certainly drastically different to what Pearson was and my view is that the pay off could be big but takes time - the signs and progression are very promising to my eye. 
 

That probably makes me seem more pro manning than I actually am. I’m glass half full and I want it to work and on paper it makes sense right now. But the reason I posted is because I’m amazed by how negative people are about manning compared to Pearson. 

Bold bit first - That’s because you are looking at the outcome (results / goals conceded), not the process of how chances are created against us.  As you’ve been lurking a long time before your first post, you’ll have read many posts about how open we are, mainly in transition defence.  If you watch the chances we give up, or areas we get exposed, then you’d have seen the “defence” (as a whole team) has gone backwards. And your second sentence acknowledges the risk, so you must have witnessed and accepted that the defence is worse for the benefit (to be quantified) of the attack.

Re other bits.  Tanner was already a very good 1v1 defender, but happy to accept he might’ve got better a little bit.  Fans focussed too much on what he did on the ball, where he’s still just a conservative player with the ball.

Academy - if you show them a pathway you sometimes get surprised by who is ready!  If you don’t, you never know.

Re Player problem solving - and then he calls them out for going off plan (his plan).  Sounds like he wants his cake and eat it to me.

Re Time to pay off - that wasn’t the expectation.  The slack some fans give him surprises me.  It’s virtually always based on the hope of a rosy future rather than solid rationale.  He might indeed deliver over time, I hope he dies does, but there isn’t much evidence to have confidence, other than the “time = improvement”.  In football management that rarely is the case.

Pro Manning - it certainly reads that way!   Wanting it to work is not a basis for it actually working.

Edited October 5 by Davefevs
Oooooooops

[Silvio Dante]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

He might indeed deliver over time, I hope he dies, but there isn’t much evidence to have confidence, other than the “time = improvement”.  In football management that rarely is the case.

Pro Manning - it certainly reads that way!

Bit harsh mate. I’m not a fan but that’s next level stuff!

[JAWS]

3 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

Bit harsh mate. I’m not a fan but that’s next level stuff!

I thought fevs was talking about Sir Steve then! 

[Bazooka Joe]

22 hours ago, hinsleburg said:

I'm not a big stats guy …

Bit like @Davefevs !

 

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, JAWS said:

I thought fevs was talking about Sir Steve then! 

I don’t hate SL, I just don’t like the way he runs this football club overall.  I hope he has a long life.  There are some bits I’m grateful for what he’s done.

3 minutes ago, Bazooka Joe said:

Bit like @Davefevs !

 

I’m 6’1 1/2”, like a spreadsheet and can ping a viz on OTIB with either hand.

[JAWS]

Just now, Davefevs said:

I don’t hate SL, I just don’t like the way he runs this football club overall.  I hope he has a long life.  There are some bits I’m grateful for what he’s done.

I hate him, and I know hate is a strong word but I really do 

[redsquirrel]

50 minutes ago, JAWS said:

I hate him, and I know hate is a strong word but I really do 

i dont but the wally thats weaseled his way in to be third on the ladder... well,thats different gravy

[JAWS]

36 minutes ago, redsquirrel said:

i dont but the wally thats weaseled his way in to be third on the ladder... well,thats different gravy

[BCFC31]

On 03/10/2024 at 11:38, Mikjizzle said:

Long time lurker but I've been compelled to finally post. I'm sure similar posts have been done before so apologies if going over old ground. 

Anyway I've been astonished by the negativity on here by the majority of posters.

Firstly,  I liked Pearson and thought he built some really good foundations and I was annoyed when he got sacked. I also think the communication from the club around it all was poor. But after talking to someone I know who works in first team football (at championship level), I was reassured that a more forward thinking manager made sense to keep up with the direction football is heading. This person had also worked with Pearson and liked him but he told me he thought Pearson had taken as far as he could and thinks City need a technical coach to push us on to the next level and overachieve against teams with a higher wage bill. 

I can't understand what the hatred is for Manning and the way we play. As much as I liked Pearson, the football was generally terrible and we lumped it around most of the time - occasionally we played entertaining counter attacking football but we were unbelievably inconsistent. I think the players did care and they battled, which resonated with everyone (although I think the same is true of players under Manning but he is perhaps asking them to be more conservative/efficient at times with their energy). I'm not convinced Pearson was the man to push us on to the next level as much as what he did at the club was important. 

The football under Manning to me has come on leaps and bounds. I've never seen a Bristol City team dominate teams on the ball in the Championship like we do under Manning this season & we create more clear chances this season then we have for years. I appreciate that some people think it's boring but you can't argue that playing that way doesn't work at Championship level. Nearly all of the teams that have success in football at the moment tend to dominate possession in general and/or play a high press. So, I don't understand why people are against this trend or can't see that we have improved in these areas. 

I've seen a lot of comments about people wanting 90 minutes performances but that's not realistic under any manager for Bristol City in a competitive league. A 90 minute performance to me will likely include periods of the game where you are under pressure - it's about withstanding that pressure and turning the momentum back into your favour. I've also recently seen comments about our squad being too big, which doesn't make sense to me - we have seen how injuries have impacted us in the last few seasons and for the first time we probably have enough depth to deal with it. 

It feels like people cannot see past some of the comments that were made after Pearson got sacked but those aren't Manning's fault. There also seems to be a weird hangover from Lee Johnson with people thinking any other young technical type coach is exactly the same as LJ and can't be successful just because they use coaching language in interviews and haven't got vast amounts of experience in management - but loads of young coaches with similar experience to Manning are hugely successful. It also genuinely feels like people want Manning to fail because of these factors. 

Not sure what the purpose of my post is other than to get it off my chest and to encourage people to consider how much we have developed this season in terms of possession, chances created and patterns of play. I think we are still trying to find a balance between attack and defence.  

Ultimately, it's a results business and we need better results, which I hope will come if we keep doing what we are doing - and I think the signs are encouraging, apart from a couple of matches, where we were punished. But it's still early in the season and I think worth noting that I still wouldn't say we have a top 6 squad (regardless of some flippant comments from Tinnion). So, I don't understand where the negativity comes from or why there is a lack of acknowledgement for how much the team has developed, even if you are annoyed about the results, the club and the way Pearson was treated.

I'm desperate for City to have a good season and compete for promotion and I'm fed up of mid table mediocrity. I think based on current trends in football and the way we are looking to develop Manning gives us a reasonable chance of that. And if not Manning then someone else similar on paper. Carlos Corberan is a similar obsessive, technical coach and he's overachieving with West Brom- same can be said for McKenna last season, so it can be done. 

I'm aware that this post may be met with me being accused of being some sort of Bristol Sport bot/employee but so be it. 

What a waste of a post

[italian dave]

21 hours ago, Mikjizzle said:

yeah well that's where we differ. I think we do both well. We played the transition really well against Swansea second half (plan B). And we have had some really good games in possession at home this season (Plan A). I just think we need to be a bit more consistent and more clinical but the signs are very promising to me - although if the results don't follow soon I will be disappointed. 

I think people are also being a bit dismissive of how hard it is to break teams down if they sit deep and do it well - that naturally means you will have a lot of the ball. I also think we do play a high press? We pressed Sheff W high from what I could see. 

Agree. At half time on Wednesday I felt that we were doing much better than we’ve managed most of the past 10 years or so against a team that’s come to shut up shop. We did find ways through, we just didn’t take the chances we created.

Why we then resorted to knocking long hopeful balls forward second half is beyond me! 

[TDarwall]

1 hour ago, Silvio Dante said:

Bit harsh mate. I’m not a fan but that’s next level stuff!

Fevs is showing his true self!

[Davefevs]

13 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Why we then resorted to knocking long hopeful balls forward second half is beyond me! 

Because the Wednesday manager rescued at h-t and our head/coach failed to notice!  

[Gol]

9 hours ago, Mikjizzle said:

Tanner, Knight and Mehmetti have improved I’d say. Tanner by quite a lot. 
 

not sure how relevant the point about academy is as seems the current batch of u21s aren’t all that. Think some of the 18/19 year olds could be good but a way off from championship football right now. I would rather have first team depth - the majority of our academy players traditionally haven’t broken into being first team regulars until early to mid 20’s.
 

completely disagree that we have massively regressed at the back. We had 2 terrible games but beyond that our defensive record is still pretty good under manning. I think we are finding our feet this season in terms of balance between attack and defence but it’s a risk that’s worth it. 

i would quite like to see him change more stuff in game. When you listen to him he’s all about players problem solving in game. So he’s wanting to coach the players to deal with the tactical changes that happen from opponents in game and make the right adjustments- whether that works, I don’t know but I don’t think it’s a lack of awareness or stubbornness. I think he thinks he’s given the players all the information required to make in game decisions to deal with different phases and tactics that unfold.
 

It’s certainly drastically different to what Pearson was and my view is that the pay off could be big but takes time - the signs and progression are very promising to my eye. 
 

That probably makes me seem more pro manning than I actually am. I’m glass half full and I want it to work and on paper it makes sense right now. But the reason I posted is because I’m amazed by how negative people are about manning compared to Pearson. 

Tanner how? Under Pearson he was solid defensively with not much going forward. With the exception of his wonder goal he’s still the same.

mehmetti is still a 1 good game in 5 so again how? 

knight has looked a lot less effective this season than last so again how?

so the youth team which got promoted and got the furthest we have in the FA youth cup is of poor quality? Not buying that. The difference was Pearson gave players a chance Manning has not

when pearson left we had the 4th best defence with the best record at set pieces. We now have the 4th worst and are the second worst record with set pieces. Tell me how that is not a massive regression?

I accept the more attacking a side is, the more likely we are to concede but we are not scoring more to compensate the decrease in our defensive capability. 

I agree with you we have yet to find the right balance between both but again Manning has had a year and a lot of money given to him to find this and he has not. I do hope he can find it soon but I am not convinced he will.

All managers talk  about individual players responsibility in matches the difference it they will also tactically change things if they are not working or make subs to change the game.
 

The comment about giving them all the information they need is absolute crap unless he can predict the future how does he know how they will react? Its just stubborness and inflexibility.
 

Look at McKenna at Ipswich away last season wasn't working so made 4 subs and won the game. Manning to my knowledge has only done that once with us and that was the oxford game, where at half time he reverted to the team he should have started with!

Like I said people liked Pearson because he kept us up when traditionally we get relegated. We knew he needed to reduce the wage bill and he did, he gave accademy kids a chance and improved them beyond measure. And most importantly there was a clear plan that we could all see and get behind.

His sacking was farcical and as were the reasons given and have placed a lot of pressure on manning. Remember according to them we had a top 6 squad who where not being coached correctly and needed a coach on the grass. 

Manning was that coach and has not delivered any substantial improvement.

He does not enjoy the media side of the job (which I do mot blame him, I could not do it) but it makes him come across standoffish at a time when we needed someone who could bring us all together. His comments wednesday night complaining about the fans will also do him no favours

 

[italian dave]

1 hour ago, BCFC31 said:

What a waste of a post

Self awareness is always a good thing.

Seriously, I thought @Mikjizzle s OP was one of the best posts of recent weeks.

You don’t have to agree with it, but it was well thought out, presented a perfectly reasoned argument and - unusually - prompted some of the better and more sensible discussion, at least for the first page. 

[italian dave]

On 04/10/2024 at 10:15, Maesknoll Red said:

I’ve witnessed the ups and downs since the mid 60’s (although I have very little recollection of the 60’s as I was a young child), the last few years have been pretty dull and uninspiring, the usual pre-season hype, hope and buzz soon fades into mid table dullness, with a very occasional blip of hope as we get towards the playoffs, before slipping back.  

Likewise an odd spell of nervousness as we slip below mid-table and the dreaded relegation word rears its head for a week or two, until once again, either our results or those of others see us back in that stake, dull, mid-table zone.

Yes, numbers are up currently, how long do fans pay good money to be bored and frustrated, I’d be interested to see the stats on season ticket renewal v new holders.

I can definitely remember many season where the football was more exiting than it has been the last 3 or 4 years.

Thats being a bit selective though, isn’t it?

I’ve been watching since the 60s too. And, sure, there have been times when the football’s been more exciting than it is now. But there have also been plenty of times when it’s been a whole lot worse than it is now.

I’ve enjoyed our football this season on the whole - although Blackburn is the only one I’ve missed!!

And in terms of season tickets and attendances:  I am pretty sure there’s more to it than just the quality of the football, but at the end of the day the numbers speak for themselves. 

[Bazooka Joe]

4 hours ago, JAWS said:

I hate him, and I know hate is a strong word but I really do 

Perfectly understandable.

 

When Mark Ashton was here, the hatred was so bad I heard fans talking about going to watch City at Ashton Hate.

[One Team]

4 minutes ago, Bazooka Joe said:

Perfectly understandable.

 

When Mark Ashton was here, the hatred was so bad I heard fans talking about going to watch City at Ashton Hate.

True, although I’d say hands down the most toxic atmosphere I’ve ever witnessed was end of the Pulis era. 

[Numero Uno]

17 hours ago, cheese said:

We had 27 touches in the opposition box.

27 touches resulting in two chances for Vyner and Mehmeti in 97 minutes. Their keeper had a piss easy night bar one good save (a header Mehmeti would have buried if the cross wasn’t slightly behind him tbf), that’s the concern and makes the stats pretty meaningless.

[REDOXO]

On 03/10/2024 at 10:22, ralphindevon said:

I said I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with the post, didn’t mention Bristol Sport.

I genuinely wanted to know why we get these one time posters making very similar long posts. Is it regular posters setting up a new account? Is it family of the players or management? Is it Brian or Jon!

Or is it just coincidence and there are posters who read this forum for years without contributing, then all of sudden post very long detailed posts which are similar to the last person that did it? 

I genuinely don’t know! 

Exactly. Long time lurker/Watcher is a red flag and they all say the same thing. Strange init? 

[Mike Hunt-Hertz]

Just now, REDOXO said:

Exactly. Long time lurker/Watcher is a red flag and they all say the same thing. Strange init? 

These lurkers always seem to have their tongues lodged up the Lansdowns' collective crevice.

[Numero Uno]

4 hours ago, italian dave said:

Why we then resorted to knocking long hopeful balls forward second half is beyond me! 

Because their manager made an obvious change at half time that we didn’t counter. He pressed our back four and the promising play of the first 45 went to shit.

Liam has got to learn to make adjustments that positively change the flow of the game. His adjustments Wednesday made things even worse!! Championship managers apart from ours don’t stand there and allow a shit show to continue when they have a 15 minute break to DO SOMETHING!!

Edited October 5 by Numero Uno

[REDOXO]

1 minute ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said:

These lurkers always seem to have their tongues lodged up the Lansdowns' collective crevice.

I would have put it slightly differently but a collective crevice is pretty good! 

[JAWS]

1 hour ago, Bazooka Joe said:

Perfectly understandable.

 

When Mark Ashton was here, the hatred was so bad I heard fans talking about going to watch City at Ashton Hate.

Sad isn't it. The hierarchy have shown a totally disrespect & contempt for the fans over the years. It sucks

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

Because their manager made an obvious change at half time that we didn’t counter. He pressed our back four and the promising play of the first 45 went to shit.

Liam has got to learn to make adjustments that positively change the flow of the game. His adjustments Wednesday made things even worse!! Championship managers apart from ours don’t stand there and allow a shit show to continue when they have a 15 minute break to DO SOMETHING!!

Aye!

[Ska Junkie]

14 hours ago, Severn Beach Pigeon said:

Someone's pissy 

I wasn't being "look at me", just expressed an opinion that the joke was extremely tired and overused and has been for years.

No offense taken though, have a good weekend.

 

Not pissy whatsoever, just enjoying putting a pedantic prat in his place. Grow up ffs and just go with it on here rather than moaning and you might actually quite enjoy it.

I'd like to know how you ascertain that I'm pro Pearson and anti Manning though? FWIW, I'm neither.

We're all City after all.

Edited October 5 by Ska Junkie

[Barrs Court Red]

Just now, Ska Junkie said:

We're all City or Bristol Sport employees after all.

[italian dave]

5 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Because the Wednesday manager rescued at h-t and our head/coach failed to notice!  

Yeah, I know Wednesday changed it: whether LM noticed or not I don’t know, but what I can’t get my head round is why we responded the way we did. We’ve played sides who have done much the same, we’ve changed how we play, but so far this season we haven’t just resorted to long aimless punts. I know people knock ‘tippy tappy’ stuff, but personally I’d rather we’d have stayed patient and stayed trying to work our way through. 

[italian dave]

1 hour ago, Numero Uno said:

Because their manager made an obvious change at half time that we didn’t counter. He pressed our back four and the promising play of the first 45 went to shit.

Liam has got to learn to make adjustments that positively change the flow of the game. His adjustments Wednesday made things even worse!! Championship managers apart from ours don’t stand there and allow a shit show to continue when they have a 15 minute break to DO SOMETHING!!

Yes, take that point…but as my post above in response to Dave, I’m just puzzled why we resorted to what we did. I can’t believe that was LM instructions, it’s counter to his usual style. That’s all. 

[Davefevs]

19 minutes ago, italian dave said:

Yeah, I know Wednesday changed it: whether LM noticed or not I don’t know, but what I can’t get my head round is why we responded the way we did. We’ve played sides who have done much the same, we’ve changed how we play, but so far this season we haven’t just resorted to long aimless punts. I know people knock ‘tippy tappy’ stuff, but personally I’d rather we’d have stayed patient and stayed trying to work our way through. 

The problem was there was no way through using the same method as first half…hence why Pring gets closed down he only has two options….pass back to McNally or O’Leary to boot it long, or for Pring himself to boot it long.

It isn’t about staying patient, they (Wednesday) know your next move.  The passing options Pring had first half, are no longer there.  You just end up ceding possession 40 yards closer to your goal if you do that, whether that’s forcing a pass that isn’t there, or dribbling into congestion.

Other teams will drop their DM in, split their CBs and push their FBs forward like WBs to change the shape of their attack.

Edited October 5 by Davefevs

[Severn Beach Pigeon]

23 minutes ago, Ska Junkie said:

Not pissy whatsoever, just enjoying putting a pedantic prat in his place. Grow up ffs and just go with it on here rather than moaning and you might actually quite enjoy it.

I'd like to know how you ascertain that I'm pro Pearson and anti Manning though? FWIW, I'm neither.

We're all City after all.

You're reading an awful lot of things that weren't said.

I haven't made any statement at all about you being pro-Pearson or anti-Manning, in fact I haven't mentioned either in this whatsoever.

Take a second to breathe and cut out the personal attacks.

All I said was that your 'joke' (being generous) is tired and worn out, having been used literally thousands of times on here before (including once in this very thread but with Brian rather than Liam).

That's it, it's a tedious joke that also dismissing what the OP put- whether you agree with it or not- and I think it also discourages others from sharing their thoughts if they aren't familiar with what it's like on here.

That's all it was, I didn't find your joke funny and said so. With all due respect, you've completely overreacted to that.

 

Anyway, have a good weekend mate.

[Ska Junkie]

14 minutes ago, Severn Beach Pigeon said:

You're reading an awful lot of things that weren't said.

I haven't made any statement at all about you being pro-Pearson or anti-Manning, in fact I haven't mentioned either in this whatsoever.

Take a second to breathe and cut out the personal attacks.

All I said was that your 'joke' (being generous) is tired and worn out, having been used literally thousands of times on here before (including once in this very thread but with Brian rather than Liam).

That's it, it's a tedious joke that also dismissing what the OP put- whether you agree with it or not- and I think it also discourages others from sharing their thoughts if they aren't familiar with what it's like on here.

That's all it was, I didn't find your joke funny and said so. With all due respect, you've completely overreacted to that.

 

Anyway, have a good weekend mate.

I'm reading nothing at all apart from being quoted in a 'pro Pearson' post and don't find the odd humorous comment 'tired or worn out' and won't change because a jumped up merchant calls me out as I'm far too old to care.

As for 'over reaction', it wasn't me that called someone out for trying to lighten the mood, it was some prat on here, can't remember nor care who.

After 50 years following this club, I answer to nobody on here, apart from maybe Fevs and Phantom who I respect immensely. You, 'MATE' are at the other end of the scale. Please put me on ignore and I will do the same reciprocally.

Enjoy your weekend.

[mozo]

I'd be interested to know what the vibes are at Coventry.

They have fewer points than us and collapsed to lose at home to lowly Sheffield Wednesday today.

[Davefevs]

22 minutes ago, mozo said:

I'd be interested to know what the vibes are at Coventry.

They have fewer points than us and collapsed to lose at home to lowly Sheffield Wednesday today.

Robins probably under pressure for first time in a very long time.

[REDOXO]

Can I have the last word on something!!?  

[Robbored]

27 minutes ago, mozo said:

I'd be interested to know what the vibes are at Coventry.

They have fewer points than us and collapsed to lose at home to lowly Sheffield Wednesday today.

Mozo - all football are pretty much the same and the Coventry forum will be exactly the same as every other forum who’s team is experiencing a poor run of results.

 

[The Original OTIB]

34 minutes ago, mozo said:

I'd be interested to know what the vibes are at Coventry.

They have fewer points than us and collapsed to lose at home to lowly Sheffield Wednesday today.

They are not lowly now.

[BigTone]

5 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Can I have the last word on something!!?  

No, that's my Wife's purpose in life.

Edited October 5 by BigTone